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That is your nugget of truth, the only one really. What can I say that MiamiRob hasn't already said. You should have just left your first post at that.
In addition, mortgage brokers or bankers trying to originate your mortgage are not looking out for you. Always read anything you sign. Realtor forms are readily available on the internet so familiarize yourself with them. An MLS search can also be done for free through many brokerage websites.
Also a helpful tip: if a broker's site lets you search MLS listings, but upon trying to view the full page requires an email, put in a bogus one and it will let you through.
Mr. Hoffman, if it takes the OP five years to find the right home then so be it. That is what he requires. Mr. Rob has stated he doesn't waste time with people who aren't 'ready to buy'. If they know what they want and are ready to buy, what do they need you for that's worth thousands in commission dollars?
Buying a home is one of the largest purchases a person/couple makes in a lifetime. This is people's life savings you're talking about. Due diligence could save them months in after tax salary by waiting for a deal.
To the OP, find an blank Offer To Purchase contract for your state and submit an offer yourself. Especially if its bank owned. Their broker will be more inclined to suggest they accept the offer because, after all, their commission doubles. (This is assuming you are not bound by a brokerage agreement, which they will try to come after you for their slice of commission. B/c they're looking out for you!!)
PS You still have not provided any indication of falsehood in my statements, Mr. Hoffman.
Well.. lets get this conversation back on track shall we??
You know if something doesn't feel right, then it probably isn't. It is better to question everything and be satisfied knowing you've done all you can if something goes wrong then to think you could have done more.
Real estate brokers = think of a used car salesman, now replace the word car with house.
Read all of your paper work. If they don't want to give it to you demand they do, they cannot keep these things from you. Don't sign anything w/o reading it.
If you're not worth their time, they're not worth your money.
Read all of your paper work. If they don't want to give it to you demand they do, they cannot keep these things from you. Don't sign anything w/o reading it.
Well put. Remember, a broker works for you. If anything is of concern do not hesitate to contact their broker in charge or the RE board with questions.
Also, stick to your guns. There are many ways to convince people to move on price, especially if they are worn out from the home buying process. They want your money and you have to buy (or sell) for them to get it.
I'm still in the midst of trying to buy my first home and the process has been discouraging but not really for the reasons a lot of first time buyers say like that it took a long time to find a property or that there was so much paperwork or so many lending issues and guidelines etc. All of the stress and time, I was prepared for.
What's been bugging me is that throughout this process, no matter which real estate-related professionals I've been dealing with, mostly agents and lawyers, I feel like I've been treated like I don't know what I want and don't know anything about real estate just because I'm a first time buyer so I should just sit there and let everyone else handle everything and make decisions for me.
And whenever I try to be involved in the finer details of the process and ask to see certain documents or about certain laws they allude to while talking about my situation or whatever else that's relevant to me, they all give me this you don't need to worry about it attitude and there's this resistance to just giving me access to the things I ask for.
And it's not just one random person, it's everyone I've been dealing with throughout this process for the past two years. When I came on this site, one thing I noticed when many first timers are upset about how something went down and want to know what recourse they have against whichever parties, so often, the response given to them is, "Um, it's your responsibility to verify this or ask for that or keep tabs on whatever, not the agent's/lawyer's/broker's. You're the one buying a property".
But after my experiences, I'm starting to wonder, what if a lot of these people were dealing with what I feel like I'm dealing with where they try to stay informed and try to make sure everything is happening the way it should be and try to voice their concerns but the pros handling things just keep steamrolling them with their expertise and experience and assurances that they know what they're doing and they know what you do or don't need to worry about or access or know?
I can imagine that some of them might just get sick of arguing or demanding and just concede and place their trust in these people because maybe that's just what the process is like and I can't think of how angry I'd be if something didn't work out and those very same pros just shrugged and said, "Well, maybe you should have been a little more involved."
And maybe some people can't or are afraid to switch agents and lawyers every time they feel like they're not being heard or kept informed, especially if they're already deep in the middle of a purchase. This can all be overwhelming and it just seems that the people who are supposed to be there for you don't want to be bothered with your concerns if they don't share them, then want to point the finger at you if something iffy happens and you didn't catch it expecting the pros to do what they said they'd do and be your guide.
Is this a common treatment/attitude when it comes to first time homebuyers? Do real estate professionals have a habit of dragging you along rather than leading you, expecting you to trust their years of experience and their abilities and just go with things or devaluing your opinion or your wants because you've never bought a house before?
Or am I just the lucky one? lol
Since I don't know what it is that happened really I don't know who is in the wrong. There are times I have told clients they are worried about something they shouldn't be, but that is only after explaining what ever part of the process has them concerned. What is it that was such an issue? I want to ask also what documents are you asking to see that they aren't providing? I think you have to provide more information before we can try to answer your questions.
You've been trying to buy your first home for over a year and a half? I could see not wanting to answer every question after awhile.
One, I started the process a year and a half ago. We don't have a huge market in this region that falls within my budget so most of that time was spent either waiting for listings to come up, waiting on underwriters, or waiting on the flaky real estate agent that I got rid of after it became a pattern for her to not be in touch with me for two weeks or more at a time.
It's only been within the last few months when we've really been fully active and any of the finer details have had to be asked with this new set of agents and lawyer. One was a property originally with FHA financing that fell through because of some fishy business with the sellers that couldn't be proven because everyone was a bit lax on documenting things so for the second property, I tightened up on that and asked if we could all be sure to have copies of things in writing. No problem.
Second property fell through on financing close to closing when there were some issues with the taxes having been reported almost $3000 less than they actually were due to some county error they never really explained, which put me over the ratio for my lender to approve the loan so for the next property, I tightened up on that and asked that we try to be sure the taxes are accurate. No problem.
So I'm in the middle of things with a third property now.
All of the above takes up time. It's not like it was a year and a half spent seeing 200 homes with me asking silly questions every five seconds like a little kid high on sugar lol
Two, I don't ask a lot of questions. I did a lot of research before I started the process of looking for a home and have been keeping notes and learning more as we go along. The questions I do ask, I don't ask more than once, I don't ask when they're irrelevant, and I don't ask rudely or in an arrogant or challenging way. I just ask.
For example, this property is subject to the right of first refusal. I asked my lawyer if I could see a copy of the bylaws that will explain how the process works as far as how they've outlined the procedures and the timelines and that sort of thing and that if I couldn't see a copy of it, could he explain a couple of things, like how long they have to decide if they're going to waive their right? That sort of thing.
His answer was like, "Don't worry about things like that, trust me, I've been doing this for years, I doubt they won't waive the right." And I try to assert myself, not in a mean way but just saying, "Oh okay, well, can you still explain to me what the process is so I know how things are supposed to go and what to expect?" Then the answer is, "Look, it's your first time buying a home, I understand being nervous, don't worry about." And it's like that for most (not all) things I ask to see or have explained to me.
Even with the process of looking at homes. We'd be touring a listing and I'd say, "Oh, I like this XYZ!" And my agent would say, "Nah, first time buyers usually prefer ABC" and I'd say, "Oh. I really like this though" and he'd say, "Well, this is your first time buying a home. Trust me, I've been doing this for years and buyers prefer ABC" and I'd just say, "Ok".
These may not be the best examples but the point is that I feel like that's been the tone throughout the entire process and again, not just from these specific people. Everyone I approached throughout this process to consider taking me on as a client or just to ask for advice or whatever has had this same attitude of, "This is your first time so you don't know anything, not even what you want, and we'll tell you what you need to know".
So I'm not saying they're being mean or disrespectful and they've really been great otherwise. Just saying I feel like they're sort of in cruise control, if that makes sense, and that anything I say or ask that contradicts the cookie-cutter first time buyer they've been dealing with all these years, they just dismiss or gloss over it and keep moving so I wondered if it's typical or if I just really have bad luck with the people I'm encountering (or maybe it's regional lol).
Maybe it's just that they have a lot of clients and get sick of going over things or maybe they're not used to a client who actually asks to see things or wants to understand things instead of just signing whatever's put in front of them so it catches them off guard and throws off their routine.
It could be any number of things. I just wondered if real estate pros behave differently when their client is someone who already has a few homes under their belt? Do they take their opinions and concerns more seriously? Just curious what everyone's experience has been on both sides.
Location: Mokelumne Hill, CA & El Pescadero, BCS MX.
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Just as agents come in all sizes and shapes, so do buyers and sellers. I've had buyers who wanted me to explain everything in all 59 pages of what has become our standard amount of paperwork and some who merely want me to point where to initial and sign. Successful agents are the kind of folks that listen and respond to the needs of their clients whether they are very needy or completely independent. the difference in personality types is what makes the world go around.
I've no problem with either of them, except that I get a bit nervous about someone blithely nodding acceptance of anything that's put in front of them. The OP sounds to me to be more like the first type than the second, and that's fine, but when I block out time for appointments and find out the client needs to ask the questions or wants the full explanation, I budget for twice as much time to go over the details.
Without trying to categorize buyers, I find that engineering types tend to want the full explanation and of course the explanation will bring on a dozen more questions. Teachers seem to be on the other end of the spectrum. It's all good.
There is always an element of distrust when someone makes money on an event happening, especially distrust of those on commission only. This distrust is normal. If in sales, accept that it comes with the territory. If the buyer, being a bit cautious of the seller is not a bad thing.
The customer is not always right. Some customers are not worth the time they take nor the grief, aggravation, and self doubt they bring along as baggage. Some customers should be fired or at least ignored.
In the Internet age, it does not take "forever" to discover/learn the pitfalls and what to watch out for in most any business. Granted one cannot learn how to do brain surgery on the Internet, but about everything you could want to know about the real estate business is pretty well laid out in this chat forum. The good, the bad, and the ugly.
One cannot spend years and years getting educated, degreed, licensed, etc. and explain it all to a lay person in a few hours. If they can, the time and money they spent learning was wasted. Sometimes one has to put their trust in others. Ala the brain surgeon.
Trust, but verify.
Last edited by accufitgolf; 07-23-2012 at 05:31 PM..
For example, this property is subject to the right of first refusal. I asked my lawyer if I could see a copy of the bylaws that will explain how the process works as far as how they've outlined the procedures and the timelines and that sort of thing and that if I couldn't see a copy of it, could he explain a couple of things, like how long they have to decide if they're going to waive their right? That sort of thing.
His answer was like, "Don't worry about things like that, trust me, I've been doing this for years, I doubt they won't waive the right." And I try to assert myself, not in a mean way but just saying, "Oh okay, well, can you still explain to me what the process is so I know how things are supposed to go and what to expect?" Then the answer is, "Look, it's your first time buying a home, I understand being nervous, don't worry about." And it's like that for most (not all) things I ask to see or have explained to me.
Even with the process of looking at homes. We'd be touring a listing and I'd say, "Oh, I like this XYZ!" And my agent would say, "Nah, first time buyers usually prefer ABC" and I'd say, "Oh. I really like this though" and he'd say, "Well, this is your first time buying a home. Trust me, I've been doing this for years and buyers prefer ABC" and I'd just say, "Ok".
These are both bizarre situations to me.
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