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Old 06-13-2018, 05:28 AM
 
Location: Beautiful Rhode Island
6,308 posts, read 10,478,552 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldtrader View Post
The most important factor allowing lower priced housing, is three fold.

1: Availability of land/lots to build housing on. Silicon Valley where we raised our family, we paid $13,750 for a home in Cupertino in 1956. It was not the cheapest which started at about $9,999, Today they are reselling those $10,000 homes for $1,250,000 and up. People are paying that kind of price, and tearing the house down. They bought the house, to get the lot for a place to build. Due to the lack of buildable land is the problem.

2: The price of land to build, and the cost of developing lots to build on. In many areas, there is a shortage of land, so prices have gotten so high, they cannot afford to build low priced housing on it.

3: Local regulations and laws that control the housing market. Some cities have laws and regulations coupled with huge fees and costs before you do anything to develop a parcel of land.

Try to even consider building in many areas and cities in the nation housing for the masses, and you are shot down from day 1. You simply cannot buy land, develop it and pay the local government huge amounts in fees and other costs, including the cost of taking a year or more to get a permit to even start clearing the land you want to develop, and build low priced housing for the masses. The cost of the lot, plus costs for building permits, etc., are already higher than the poor and even average person in many areas can afford to pay for a completed home, condo, or rented apartment, and you have not even started to build at that point.
Good explanation of why housing starts are complicated. Cost of materials and union workers going up and interest rates are also going up, which will also go into the equation. Demographics plays a big part as well---- more retirees than workers, etc.
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Old 06-13-2018, 07:46 AM
 
257 posts, read 200,226 times
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I really don't think the housing shortage will be solved (at least long-term) until remote work becomes more of the norm.

Right now there is a shortage of affordable housing in some cities. However, there is plenty of affordable housing in many rural parts of the country. I work with a DC based organization where the majority of their staff works remotely. Sure there are some people who live in the DC metro area, but a lot of their staff now live in more rural areas, as housing is more affordable.

I realize that not every job is suitable for remote work, but I do think that would be a huge help. And I do think it would alleviate the demand on housing and land in certain areas, which I believe may drive down prices making it more affordable for those people who can't work remotely.

However, in order to that to happen the country needs to be able to provide affordable high speed internet access everywhere in the country.
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Old 06-13-2018, 09:24 AM
 
10,276 posts, read 6,519,194 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ea1420 View Post

However, in order to that to happen the country needs to be able to provide affordable high speed internet access everywhere in the country.
The government doesn't care about that and the politicians are owned by the large cable and other major internet providers.
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Old 06-13-2018, 12:30 PM
 
Location: Raleigh NC
7,781 posts, read 6,136,961 times
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if we provide high-speed internet .... isn't that like a cost of development that should be borne by the consumer?
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Old 06-13-2018, 05:44 PM
 
1,488 posts, read 334,628 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BoBromhal View Post
if we provide high-speed internet .... isn't that like a cost of development that should be borne by the consumer?
It is, in commercial situations where a dedicated circuit is to be built. Construction costs can range from $3,000 to $100,000 for the infrastructure to deliver, say, one fiber optic line.

In residential situations, it's done on a per-development basis, based on the anticipated adoption rate and projected revenue. If there's not a timely ROI, they just won't build at all. It would be extremely distasteful to begin charging per-address construction costs to residential customers when that has [almost never] happened in the past, except as remedy/recourse when a contract is broken, in the form of ETF or Early Termination Fee.

My theory on this would be, since planned communities are becoming a popular concept, for the construction of the neighborhood node be financed by the HOA itself. It would align with the deployment principles of the carriers, too, who like to build ACCESS for each address, where they only have to run the final drop wire at the install appointment.
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Old 06-13-2018, 08:04 PM
 
Location: South Park, San Diego
4,645 posts, read 7,075,148 times
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I wouldnít say our city should necessarily (or even slightly) be thrust as a shining example as to confronting the very real housing shortage here correctly but the one thing that it has done is totally re-worked zoning for the much easier construction of companion units in formally only SFH zoning. They have dropped fees, eased parking requirements and setbacks to allow for a very real possibility of several thousand potential units.

Still, housing is exorbitantly expensive here and mostly because of a shortage of units being planned and built as well as real constrained available land to build on. If you talk to the locals, and Iíve lived here for 31 years, there is a widely held view that the developers are in bed with the local government and while there is a still a shortage, thousand of units and 100s of 1000s of people have moved to the region since Iíve been here and frankly it feels pretty damn crowded to most of us. It is a NIMBY attitude to be sure, but for those of us who live in these cities you do want to protect the qualities of your turf that brought you here in the first place.

Fortunately we live in the core so as long as we stay in it we can move about pretty easily and the noticeable increase in units downtown and surrounding areas generally just make the city better and more vibrant with the related commercial amenities that come with it that we can all enjoy.

A few more companion units wonít drastically change the character of the neighborhoods here, and I will likely be able to design several.
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Old 06-13-2018, 08:36 PM
 
Location: Raleigh NC
7,781 posts, read 6,136,961 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ddm2k View Post
It is, in commercial situations where a dedicated circuit is to be built. Construction costs can range from $3,000 to $100,000 for the infrastructure to deliver, say, one fiber optic line.

In residential situations, it's done on a per-development basis, based on the anticipated adoption rate and projected revenue. If there's not a timely ROI, they just won't build at all. It would be extremely distasteful to begin charging per-address construction costs to residential customers when that has [almost never] happened in the past, except as remedy/recourse when a contract is broken, in the form of ETF or Early Termination Fee.

My theory on this would be, since planned communities are becoming a popular concept, for the construction of the neighborhood node be financed by the HOA itself. It would align with the deployment principles of the carriers, too, who like to build ACCESS for each address, where they only have to run the final drop wire at the install appointment.
I have no doubt you're correct. As an easy example, I know that the natural gas company isn't running a line mile down the road to 1 customer in a small neighborhood, but once enough ask for service that the gas company decides long-term it's feasible/profitable, then they will. Just like if gas is at the street, and you tell them (in our market) that you want to convert to gas heat, they'll extend the line to your house for free.
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Old 06-14-2018, 04:12 AM
 
Location: The Triad (NC)
26,878 posts, read 57,960,239 times
Reputation: 29317
Quote:
Originally Posted by T. Damon View Post
Still, housing is exorbitantly expensive here and mostly because of a shortage of units...
That's one side of the equation, sure. But what about the other side?
Currently it's at the 2.8M level ... in 1980 it was around the 1.8M level. LINK

Just how many people does SD need in order to do well?
Aside from serving the human needs of that excess 1M... what constructive work is the additional accomplishing?
Similar applies in most dense areas.
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Old 06-14-2018, 04:32 AM
 
Location: Cary, NC
31,647 posts, read 55,374,605 times
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I blame the Illuminati, the Rothschilds, and Mr. Rogers.
Oh, and Facebook and the Trilateral Commission.


Other potential contributors:
Land. Land. Land. They aren't making any more of it.
As old-trader noted, the cost of land drives the cost of housing.
Shortage of qualified labor driving labor costs.
Don't forget the tax/tariff on Canadian lumber since the first of the year, that is driving the average house price up a few grand without an end in sight.
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Old 06-14-2018, 08:05 AM
 
257 posts, read 200,226 times
Reputation: 470
Quote:
Originally Posted by BoBromhal View Post
if we provide high-speed internet .... isn't that like a cost of development that should be borne by the consumer?
i would argue that it's like roads, schools, and other public services. The cost should be borne by the taxpayer as an infrastructure cost. Particularly, because in many rural areas that this the only way that sort of infrastructure gets built.
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