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Old 05-07-2018, 09:29 AM
 
210 posts, read 109,942 times
Reputation: 390

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Serious Conversation View Post
Take this from a layman's opinion.

When dealing with a real estate agent as a buyer, you're largely paying for expertise regarding the neighborhood, pricing, assistance with paperwork, etc.

For some people, they need more of the handholding. I live in my home metro. I know the place backwards and forwards, from what schools are quality, to blocks that have the most crime, to what can be expected of appreciation in the different cities/counties. I'm a data-driven person. I can easily pick out what's going to be a quality purchase or not in my local area.
I'm another layperson who has purchased and sold too many houses. I believe we're now on our last one (gosh, I hope).

Yes, when you're dealing with an agent, you want one who knows the areas. We've encountered too many who had no clue about various areas and felt, too often, we were on a wild goose chase and we hated it. Prior to putting out last house house on the market, we interviewed three agents. We did our research ( data-driven - I worked in IT, so that was natural) and found one was beyond irresponsible and gave us a range that we knew was totally wrong (good neighborhood, location, had maintained and upgraded the house) and she lowballed us - with the lowest range being 40k off what we got for our house. She had pulled a title that was obviously old to impress us and it showed her ignorance. We opted, due to our neighborhood and location of our maintained house, to go with SellersSolutions. It was a lot cheaper and we knew the MLS would drive people in and it worked. She made one $600 suggestion to do to our home and I knew it was the right thing to do. Had three offers within days.

Moved out of state and landed with the perfect agent and agency. We gave her our requirements and she nailed it (well ... except the price was higher than we expected and the market here is probably close to as insane as Asheville).

We began here with one agent just sending us auto-emails about properties and showed us a few (had to run out of one as the smell was so bad). We learned to ignore her lack of knowledge and signed with a great agent. We put an offer on one house out of about 25 we had seen over just a few days, avoided a bidding war (it was easy and we're in bidding-war country here) and are going to close soon. Jo Ann is a plethora of knowledge and we continue to get information about various activities around here that she knows suits us. Attempted to look based on various real estate sites (we could see the crime rate and we're known for verifying areas with local police depts.) but it was still confusing. BUT we had an agent who knew her stuff and man oh man, that made all the difference.
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Old 05-07-2018, 10:04 AM
 
698 posts, read 431,915 times
Reputation: 1092
Quote:
Originally Posted by Serious Conversation View Post
Take this from a layman's opinion.

When dealing with a real estate agent as a buyer, you're largely paying for expertise regarding the neighborhood, pricing, assistance with paperwork, etc.

For some people, they need more of the handholding. I live in my home metro. I know the place backwards and forwards, from what schools are quality, to blocks that have the most crime, to what can be expected of appreciation in the different cities/counties. I'm a data-driven person. I can easily pick out what's going to be a quality purchase or not in my local area.
I am the same as you in that regard, I know and live in my market area. That can stretch out to the 5+ neighboring towns all within the same county and farther south to more rural area's outside of my county.

I don't require hand-holding tho, however, the FSBO market where I am currently looking to purchase, has low to non-existent inventory, so I must use the "current model."

Just yesterday, I looked at a property that came on the market within the last 2 days, listed significantly higher than what very recent apple-to-apple comp's sold for. (yea, yea, comp's are only comp's, people will pay for what they believe a property is worth, etc....) I am not one of those people, here's my offer based on factual information, take it or not.

When we were there, I took my paper out, that I had written the 4 most recent sold comps on, and went through them with the agent. The agent looked at me and said, "How do you know if there were concessions, we cannot see that information on our MLS?" I replied, "Redfin" (I'm not "Pro Redfin, they just have the info listed). They didn't believe me, not in a "you are lying" way, just that the information is available to anyone, in my area, if they look for it. They looked it up themselves at were like, "hmmmm...."

Anyway, the current model will not change until more consumer's take on the role of researcher, data collector, learn their market and that there are options to facilitate sales and purchases, by using a RE attorney and data. Use the information technology has made available for you, no need to sit back and let someone else direct you, unless you prefer that, then, cool. It just isn't my preferred method.
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Old 05-07-2018, 10:14 AM
 
Location: Raleigh NC
9,008 posts, read 7,018,403 times
Reputation: 7969
Quote:
Originally Posted by photogal9 View Post
Just yesterday, I looked at a property that came on the market within the last 2 days, listed significantly higher than what very recent apple-to-apple comp's sold for. (yea, yea, comp's are only comp's, people will pay for what they believe a property is worth, etc....) I am not one of those people, here's my offer based on factual information, take it or not.

When we were there, I took my paper out, that I had written the 4 most recent sold comps on, and went through them with the agent. The agent looked at me and said, "How do you know if there were concessions, we cannot see that information on our MLS?" I replied, "Redfin" (I'm not "Pro Redfin, they just have the info listed). They didn't believe me, not in a "you are lying" way, just that the information is available to anyone, in my area, if they look for it. They looked it up themselves at were like, "hmmmm...."
so that we understand what happened....

you were with the listing agent/someone on their team/someone from their brokerage, or with a Buyer's agent that you're using?

You said "these 4 houses sold for 1,2,3,4." - and meaning "these sold for less than is being asked for this home". The response was that you couldn't tell if there were any concessions in those 4 deals. But wouldn't concessions just lower the price, making it an even worse deal? Or is the inference that perhaps someone paid cash and got a lower price?
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Old 05-07-2018, 10:24 AM
 
Location: Raleigh NC
9,008 posts, read 7,018,403 times
Reputation: 7969
btw, photogal - there are 1,000's of FSBO's in your market. You just haven't identified them yet.

Let's pick for example that last condo complex with a range of 110-135K (if memory serves). Mail every owner and tell them you're interested. Explain the range in market value depending on the condition.

Surely at least 1 will respond.
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Old 05-07-2018, 10:43 AM
 
698 posts, read 431,915 times
Reputation: 1092
Quote:
Originally Posted by BoBromhal View Post
so that we understand what happened....

you were with the listing agent/someone on their team/someone from their brokerage, or with a Buyer's agent that you're using?

You said "these 4 houses sold for 1,2,3,4." - and meaning "these sold for less than is being asked for this home". The response was that you couldn't tell if there were any concessions in those 4 deals. But wouldn't concessions just lower the price, making it an even worse deal? Or is the inference that perhaps someone paid cash and got a lower price?
Buyer's agent. They seem to be a decent fit for me, not pushy. I do not bug them unless there is something that has peaked my interest, they check in every now and then asking if I have seen anything that is of interest.

I could see if they were conventional, cash, etc...(none were cash) and if there were concessions given to the seller, from the buyer. The buyer agent could not, until they went on Redfin. All the data I had, showed that this particular property is priced high in comparison to the sold comp's, I am talking $15K+ over(and it needs work). My offer was based on sold and apple-to-apple comp's.

To your other post, sure, I could mass-mail 1000's of homeowner's not looking to sell and see if I could persuade them to sell. That doesn't sound like a good route to go. You can't force a turtle out of its shell.
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Old 05-07-2018, 11:22 AM
 
1,528 posts, read 882,389 times
Reputation: 2062
The biggest problem inhibiting change is the buyer's agent system. When most buyers in a market are 'owned' by real estate agents, sellers are hostage to that system. That's why listing fees have decreased but in my layman's view, buyer's agent fees have moved much less or hardly at all. Many agents will say that there is full choice to go FSBO but when most buyers are owned by buyer's agents, the majority of FSBO sellers (in my casual view) end up having to pay buyer's agent fees to get a buyer.

Until that sick system is broken up, very little change can come.

And it desperately does need to be broken because it's very bad for consumers. Buyer's just sign up for binding agreements with buyer's agents because they are led to believe it's free. It can cost 8k, 10k, 12k for a relatively modest house (just for the buyer's agent side). buyer's don't know or really care what services they will need. Are their agent's services that they need 2k? 4k? $500? It doesn't matter because you pay one great big sum no matter what you need. Buyers can choose to go without an agent but what savings they will directly achieve is not clear and can be minimal due to how the whole thing works. With two mouths to feed in the transaction, costs can only decrease so much. 5-6% commission is five to six times greater than in the UK which is a mature market with high home ownership.
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Old 05-07-2018, 11:59 AM
 
Location: Columbia, SC
9,044 posts, read 17,992,303 times
Reputation: 6648
This was going to be an interesting topic. Hopefully it doesn't continue to devolve into commission discussions or "I don't need or want an agent because this happened to me a long time ago" comments. There are enough of those on other derailed threads.

JB, if the UK is so great feel free to move there.
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Old 05-07-2018, 12:43 PM
 
Location: Bloomington IN
6,476 posts, read 7,715,385 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brandon Hoffman View Post
This was going to be an interesting topic. Hopefully it doesn't continue to devolve into commission discussions or "I don't need or want an agent because this happened to me a long time ago" comments. There are enough of those on other derailed threads.

JB, if the UK is so great feel free to move there.
100% agree. I'm fearful it's already headed in that direction. In my opinion the lower commission was really the irrelevant part of it. What was most interesting to me was the use of algorithms to target marketing and depending entirely on the internet instead of the MLS.

At least now I understand why my fully employed computer science kid was taking a course on algorithms "just for fun."
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Old 05-07-2018, 04:16 PM
 
Location: All Over
4,005 posts, read 4,533,966 times
Reputation: 3092
The real estate market is ripe for a shakeup, I'm sure this may offend some realtors, but honestly real estate is one of the highest paid professions for seemingly no special training or skills.

Now don't get me wrong, a good realtor is worth their weight in gold, but my point is it's a very low barrier to entry to become a realtor, an online class for $300 and your in business. I feel like every unemployed person and every recent divorcee has a stint as a realtor.

As a home buyer or seller it's tough to know what your getting which is actually harmful to realtors as they tend to all get lumped into the same category as overpaid door openers

All that said, people are paying more money to realtors oftentimes than they pay to mechanics, hvac guys, heck even doctors and these are jobs people have to spend years training for or apprenticing for so why do realtors deserve to make that much or more?

It used to be a realtor had to send you stuff on the MLS, with all that being pretty available online with the internet most people are doing their home searches so that already removes part of a realtors job. I realize alot more goes into it than we see during the transaction in terms of them communicating with the other agent, getting disclosures signed, etc but honestly so much of this could be automated

Quite frankly with so much disruption going on to different industries due to technology and the intenret I'mm quite shocked this hasn't happenned alreay
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Old 05-07-2018, 04:19 PM
 
Location: All Over
4,005 posts, read 4,533,966 times
Reputation: 3092
Quote:
Originally Posted by MI-Roger View Post
It certainly makes me respond in a particular way! I clean all browser history, cancel cookies, install ad blocking software, and stop visiting the web sites where the ads are displayed.

Annoying potential customers is not an effective tool to build sales!
Advertising is just a part of life, especially if your not willing to pay for things. You can pay for e-mail that won't display ads and which doesn't scan your emails for datatrackng but you have to pay for it. Im assuming your using a paid e-mail like hushmail since your against ads?

Honestly ads are a partof life, literally everyone and everything uses them. I think your doing more harm and inconvenience to yourself than you are to companies selling your data.

Now I don't participate in Facebook so there's an extent to what I'm willing to be part of but not visiting sites that display ads say goodbye to the internet
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