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And just to add something to the debate and localise it a little... look at all the adds Wakedev run for Bedford. They all show a picture of a family and point out family friendly features. So aren't these guys breaking the law??
As a single person with no kids, I feel discriminated against!
And just to add something to the debate and localise it a little... look at all the adds Wakedev run for Bedford. They all show a picture of a family and point out family friendly features. So aren't these guys breaking the law??
I haven't seen these ads, so I can't answer this question directly. However, perhaps the pictured group is not a family, but rather a group of people of various ages. However, if they are all white, non-paraplegics wearing Jesus T-shirts, you might have a case.
If the buyer wants to move into a place that is all white, all indian, all polish, all AA, mostly kids, no kids, all wheelchair bound, all southern people, all northern people, all whatever, I see no problem with that. If the buyer asks the question, it should be allowed to be answered. If the agent tries to manipulate the buyer's decision by providing information that was not asked for, then I can see an issue. Sometimes laws just go too far.
It's not exactly creating an issue out of nothing Mike. That's a bit harsh.
You misunderstood. I was not referring to your question or basis for it.
I was referring to how prejudice and discrimination can develop from the most unimaginable points.
Prejudice manifests itself in myriad ways, was my basic point.
I support Fair Housing Law, not because I support excessive government intrusion, but because I have witnessed repugnant behavior.
The issues are not "created out of nothing."
The law exists to discourage many actions that are extremely disgusting.
Blockbusting.
Red-lining.
Predatory and profiled lending based on race or ethnicity.
These are not "nothing."
The law exists to discourage many actions that are extremely disgusting.
Blockbusting.
Red-lining.
Predatory and profiled lending based on race or ethnicity.
These are not "nothing."
Can you further explain what "blockbusting" and "red-lining" are?
I do understand that these things became law because people were being hurt, but still, it is silly that someone can't ask for a neighborhood with/without kids (I would imagine there'd be an approximately equal number wanting each choice). I don't see how that can lead to "predatory lending", for example. If someone is going to take advantage of someone based on their race, they're going to be able to tell by looking at them anyway. But yes, I completely understand why you can't mention whether "members of ____ race" live nearby, but as for not even being able to make a suggestions such as "come by in the late afternoon and see how many kids are playing" would in any way be hurtful to anyone, and in fact helpful.
Fair Housing laws protect everyone involved in the housing process-agents, buyers, sellers, renters, etc. There are the obvious reasons of preventing discrimination among the protected classes, in this case families being one of them. Here's another point...they are also in place to protect people from "perceived discrimination." There are unfortunately too many people nowadays that look for a reason to sue. There was just a question on the renting board last week about someone saying their landlord was discriminating against them because they're kicking them out for nonpayment. Hello...you didn't pay your rent! Some people are so quick to claim discrimination, so anything an agent can do to protect themselves, they do.
I see why information about families can be helpful for someone in the home search process. I have kids myself. But we all need to respect that Fair Housing laws are in place for a reason and not blame our real estate or rental agents for following the law and refraining from answering this information or pointing you indirectly to the answer of your question.
And just to add something to the debate and localise it a little... look at all the adds Wakedev run for Bedford. They all show a picture of a family and point out family friendly features. So aren't these guys breaking the law??
As far as advertising goes, you can have a protected class represented in an advertisment as long as you represent other parties of the same class. So in the case of familial status, there's likely a single person/couple or elderly person in their ads somewhere. Where this typically comes into play is with race. You'll likely see many races represented in ads.
Can you further explain what "blockbusting" and "red-lining" are?
I do understand that these things became law because people were being hurt, but still, it is silly that someone can't ask for a neighborhood with/without kids (I would imagine there'd be an approximately equal number wanting each choice). I don't see how that can lead to "predatory lending", for example. If someone is going to take advantage of someone based on their race, they're going to be able to tell by looking at them anyway. But yes, I completely understand why you can't mention whether "members of ____ race" live nearby, but as for not even being able to make a suggestions such as "come by in the late afternoon and see how many kids are playing" would in any way be hurtful to anyone, and in fact helpful.
[SIZE=2]In the Sale and Rental of Housing:[/SIZE][SIZE=2] No one may take any of the following actions based on race, color, national origin, religion, sex, familial status or handicap:[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]Refuse to rent or sell housing[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]Refuse to negotiate for housing[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]Make housing unavailable[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]Deny a dwelling[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]Set different terms, conditions or privileges for sale or rental of a dwelling[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]Provide different housing services or facilities[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]Falsely deny that housing is available for inspection, sale, or rental[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]For profit, persuade owners to sell or rent (blockbusting) or[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]Deny anyone access to or membership in a facility or service (such as a multiple listing service) related to the sale or rental of housing.[/SIZE]
...
[SIZE=2]In Addition: It is illegal for anyone to:[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]Threaten, coerce, intimidate or interfere with anyone exercising a fair housing right or assisting others who exercise that right[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]Advertise or make any statement that indicates a limitation or preference based on race, color, national origin, religion, sex, familial status, or handicap. This prohibition against discriminatory advertising applies to single-family and owner-occupied housing that is otherwise exempt from the Fair Housing Act.[/SIZE]
There it is in a nutshell.
I like to gag every time I see an agent/Realtor advertise a "family friendly neighborhood."
One of the great anecdotes from real estate lectures was the one about the on-site agent who sold a couple on a neighborhood, over the phone.
They came in from out of town, and her face froze when she saw they were black. They hadn't "sounded black" on the phone.
So... She told them the home they had selected was Sold.
Bummed out.... they went home.
A few days later, the phone rings in the sales office, and an inquiry is made about a certain home.
"Oh, yes. It is gorgeous. Sounds like just what you want. The neighborhood? It's great too. And... (whisper) we're keeping it right..."
You guessed it. Same folks.
I understand they got the house for free, and a little walking around money on the side.
Laws are put in place mostly because of truly stupid people who walk (Whoops. "walk." Possible preference for the ambulatory vs. disabled.) among us. More decent and intelligent people have to pick up the tab in their daily lives, because the stupid people are so creative and energetic in their destructiveness.
The kids? "What kind of kids get off the bus?" A horrific question, I think. That agent should spend a weekend in the stocks in the public square, rain, shine, or pigeon droppings.
NOTHING in creation is free from the intolerants' ability to pervert and distort.
What is a family?
Two gay women raising a kid?
Some would say "No," and discriminate.
An unmarried couple with a couple of kids?
How about an interracial unmarried couple?
Or, or that matter, an interracial couple, married, with their own offspring?
How about foster parents?
A single mom with two kids with different dads?
Grandma with her 24 year old grandson with learning disabilities?
At some point all of these are people have been denied equal opportunity, regardless of financial capability to carry their load.
Now, as an agent, if I ignore constraints on "Failing to negotiate..." due to abetting a "...preference based... on familial status..." and mess up a sale by telling someone they will have 12 kids in the house next door, have I harmed the seller?
Maybe. Maybe not. My Broker-in-Charge and I will not find ourselves in court awaiting judgement and praying it goes our way.
Homes, Land, Investment property. Keeping it simple, and dwelling on material facts about the property.
Kids are not Material Facts regarding the property.
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However, if they are all white, non-paraplegics wearing Jesus T-shirts, you might have a case.
