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Old 09-06-2015, 01:45 PM
 
Location: Fort Myers, Fl
79 posts, read 113,433 times
Reputation: 85

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Do you really think you actually own your house after the mortgage is over? Think again! You don't! For even long after the house is paid for, the property taxes continue forever. Fall behind on them, and the city/county government will come along, evict you, and order a tax sale to get it's money.

Even then, few people realize the truth. And the truth is; property taxes are not taxes at all! The term "property taxes" is a deceitful mask and a cover up for the real deal. Yes, that is correct; property taxes are actually property rents! Or, to be more precise, property taxes are actually rents of land that are used for public purposes.

In other words, when you buy a house in America, what you are really buying is the permission to rent that house and the parcel of land it sits on. In America, the Government always directly owns every single square inch of the land, from coast to coast, and from border to border. Literally, we are serfs living on the King's land, and the government is our landlord. Especially not to mention the tax collector (oh, pardon me, the rent collector) and the appraiser are both major bureaucracies.

And truthfully in fact, there are only 6 spots in the entire world that I personally know of where homeownership is a reality. And they are; Turks and Caicos, St. Maarten, the Cayman Islands, Saipan, Palau, and Fiji.
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Old 09-06-2015, 01:53 PM
 
106,002 posts, read 107,976,655 times
Reputation: 79589
here in the tristate area the problem is that when most of us bought homes 35-40 years ago those homes were 35k or so out in suffolk county .

so you got a 30k mortgage and got 30 years to pay it off . that mortgage was a huge amount in that day . our rent was only 209.00 dollars .

well today that 30k home is paid off and taxes and utilities are 22k a year .

big deal that paid off mortgage is today . that has done nothing for the affordability factor and many long islanders cannot afford to keep their houses in long island .

we have so many friends that are now relocating since we are all retiring about now .

those paid off home didn't help them out one bit in the end as far as staying in their home .
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Old 09-06-2015, 02:17 PM
 
Location: East of Seattle since 1992, 615' Elevation, Zone 8b - originally from SF Bay Area
44,226 posts, read 80,425,063 times
Reputation: 57140
Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107 View Post
here in the tristate area the problem is that when most of us bought homes 35-40 years ago those homes were 35k or so out in suffolk county .

so you got a 30k mortgage and got 30 years to pay it off . that mortgage was a huge amount in that day . our rent was only 209.00 dollars .

well today that 30k home is paid off and taxes and utilities are 22k a year .

big deal that paid off mortgage is today . that has done nothing for the affordability factor and many long islanders cannot afford to keep their houses in long island .

we have so many friends that are now relocating since we are all retiring about now .

those paid off home didn't help them out one bit in the end as far as staying in their home .
Staying in your home on retirement doesn't seem desirable anyway. In our case, for example, we don't need the 3,000 sf even now, when we retire in 4-5 years we can buy and pay cash for a smaller place in an area with lower property taxes. Even if we did stay and were paid off, the $6,000 annual taxes is not a big deal, that's only $500/month and there is nothing to be rented for even $1,000 in this area.

The government does not own your home unless you fail to pay the taxes. You can also still homestead in Alaska, and a few places in Minnesota and Kansas.
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Old 09-06-2015, 02:19 PM
 
106,002 posts, read 107,976,655 times
Reputation: 79589
i would say there are likely more than 1 million retirees in the tristate area who are going to relocate out of the area because they can't afford to keep that paid off home .

taxes are insane . my son closed on his home in scaresdale ny 2 months ago , taxes are 22k and he had won a rate adjustment , they were 25k .

mortgages taken out 30 or 40 years ago were minuscule amounts more like what a car cost today . the fact they are paid off here means very little in the ability to afford the home when apaid off home should mean the most at retirement .

Last edited by mathjak107; 09-06-2015 at 03:09 PM..
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Old 09-06-2015, 02:21 PM
 
106,002 posts, read 107,976,655 times
Reputation: 79589
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hemlock140 View Post
Staying in your home on retirement doesn't seem desirable anyway. In our case, for example, we don't need the 3,000 sf even now, when we retire in 4-5 years we can buy and pay cash for a smaller place in an area with lower property taxes. Even if we did stay and were paid off, the $6,000 annual taxes is not a big deal, that's only $500/month and there is nothing to be rented for even $1,000 in this area.

The government does not own your home unless you fail to pay the taxes. You can also still homestead in Alaska, and a few places in Minnesota and Kansas.
homes here are way smaller than that . ours was 1800 sq ft . but with some of the highest taxes in the country in our area and the highest utility costs and now insurance costs that 30 year old mortgage is a drop in the bucket .

most of our friends had no intention of leaving but now that they reached the point of retiring the numbers just don't work .

quite a few areas have become overly expensive like ny , nj and ct . so the only recourse is rent or relocate to a more affordable area .

boy if we i were willing to leave our kids and grand kids and go down south we could live like kings .

there are lots of areas in the country one can find affordable homes and living where a paid off house can be golden .

Last edited by mathjak107; 09-06-2015 at 03:10 PM..
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Old 09-06-2015, 04:25 PM
 
Location: Riverside Ca
22,146 posts, read 33,307,018 times
Reputation: 35433
Quote:
Originally Posted by explorerman1 View Post
Do you really think you actually own your house after the mortgage is over? Think again! You don't! For even long after the house is paid for, the property taxes continue forever. Fall behind on them, and the city/county government will come along, evict you, and order a tax sale to get it's money.

Even then, few people realize the truth. And the truth is; property taxes are not taxes at all! The term "property taxes" is a deceitful mask and a cover up for the real deal. Yes, that is correct; property taxes are actually property rents! Or, to be more precise, property taxes are actually rents of land that are used for public purposes.

In other words, when you buy a house in America, what you are really buying is the permission to rent that house and the parcel of land it sits on. In America, the Government always directly owns every single square inch of the land, from coast to coast, and from border to border. Literally, we are serfs living on the King's land, and the government is our landlord. Especially not to mention the tax collector (oh, pardon me, the rent collector) and the appraiser are both major bureaucracies.

And truthfully in fact, there are only 6 spots in the entire world that I personally know of where homeownership is a reality. And they are; Turks and Caicos, St. Maarten, the Cayman Islands, Saipan, Palau, and Fiji.
Ok let's say that you have no property taxes. We just never collected them. You also won't have any infrastructure. You know streets, freeways, water, sewer. You want your kids going to school? How about street lighting? How about flood control? Kids going to community college? Like public utilities like electrical and gas? How about parks or police? House on fire! Need a firefighter? How do you think those things get paid for?

The money that it costs to pave the road going to YOUR house or get to work or shop for food, get the water pipes to deliver water to your house, the sewer line to take your waste away and treat it, the fire fighters or EMTs or PD that shows up in a emergency are all paid by those property taxes. YOU couldn't afford all those services if you got billed individually.
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Old 09-06-2015, 05:23 PM
 
Location: SF Bay & Diamond Head
1,776 posts, read 1,862,111 times
Reputation: 1981
Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107 View Post
just don't work .

quite a few areas have become overly expensive like ny , nj and ct . so the only recourse is rent
Um, landlords don't pay the high real estate taxes?

Last edited by Marka; 09-08-2015 at 01:25 AM..
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Old 09-06-2015, 05:38 PM
jw2
 
2,028 posts, read 3,254,749 times
Reputation: 3386
Quote:
Originally Posted by explorerman1 View Post
Do you really think you actually own your house after the mortgage is over? Think again! You don't! For even long after the house is paid for, the property taxes continue forever. Fall behind on them, and the city/county government will come along, evict you, and order a tax sale to get it's money.

Even then, few people realize the truth. And the truth is; property taxes are not taxes at all! The term "property taxes" is a deceitful mask and a cover up for the real deal. Yes, that is correct; property taxes are actually property rents! Or, to be more precise, property taxes are actually rents of land that are used for public purposes.

In other words, when you buy a house in America, what you are really buying is the permission to rent that house and the parcel of land it sits on. In America, the Government always directly owns every single square inch of the land, from coast to coast, and from border to border. Literally, we are serfs living on the King's land, and the government is our landlord. Especially not to mention the tax collector (oh, pardon me, the rent collector) and the appraiser are both major bureaucracies.

And truthfully in fact, there are only 6 spots in the entire world that I personally know of where homeownership is a reality. And they are; Turks and Caicos, St. Maarten, the Cayman Islands, Saipan, Palau, and Fiji.
How is this different from not paying your vehicle registration fee? At some point, they will tow your fully owned car away and won't release it until you pay all back fees (taxes).

Last edited by jw2; 09-06-2015 at 06:21 PM..
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Old 09-06-2015, 05:51 PM
 
Location: North Carolina
6,081 posts, read 4,566,808 times
Reputation: 10552
Quote:
Originally Posted by Electrician4you View Post
Ok let's say that you have no property taxes. We just never collected them. You also won't have any infrastructure. You know streets, freeways, water, sewer. You want your kids going to school? How about street lighting? How about flood control? Kids going to community college? Like public utilities like electrical and gas? How about parks or police? House on fire! Need a firefighter? How do you think those things get paid for?

The money that it costs to pave the road going to YOUR house or get to work or shop for food, get the water pipes to deliver water to your house, the sewer line to take your waste away and treat it, the fire fighters or EMTs or PD that shows up in a emergency are all paid by those property taxes. YOU couldn't afford all those services if you got billed individually.
All excellent points. Those services do cost money, and the professionals who do them need to be compensated fairly for their services, but unless we're talking about 25,000 square foot mansions on large acreages, $25,000 a year for property taxes (as was quoted here) on a house is beyond excessive and the bounds of what is reasonable.

There are many areas of the country that have property or other taxes nowhere near this extreme and are able to provide services in an effective manner. $25,000 per year for property tax is more than many families make in a year to pay for everything. Heck, starting public school teachers don't make much more than that in a year ($33,000- and that's before taxes).

Last edited by Jowel; 09-06-2015 at 06:11 PM..
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Old 09-06-2015, 05:56 PM
 
106,002 posts, read 107,976,655 times
Reputation: 79589
[quote=honobob;41105877]
Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107 View Post
just don't work .

quite a few areas have become overly expensive like ny , nj and ct . so the only recourse is rent
QUOTE]

Um, landlords don't pay the high real estate taxes?
they do not have the down payment money or poor credit so they can't buy . it takes about 20% down on average here plus closing costs at the least to make buying and renting payments about the same .

in fact we need to put down 25% to have the place we want to buy equal our rent .

one other issue retirees who want to buy are finding is banks can be pretty tough about sources of income when you are retired .

we have multiple 7 figures yet the banks we spoke to in the area said unless i file for social security they can't guarantee the under writers will give us a mortgage .

depending who they sell the mortgages to they have restrictions on acceptable sources of income . they don't like to accept portfolio income streams as income . we will pay cash if we have to but i rather get a mortgage .

they will accept social security , pension and annuity income to see if you qualify but the acceptability of portfolio driven income is vague and varies bank to bank .

so that creates many older renters who can't afford to buy as well .they can come up with the down payment but they can't get a mortgage if their income stream is not acceptable .

word to the wise is get the mortgage and buy the property before you leave your jobs .

Last edited by mathjak107; 09-06-2015 at 06:27 PM..
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