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Old 01-24-2011, 11:52 AM
 
Location: NW Las Vegas - Lone Mountain
15,756 posts, read 21,091,553 times
Reputation: 2661

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Quote:
Originally Posted by bande1102 View Post
I both have and have served for my nieghborhood's HOA. I think HOAs are completely worthless and, worse, they have very few limits on their power. My thoughts:

1) we have annual inspections that are conducted by the management company that handles the administrative work for the HOA. They are paid by administrative stuff they do/walk-throughs they do. Guess how many homeowners get letters telling them work needs to be done? Virtually all of us. They even write us up for things that are NOT in violation of the convenant. I spend hours every single spring writing letters and quoting bylaws. I once got a letter because they said my bush was trimmed "incorrectly". FWIW, no they couldn't define how to correctly trim a bush. Incidentally, this same year my next-door neighbor had a toilet sitting outside of his house for months. That was lovely.

2) I served on the board. There are 5 members. 3 of them have been best buddies forever. They control the board and the rest of us know it. One happens to be a general contractor. He is great at finding repairs that need to be done and, what a coincidence, would be happy to do them for you.

3) The HOA passes the buck on the things that really matter. Neighbor has cats? Call the animal warden. Cars parked in the cul-de-sac where it is specifically prohibited? Call the fire department. Noise? Call the police. No matter what the problem, the HOA doesn't deal with it. This is despite the fact that there are bylaws and fines associated with these issues. The only fines I've ever seen the HOA levy are those associated with nonpayment of HOA fees or failure to complete required maintenance. Along those lines, I've seen them target specific families by writing up repair after repair after repair. All the while ignoring others. Inconsistencies abound.

4) Stupid fees. This winter they raised our fees and then used a portion of the proceeds as a prize for the best-decorated Christmas house. Give me a break.

God as my witness, I will never live in an HOA-controlled community ever again.
This is the standard problem with democracy. People sit and b*tch and don't do anything.

Organize the revolution and throw the bums out. If you can't it tends to indicate that the majority like it the way it is....

There is nothing wrong with HOAs - it is how they are run and managed by the members.
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Old 01-24-2011, 02:20 PM
 
1,393 posts, read 1,489,601 times
Reputation: 1284
Quote:
Originally Posted by olecapt View Post
This is the standard problem with democracy. People sit and b*tch and don't do anything.

Organize the revolution and throw the bums out. If you can't it tends to indicate that the majority like it the way it is....

There is nothing wrong with HOAs - it is how they are run and managed by the members.
People that don't live in them can only talk about theory or sell HOA-burdened properties to others.

HOAs are not "democratic" in any sense of the word. The purpose of using a corporation to govern is to eliminate democracy, accountability, and any form of constitutional restraint that a legitimate government might have. "Majority rule" is not rule of reason, substance, or anything else. Typically, rule is not even by a majority but rather by a tyrannical minority known as "board members" or their agents.

HOA burdened-properties are a defective consumer real estate product.
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Old 01-24-2011, 02:34 PM
 
Location: Washington DC
487 posts, read 731,580 times
Reputation: 492
Quote:
Originally Posted by olecapt View Post
This is the standard problem with democracy. People sit and b*tch and don't do anything.

Organize the revolution and throw the bums out. If you can't it tends to indicate that the majority like it the way it is....

There is nothing wrong with HOAs - it is how they are run and managed by the members.

And we have a winner!
The Silliest Statement of the Thread.
I humbly award this distinction without fear of successful contradiction.
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Old 01-24-2011, 04:27 PM
 
Location: NW Las Vegas - Lone Mountain
15,756 posts, read 21,091,553 times
Reputation: 2661
Quote:
Originally Posted by IC_deLight View Post
People that don't live in them can only talk about theory or sell HOA-burdened properties to others.

HOAs are not "democratic" in any sense of the word. The purpose of using a corporation to govern is to eliminate democracy, accountability, and any form of constitutional restraint that a legitimate government might have. "Majority rule" is not rule of reason, substance, or anything else. Typically, rule is not even by a majority but rather by a tyrannical minority known as "board members" or their agents.

HOA burdened-properties are a defective consumer real estate product.
With some obvious and strange exceptions HOAs are quite contractural and democratic and that democratic process is protected by statute.

In many HOAs the primary problem is a lack of participation. The "controlling" ones are mostly anecdotes...and are noted because they are unusual.
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Old 01-24-2011, 07:14 PM
 
1,393 posts, read 1,489,601 times
Reputation: 1284
Quote:
Originally Posted by olecapt View Post
With some obvious and strange exceptions HOAs are quite contractural and democratic and that democratic process is protected by statute.

In many HOAs the primary problem is a lack of participation. The "controlling" ones are mostly anecdotes...and are noted because they are unusual.

The statements are myths by someone that makes a living selling HOA-burdened property. The problems are not isolated instances or mere anecdotes. The problems are ubiquitous and synonymous with the existence of the HOA corporation to begin with.


olecapt - you have previously stated:
"I, by the way, won't live in an HOA until I get so old I need assistance to live." .... and "But I still think HOAs are OK - just not for me."

see Why I HATE HOA's!!!

In other words, you wouldn't buy the HOA product you are selling to others.
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Old 01-24-2011, 07:27 PM
 
Location: NJ
17,579 posts, read 21,221,260 times
Reputation: 15430
I live in an HOA. I have probably given it about 2 minutes of thought since buying and that is when I wrote a check for the yearly dues.
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Old 01-24-2011, 10:37 PM
 
Location: NW Las Vegas - Lone Mountain
15,756 posts, read 21,091,553 times
Reputation: 2661
Quote:
Originally Posted by IC_deLight View Post
The statements are myths by someone that makes a living selling HOA-burdened property. The problems are not isolated instances or mere anecdotes. The problems are ubiquitous and synonymous with the existence of the HOA corporation to begin with.
olecapt - you have previously stated:
"I, by the way, won't live in an HOA until I get so old I need assistance to live." .... and "But I still think HOAs are OK - just not for me."

see Why I HATE HOA's!!!

In other words, you wouldn't buy the HOA product you are selling to others.
Please...I am an amateur radio operator with a 60 foot antenna.

People with particular interest may also find many HOAs unfriendly.

Nothing wrong with the concept. Just that as executed some people will not find it friendly.

And yes I have sold many homes in HOAs...particlularly a major mature development. That development is highly democratic with a massive election campaign for the board every year. It manages itself by the way. No management company. And the loyal opposition is always there...keeping the administration honest. Works quite well.
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Old 01-25-2011, 04:33 AM
 
Location: Washington DC
487 posts, read 731,580 times
Reputation: 492
Its a crap-shoot Olecapt
Buying an HOA burdened property.
A new buyer never knows if its one of the Benign HOA's or one of the Toxic HOA's.
And a Homeowner never knows if or when it will shift from Benign to Toxic.
A Benign HOA merely costs you money.
A Toxic HOA can make your home life a living hell.
All it takes is new leadership voted in to totaly change the character of the HOA.
And the HOA can levy fines and special assessments, then Foreclose if you cant pay.
Who in their right mind would voluntarily subject themselves to that risk?
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Old 01-25-2011, 07:59 AM
 
Location: Western NC
5,819 posts, read 5,753,302 times
Reputation: 3916
I also live in an HOA, well managed, meticulously maintened, common sense residents, no off the wall rules, hardly any complaints (except from the usual 1% of suspects that complain if the wind blows).

Many areas of the U.S. such as where we are, and there are wide open spaces, have wide open zoning in the counties, and only within the city limits are there more strict zoning laws. This results in subdivisions, retirement communities, etc. having HOA's or a set of covenants to your deed. It works out well for the HOA's. Folks buying out in the counties need to be told by their Realtors about the reasons for HOA's. We have nothing to gripe about in the mountains unless you built a $400,000 house abutting land owned by the local packing plant. In which case, you didn't do any homework. City zoning laws need to be enforced by the city, HOA's regulate their own vested interests, .... so the folks need to do their due diligence and look before leaping anywhere.
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Old 01-25-2011, 10:29 AM
 
Location: NJ
17,579 posts, read 21,221,260 times
Reputation: 15430
Quote:
Originally Posted by tigger37708 View Post
Its a crap-shoot Olecapt
Buying an HOA burdened property.
A new buyer never knows if its one of the Benign HOA's or one of the Toxic HOA's.
And a Homeowner never knows if or when it will shift from Benign to Toxic.
A Benign HOA merely costs you money.
A Toxic HOA can make your home life a living hell.
All it takes is new leadership voted in to totaly change the character of the HOA.
And the HOA can levy fines and special assessments, then Foreclose if you cant pay.
Who in their right mind would voluntarily subject themselves to that risk?
Apperently a lot of people.
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