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Old 08-16-2012, 04:55 PM
 
413 posts, read 699,206 times
Reputation: 294

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Bill View Post
And you do? Provide the citations.
I am honestly not going to go through my torts books and provide citations for the most basic of law. You are actually arguing that your client can't go on yelp or angie's list and give bad reviews about you. How about the first Amendment? Please waste your money consulting your lawyer. I am a lawyer who has passed the bar in two states. But quite honestly my 14 year old cousin could tell you the same thing.

 
Old 08-16-2012, 05:17 PM
 
Location: DFW - Coppell / Las Colinas
29,970 posts, read 34,577,096 times
Reputation: 35975
Quote:
Originally Posted by hindukid View Post
I can assure you that that is not economic duress and the seller can not be sued.
If you are an attorney, please identify yourself as one. You may have an opinion but if you're not an attorney I doubt you can Assure anyone of anything legal. That is foolish.
 
Old 08-16-2012, 05:19 PM
 
Location: Pinal County, Arizona
25,107 posts, read 34,383,060 times
Reputation: 4893
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rakin View Post
If you are an attorney, please identify yourself as one. .
There is no requirement to do so. There are several here that are attorneys and have not identified themselves as such inasmuch as, as I stated, there is no requirement to do so.
 
Old 08-16-2012, 05:21 PM
 
Location: Gilbert - Val Vista Lakes
6,069 posts, read 12,682,557 times
Reputation: 3809
Quote:
Originally Posted by hindukid View Post
I am honestly not going to go through my torts books and provide citations for the most basic of law. You are actually arguing that your client can't go on yelp or angie's list and give bad reviews about you. How about the first Amendment? Please waste your money consulting your lawyer. I am a lawyer who has passed the bar in two states. But quite honestly my 14 year old cousin could tell you the same thing.
But you could go in your Restatement of the law 2d, Contracts book and read sections 173 through 177 within a few minutes, without even having to look up a case.

I am not arguing that a client cannot go on the internet and give bad reviews. Sure they can.

I am arguing that a client cannot coerce a listing agent to modify the contract by improperly threatening to cost him money by telling everyone he knows to not use the agent. In that event the agent has no alternative. He loses money if he agrees, and he loses money if he doesn't. A contract made under those circumstances is voidable by the agent. It is economic duress and a violation of good faith and fair dealing.
 
Old 08-16-2012, 05:37 PM
 
413 posts, read 699,206 times
Reputation: 294
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Bill View Post

I am arguing that a client cannot coerce a listing agent to modify the contract by improperly threatening to cost him money by telling everyone he knows to not use the agent. In that event the agent has no alternative. He loses money if he agrees, and he loses money if he doesn't. A contract made under those circumstances is voidable by the agent. It is economic duress and a violation of good faith and fair dealing.
You might have an argument that he can not threaten to defame you but truth is an absolute defense to defamation. If your client states to you that his friends shouldn't hire you because you beat your wife then you probably have a good case. If he states to his friends that they shouldn't hire you because you will keep the entire buyer's agent commission in the event there is no buyer, then you are going to have no case. He is making a truthful statement and not misleading anybody.

I can go to Best Buy and ask to return my 33 day old TV. They can refuse me. If I then threaten to go on yelp and say we should boycott Best Buy because they have a 30 day return policy and other stores have 90 days that is perfectly fine. It would be much different if I stated let me return the TV or else I will start telling everybody that Best Buy hires undocumented illegal immigrant workers.

Your problem is that the buyer and seller have done nothing but tell the truth. You are essentially asking a court to uphold your contract and also prevent them from making truthful statements. Southwest airlines has an advertisement that they have no bag fees and other airlines have fees up to $100. They are attempting to induce customers of United, American and Delta to switch. Do you see those airlines suing Southwest for stating that other airlines charge up to $100 for checked bags?
 
Old 08-16-2012, 05:43 PM
 
413 posts, read 699,206 times
Reputation: 294
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rakin View Post
If you are an attorney, please identify yourself as one. You may have an opinion but if you're not an attorney I doubt you can Assure anyone of anything legal. That is foolish.
I can assure you that you can't murder someone in any state. I can assure you that if you break into their home with a gun and steal their TV it will be a crime. I can assure you that if you state "I think realtors are not worth the cost", you are within your rights as guaranteed by the first amendment. You don't have to be a lawyer to make these statements and the fact that this is not economic duress is about just as obvious.
 
Old 08-16-2012, 06:43 PM
 
Location: DFW - Coppell / Las Colinas
29,970 posts, read 34,577,096 times
Reputation: 35975
Quote:
Originally Posted by hindukid View Post
I can assure you that you can't murder someone in any state.

You don't have to be a lawyer to make these statements and the fact that this is not economic duress is about just as obvious.
Your advice was way beyond Murder is wrong advice. If you're going to give legal advice on a public forum you should identify yourself as an attorney.
 
Old 08-16-2012, 07:36 PM
 
397 posts, read 491,899 times
Reputation: 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Bill View Post
In addition to it being an illegal term, your statement that it "forces the listing agents hand" can only be interpreted as inducing the seller to take some action against the listing agent to "force the listing agents hand".
The paragraph of mine (below) that you are quoting, CAN BE "INTEPRETED" ANOTHER WAY. It forces the listing agents hand to communicate the issue of commission to the sellers. I was not referring to "inducing the seller to take some action against the LA".


Quote:
That is why it is more appropriate to communicate it outside of the contract either as a verbal or email correspondence. However, as agents have clearly stated in this thread, the likelihood of the email being forwarded to the sellers is low. Thus, putting it in the contract forces the listing agents hand. The agent can refuse to present it to their sellers on the basis that the clause is illegal, but if they are wrong, they could be putting their license and reputation in jeopardy...
 
Old 08-16-2012, 07:40 PM
 
397 posts, read 491,899 times
Reputation: 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brandon Hoffman View Post
This thread is so long it must be some sort of trolling record.
You never answered my question. What is a troll?

Sounds derogatory but I don't know how it relates to this thread or the comments I have posted.
 
Old 08-16-2012, 07:57 PM
 
1,726 posts, read 2,276,730 times
Reputation: 3424
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Bill View Post

I am arguing that a client cannot coerce a listing agent to modify the contract by improperly threatening to cost him money by telling everyone he knows to not use the agent. In that event the agent has no alternative. He loses money if he agrees, and he loses money if he doesn't. A contract made under those circumstances is voidable by the agent. It is economic duress and a violation of good faith and fair dealing.
While the argument with interfence has some basis in law and COULD theoretically be litigated, your argument of economic duress is without any basis whatsoever in law.

The law operates the same in most states, but is stated differently and has different tests....I choose Arkansas for you b/c I know that is where you are and if I used Texas you would object....so here is the LAW as it currently sits in Arkansas. This is the latest ruling that the Arkansas supreme court has ruled upon regarding economic duress....I have bolded the relevant portion for you..

Cox v. McLaughlin
315 Ark.228, 867 S.W.2d 460
Ark., 1993

Economic duress is generally recognized as a valid excuse for voiding a contract. See Restatement (Second) of Contracts, Topic 2, Introductory Note at 47374; see also 176. However, the party alleging duress must show more than a reluctance to accept the contract and the possibility of financial embarrassment. Grimshaw, 248 F.2d at 904,see also Rodgers v. Lyon, 256 Ark. 323, 507 S.W.2d 95 (1974). He must show that the duress resulted from the other party's wrongful and oppressive conduct, and not by his own necessity. Id. In addition, he must show that the wrongful conduct deprived him of his own free will and violation. Id.

You can not argue that his threat of bad mouthing you to his friends and the potential (and un-ascertainable) loss of business is duress..as you had several viable alternatives to accepting the deal.

You flat out, 100% plain and simple, have the unmitigated right to say NO - I wont accept it. He has the absolute unmitigated right to call you a jerk and bad mouth you...even cost you business...but he has not removed your free will...You still had a choice...the outcome for you may be financial embarrassment because nobody hires you anymore, but the reality is that he has not FORCED you to do anything...Economic duress is the equivalent of holding a gun to a persons head and demanding he sign a contract...The fear of potential future loss of income will not meet the level of coercion or duress.
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