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We are very seriously considering buying in a Del Webb community, we visited a sales office this past weekend, and we like the homes.
However, when I asked for a full price list to estimate what it might cost us, they wouldn't provide anything. They just gave us ballpark numbers for a few major upgrades.
1) It's my understanding you pick out a home model, and your major upgrades (e.g. loft, screen porch, fireplace, etc.) and then they want you to sign a contract based on that price. Only then do you pick colors and go through the many other upgrades (e.g. cabinets, hardware, fixtures, countertops, appliances, ceiling fans, exterior finishing, etc.) and the price is revised up. I've bought new construction and resale homes, but I've never bought without having a firm price before we entered into any contract. I assume there's some sort of exit clause with Del Webb if you don't like the second price revision, though I assume they make it at least a little difficult. Am I understanding their process?
2) In addition, I've never bought a home, new or resale, without negotiating a discount. How does that work with Del Webb, or do they (try to) stick to list prices? I understand it would vary by state and region, and maybe there aren't discounts where traffic is keeping crews and cash flow are flowing, but I'd expect some negotiation in developments that are building out slowly.
What you've described is pretty standard here with the large builders. Generally, unless you are talking about an already finished or nearly finished inventory home, they don't negotiate on the price but they will have incentives that apply to design studio type choices. It might be $x of credit toward the purchase or half off the first $15K in design studio selections, maybe a flat amount toward closing costs and more if you use their lending and title companies, that sort of thing. Your agent can flesh all that out for you in advance. Programs change monthly around here.
That doesn't mean that you can't ask for things to be included or thrown in (I would) but that's usually what I see around here. A friend of mine who is a sales rep for a large company has told me that she always has some play so it never hurts to try asking for more than you might expect. Just don't expect there to be much give in a community that is selling well.
The sales person should be able to give you a list of all the options they offer but it will probably be long and confusing. I find its more helpful to ask them to give you a print out of the most commonly selected items, maybe the items in the model, and then ask them for an idea as to the cost of things you want but not found on the list. Around here, the things you are talking about tend to be about 10-15% of the base price plus options (can be much more, of course) so ask the sales office what they have been seeing...it will be as good a guide as any. Many builders also allow buyers and prospective buyers to visit the design studio on an exploratory basis. I'd ask about that.
I understand your frustration, believe me, but this system works well enough and, ultimately, you are in control of the final number.
Last edited by bbronston; 03-29-2017 at 03:02 PM..
My experience in new home construction (none with Del Webb) is that there is very little wiggle room on the base price. The wiggle room comes with options/upgrades.
I expect once you settle on the model and the location you want and sign a letter of intent, they will see you as a serious buyer and the negotiations can begin. Until then, you are a tire kicker.
After going back and forth all week, we're ready to give up on DW. They simply refuse to define exactly what's standard, what the options are, or how much the options cost. Clearly they have that info already compiled. Puzzling.
May be just me, but I can't think of much I'd contract to buy without first knowing the exact price, especially a big ticket item like a house! They've mastered selective listening to avoid straight answers. It's like asking a politician a question, and getting an answer to another question of their choice. Obviously it works for them, they've sold thousands of houses all over the country for decades. Just not for us...
After going back and forth all week, we're ready to give up on DW. They simply refuse to define exactly what's standard, what the options are, or how much the options cost. Clearly they have that info already compiled. Puzzling.
May be just me, but I can't think of much I'd contract to buy without first knowing the exact price, especially a big ticket item like a house! They've mastered selective listening to avoid straight answers. It's like asking a politician a question, and getting an answer to another question of their choice. Obviously it works for them, they've sold thousands of houses all over the country for decades. Just not for us...
We did not have this problem with DW - in all the communities we toured in various states. We were given handouts of floor plans, base prices (often a range due to elevation choices), a list of what each house came with standard, and UPON REQUEST, a list of available upgrades and costs. Lot premiums were a bit elusive.
Our bigger problem with DW/Pulteney was their inflexibility. Their favorite word was "no" every time we asked about a change. Can we remove the desk in the kitchen and just run the granite straight across (which actually would save them a bit of money)? No. Okay, then can we alter the height so we can put a wine fridge under that cabinet? No. Only after closing, which would have meant ripping out and replacing brand new granite. Can we add a sliding glass door instead of that big window? No, only after closing. It was ridiculous.
(We eventually built with Toll, who allowed all requested changes except one. I couldn't get a composite sink because the supplier didn't make one. In retrospect, I should have fought harder.)
We did not have this problem with DW - in all the communities we toured in various states. We were given handouts of floor plans, base prices (often a range due to elevation choices), a list of what each house came with standard, and UPON REQUEST, a list of available upgrades and costs. Lot premiums were a bit elusive.
I hope we have the same experience, but it's not been promising so far. We ask specific questions, and get general, non-specific answers - and repeat. But I'm still asking questions...
We are very seriously considering buying in a Del Webb community, we visited a sales office this past weekend, and we like the homes.
However, when I asked for a full price list to estimate what it might cost us, they wouldn't provide anything. They just gave us ballpark numbers for a few major upgrades.
1) It's my understanding you pick out a home model, and your major upgrades (e.g. loft, screen porch, fireplace, etc.) and then they want you to sign a contract based on that price. Only then do you pick colors and go through the many other upgrades (e.g. cabinets, hardware, fixtures, countertops, appliances, ceiling fans, exterior finishing, etc.) and the price is revised up. I've bought new construction and resale homes, but I've never bought without having a firm price before we entered into any contract. I assume there's some sort of exit clause with Del Webb if you don't like the second price revision, though I assume they make it at least a little difficult. Am I understanding their process?
2) In addition, I've never bought a home, new or resale, without negotiating a discount. How does that work with Del Webb, or do they (try to) stick to list prices? I understand it would vary by state and region, and maybe there aren't discounts where traffic is keeping crews and cash flow are flowing, but I'd expect some negotiation in developments that are building out slowly.
Any insight would be most welcome. Thanks.
I sell new homes. I can easily pull up pricing for all upgrades but cant show you pictures of them since you go to design center. They should be able to do the same.. I can also show pics of all standard carpets, tile, cabinets etc.
I doubt they have any exit clause. All major builders I know dont. Dell Webb is part of Pulte, so I know Pulte doesnt as I have a friend there.
I know we dont negotiate on a build job. We have set incentive for each community. Probably same there.
You may want to contact a realtor to help you. They would be on your side in the process.
Also, they should have a standard feature list. ALL builders do. That tells all the standards. You would have to initial it in the contract.
I hope we have the same experience, but it's not been promising so far. We ask specific questions, and get general, non-specific answers - and repeat. But I'm still asking questions...
Maybe you have a bad OR very inexperienced sales person. Ask for their boss.
I sell new homes. I can easily pull up pricing for all upgrades but cant show you pictures of them since you go to design center. They should be able to do the same.. I can also show pics of all standard carpets, tile, cabinets etc.
I doubt they have any exit clause. All major builders I know dont. Dell Webb is part of Pulte, so I know Pulte doesnt as I have a friend there.
I know we dont negotiate on a build job. We have set incentive for each community. Probably same there.
You may want to contact a realtor to help you. They would be on your side in the process.
Also, they should have a standard feature list. ALL builders do. That tells all the standards. You would have to initial it in the contract.
Thanks for your insights, I'm pretty sure we're not going to do business with Del Webb, if they won't show us a complete list of options/upgrades with pricing and there is no exit clause between the initial contract and the final price revision. That's a show stopper for us. I'm surprised so many buyers allow that, but DW have sold thousands of homes so it's worked for lots of customers already. In another thread, a resident said a "starting at $357K" model could run $500-600K with all the upgrades and a lot premium. That's more of a spread than I'd expect, but I don't do this everyday so it's probably just me.
And I know they have to have a price list for every model for their sales reps to work from, but they simply refuse to share it with us so far. There is a standard feature list (one page bullet list), but it basically just gives brands. To walk thru one example: e.g. "Whirlpool -black or white electric range with hood, dishwasher, and microwave in cabinet." I have to assume they're all Whirlpools lowest grade, or some builders grade I can't even get specs for. We know we want a better grade, and stainless steel, but we can't know those options with costs until after we sign a contract? And it doesn't list a disposal anywhere, will that be extra for Pete's sake? If it was just a disposal no problem, but how many other items we'd consider standard are left unknown? There are so many loose ends in their standard features, they could nickel and dime us to no end.
Midpack, did you ask them about visiting with the design center before signing?
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