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Old 07-20-2012, 04:21 PM
 
Location: Salem, OR
13,741 posts, read 31,556,293 times
Reputation: 12105

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You need to hire an attorney and forget about the closing attorney. Move on to someone independent. I asked a friend that is a PA agent and she told me in her area that what happened to you (getting the title report at closing) was common. She said the agents look it over and read them, but she said clients only see them at closing, if at all. She said that they just look for judgements and liens. She said she has never forwarded one onto a client and that is standard practice in her area.

I'm a bit floored by those real estate practices, but the process you experienced appears to be the norm out there.
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Old 07-20-2012, 04:27 PM
 
Location: Lexington, SC
4,281 posts, read 10,286,407 times
Reputation: 3700
I think foreclosures can be horror shows. Buyers looking to buy cheap by taking advantage of someone elses problem and paper holders just wanting it gone.

I believe it is to late to stop what is going to happen, but that said, lawyer up ASAP and see if someone can be made to pay you for what might well be your maybe mistake in not paying attention to detail.
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Old 07-20-2012, 04:46 PM
 
Location: Virginia
629 posts, read 1,421,576 times
Reputation: 564
Quote:
Originally Posted by Silverfall View Post
You need to hire an attorney and forget about the closing attorney. Move on to someone independent. I asked a friend that is a PA agent and she told me in her area that what happened to you (getting the title report at closing) was common. She said the agents look it over and read them, but she said clients only see them at closing, if at all. She said that they just look for judgements and liens. She said she has never forwarded one onto a client and that is standard practice in her area.

I'm a bit floored by those real estate practices, but the process you experienced appears to be the norm out there.
Thanks Silver..I appreciate you taking the time to do that. I've spotted many of your posts and value your input. We are going to get an independent lawyer. Geesh..just the thought of suing an attorney makes me want to throw up. This is terrible..on so many levels.

Last edited by ~Pajama mama~; 07-20-2012 at 04:59 PM..
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Old 07-20-2012, 04:50 PM
 
Location: Virginia
629 posts, read 1,421,576 times
Reputation: 564
Quote:
Originally Posted by accufitgolf View Post
I think foreclosures can be horror shows. Buyers looking to buy cheap by taking advantage of someone elses problem and paper holders just wanting it gone.

I believe it is to late to stop what is going to happen, but that said, lawyer up ASAP and see if someone can be made to pay you for what might well be your maybe mistake in not paying attention to detail.
Taking advantage of someone elses problem? Are you kidding me? What a skewed view. Not worthy of any other comment.
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Old 07-20-2012, 05:21 PM
 
Location: Salem, OR
13,741 posts, read 31,556,293 times
Reputation: 12105
Quote:
Originally Posted by ~Pajama mama~ View Post
Thanks Silver..I appreciate you taking the time to do that. I've spotted many of your posts and value your input. We are going to get an independent lawyer. Geesh..just the thought of suing an attorney makes me want to throw up. This is terrible..on so many levels.
Out here buyers get a copy and have 5 business days to review it and approve or disapprove of it. We get them about 10 days into the transaction. I am just stunned that no one really looks over those things out there and buyers don't get a copy until closing. That makes no sense whatsoever. I feel so bad for you.

So the question becomes is who had fiduciary duties to you to be looking over that thing and disclosing what is on it because it appears that the attorney and the agent get them well before you ever did.
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Old 07-20-2012, 05:27 PM
 
Location: El Dorado Hills, CA
3,670 posts, read 7,974,554 times
Reputation: 3748
I always forward prelims to the buyer immediately upon receiving them. I read it closely and ask my clients to read it closely. Sometimes minor errors (like an HOA lien that was cleared) show up that title can correct pretty quickly. But it's not easy to interpret prelims and there are often items that refer to other documents that aren't included with the report.

If you hired a lawyer to represent you, that lawyer apparantly missed something (if it's clear in the prelim).
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Old 07-21-2012, 09:53 AM
 
2,613 posts, read 4,103,045 times
Reputation: 1869
Quote:
Originally Posted by Silverfall View Post
You need to hire an attorney and forget about the closing attorney. Move on to someone independent. I asked a friend that is a PA agent and she told me in her area that what happened to you (getting the title report at closing) was common. She said the agents look it over and read them, but she said clients only see them at closing, if at all. She said that they just look for judgements and liens. She said she has never forwarded one onto a client and that is standard practice in her area.

I'm a bit floored by those real estate practices, but the process you experienced appears to be the norm out there.
You are correct. I bought a property in PA and didn't see the title (title co was same as my attorney) until signing day. It wasn't specifically pointed out to me that there were any issues. The attorney said he read it, my Realtor read it, and the bank read it and it's fine.

I did ask the seller's agent about easements and who was responsible for what during the closing process though (there is a city owned sewer line that passes my and my neighbor's property line and a retention pond behind my property).

I guess they could have lied, but I trusted my attorney 100%.
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Old 07-21-2012, 10:11 AM
 
936 posts, read 1,748,383 times
Reputation: 934
In our area the title committment paperwork would be available maybe within the first week after singing the sales contract- well in advance of the closing. The survey would have been ordered right away too. Did you get your survey before closing? Unless a different type of survey was ordered, those easements should have appeared on the survey you got prior to closing. Typically you get what is known as an ALTA survey which would show those easements.

With such massive easements like you have on the survey you displayed I would have thought that even the title company people would have raised the issue at closing. I'm guessing that if your laws are similar that all sorts of documents would have been recorded against your property in order to facilitate this taking. The title company might even have charge more money if their examiner had to interprate what was going on with your property.

There are so many procedures in place to prevent something like this to happen without your knowledge. It's almost as if though all the parties were working together to hide this. Your attorney has to be totally incompetent or corrupt to let something like this slide by without your knowledge.
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Old 07-21-2012, 10:39 AM
 
2,287 posts, read 2,492,870 times
Reputation: 6999
What happened to you makes me sick, I feel so bad for your family. And sorry you had peeps jump on you here. Not everyone knows the ins & outs of real estate, and trust who they hire to look out for these types of things. I wouldnt have known to do any different than you did. Shame on everyone involved that knew, but the biggest "shame on them" goes to the bank imo. They sure made out, didnt they? Glad you're getting a lawyer, and I'd think your lender should also, if they didnt know about it. Sending you good thoughts, and please keep us updated.
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Old 07-21-2012, 12:03 PM
 
Location: Salem, OR
13,741 posts, read 31,556,293 times
Reputation: 12105
Quote:
Originally Posted by blazerj View Post
You are correct. I bought a property in PA and didn't see the title (title co was same as my attorney) until signing day. It wasn't specifically pointed out to me that there were any issues. The attorney said he read it, my Realtor read it, and the bank read it and it's fine.

I did ask the seller's agent about easements and who was responsible for what during the closing process though (there is a city owned sewer line that passes my and my neighbor's property line and a retention pond behind my property).

I guess they could have lied, but I trusted my attorney 100%.
Most people trust their attorney 100%. It is why you hire them. I think the problem in this case is that everything was properly recorded so "it was fine" but it wasn't really fine because what the OP was looking at wasn't what it was going to become. Thankfully you knew to ask about easements.
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