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Why are there HOAs? A big reason is that Towns do not want to use taxpayer money to support the development and maintenance of new housing developments. Towns do not want to pay for building or maintaining development roads, swimming pools, tennis courts, private walking paths, sanitary sewers, street drains. Rezoning at housing densities requested by the developers will simply not be approved unless these elements are part of the development plan.
That being true, then who pays to maintain these things. NOT the Town, county, or state, but the Homeowners. So how does anyone keep track of these needs and expenses? The homeowners have an association of their own residents who volunteer their time for this. A clear need, a clear LOCAL process. If an owner does not do/pay their fair share then they are not following the process for keeping the development running smoothly and are penalized.
Now add to that the aesthetics issue. IMHO this is entirely different and maybe should be handled differently with more oversight. Maybe there should be a disinterested ombudsman at some higher level that evaluates complaints of an HOA going outside of reasonable bounds and does quick, inexpensive evaluations. But nobody wants to live in a shanty town, and long term, as properties get older and generally in need of more maintenance, the HOA can help hold things together.
One reason people are moving to the Triangle is that most existing planned developments are pleasing to the eye. Preston, Lochmere, many of the original PUDs have gorgeous, well kept homes and landscaping. As lot sizes get smaller and smaller, which is happening all over the country, a well planned and managed PUD will continue to be appreciated.
Perfect post. A few of us have tried to explain in shorthand, but I'm sure your comprehensive answer will finally put the issue to rest... or maybe not...
It's starting to feel like trying to have a political debate on FB.
Why are there HOAs? A big reason is that Towns do not want to use taxpayer money to support the development and maintenance of new housing developments. Towns do not want to pay for building or maintaining development roads, swimming pools, tennis courts, private walking paths, sanitary sewers, street drains. Rezoning at housing densities requested by the developers will simply not be approved unless these elements are part of the development plan.
That being true, then who pays to maintain these things. NOT the Town, county, or state, but the Homeowners. So how does anyone keep track of these needs and expenses? The homeowners have an association of their own residents who volunteer their time for this. A clear need, a clear LOCAL process. If an owner does not do/pay their fair share then they are not following the process for keeping the development running smoothly and are penalized.
Now add to that the aesthetics issue. IMHO this is entirely different and maybe should be handled differently with more oversight. Maybe there should be a disinterested ombudsman at some higher level that evaluates complaints of an HOA going outside of reasonable bounds and does quick, inexpensive evaluations. But nobody wants to live in a shanty town, and long term, as properties get older and generally in need of more maintenance, the HOA can help hold things together.
One reason people are moving to the Triangle is that most existing planned developments are pleasing to the eye. Preston, Lochmere, many of the original PUDs have gorgeous, well kept homes and landscaping. As lot sizes get smaller and smaller, which is happening all over the country, a well planned and managed PUD will continue to be appreciated.
Yep. HOAs became prominent not to protect the aesthetics of neighborhoods, but to off load infrastructure costs to homeowners. Once cities and states figured out this boondoggle, HOAs were quickly added to the "requirements" for any new developments. Cities and States love them because homeowners become liable for the costs of maintaining what used to be their responsibility while still paying taxes for services they never receive.
Yep. HOAs became prominent not to protect the aesthetics of neighborhoods, but to off load infrastructure costs to homeowners. Once cities and states figured out this boondoggle, HOAs were quickly added to the "requirements" for any new developments. Cities and States love them because homeowners become liable for the costs of maintaining what used to be their responsibility while still paying taxes for services they never receive.
Maybe so, but would you not agree that taxes tend to be higher, sometimes by a lot, in areas that do not have HOAs? Eg, NY, NJ, MA
we don't even have garages... everyone's trash cans are "out" (usually on the side). never had a racoon get in it.
Never mind raccoons. Try bear proofing your trashcans! In Alaska, our trashcans are equipped with a complicated locking mechanism to keep bears out. Nothing says "Welcome home" like a 250 pound critter snacking on your leftovers
Maybe so, but would you not agree that taxes tend to be higher, sometimes by a lot, in areas that do not have HOAs? Eg, NY, NJ, MA
You're pointing to areas that have a very high COL and very high demand for housing. The rate of taxes in those places has to do with that and not the absence or presence of HOAs.
Also, just because the planned community act was passed in 1999 doesn't mean there were no HOAs prior to that. I'm fairly certain the act was passed as a way to give more oversight of them to the state. Realtors in the area from then can say for sure.
The act doesn't give oversight to the state. When was the last time the "state" took action against an HOA corporation? Almost certainly anyone in law enforcement will proclaim your problem to be a private or civil one which the state won't get involved in.
The act actually mandates HOAs. It was strongly lobbied for by the industry of HOA attorneys and HOA management companies. It even provided for a mechanism to burden non-HOA property with involuntary membership HOAs. The act limits the ability to kill the HOA and it is significantly harder to kill than to create and impose (asymmetry). The act creates all sorts of powers for HOAs by statute even if the declaration provided no such powers for the HOA. To suggest the act was passed to give oversight of HOAs to the state is laughable. The act was passed for the benefit of developers, the vendors feeding off of the involuntary members, and for the benefit of local government - not for the homeowners.
IC_Delight, I know this sin't going to change your mind, but let me take a moment to correct some of your misunderstandings.
Quote:
Originally Posted by IC_deLight
Poor analogy. A tennis court is not a "storm water pond". A tennis court is not mandated by government.
It's actually a very good analogy. Your neighborhood is a collection of homes and features that you and your neighbors are responsible for. I don't expect others to pay for the features only my neighbors enjoy and if my neighborhood didn't exist the sotmrwater treatment wouldn't be needed. That's why the responsibility for it's costs and maintenance remains with the neighborhood
[quote=IC_deLight;43873483]If it was about protecting the environment then "storm water ponds" would be created in existing subdivisions.{/quote]
Stormwater ponds aren;t in older subdivisions because of poor planning at the time. Now that we know they are needed they are required. An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. It is EXTREMELY expensive to go back and retrofit exisitng neighborhoods with stormwater treatment. First problem is there is probably no where to put them. All the space is taken up by homes. Unless of course you are volunteering your home be taken down to make room for the pond. But I doubt that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by IC_deLight
If it is about "protecting the environment" then the cost should be borne by those benefiting from the "protection" not just the subset of subdivisions.
Sorry - but that's not how the Federal Clean Water Act works. The polluter is responsible for cleaning up the pollution they create. The new neighborhood creates increased stormwater runoff and the new neighborhood is required to mitigate that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by IC_deLight
Certainly your excuse is no justification for being subjected to involuntary membership in an organization that spends its entire time threatening, harassing, fining, suing, and foreclosing on its own members while striving to see how much of its members' monies can be shoveled to HOA vendors (management companies, HOA attorneys) for the duration of the "owners' " stay. How much of any of that activity is related to managing storm water? Pretty darn near zero.
No body is making excuses. I'm just giving you reasons why they serve a role in maintaining these ponds. They also serve other purposes. Clearly you've had some bad personal experiences. But the fact that you have had personality conflicts with an HOA is hardly enough reason for the state to through out the whole process. Does your HOA really spend its "entire time" threatening and harassing you? That seems a bit over the top no?
Final Thought:
The maintenance of stormwater treatment systems is only one aspect of why HOAs are needed. But it's an important one. The notion that each individual local government should (or even could) take over thousands and thousands of these systems located on private land has been debated for a long time. It just isn't a feasible solution (and its much more complicated than most people realize). It would be a non-starter in the General Assembly for those trying to make arguments to remove the HOA requirement.
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