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Old 08-07-2018, 02:41 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles
3,480 posts, read 2,091,458 times
Reputation: 10380

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Quote:
Originally Posted by escanlan View Post
I'm not an Appraiser but did seriously look at that field before entering the one I'm in now. I sure thank my lucky stars I did not enter it after what happened during the crash of the last decade. The actual Appraiser now is getting the very short end of the stick and it is showing with the drop in their numbers.
You couldn't be more correct. They have made the barrier to entry into the appraisal field so high that fewer people are willing to do it. As it is, new people have to work for slave wages just to accumulate their 2,500 - 3,000 required experience hours. When I had trainees back in 2000 - 2007 I paid them 60% and I was generous compared to most shops. These days most lenders require certification which means even more hours plus a bachelors degree. When I started out in 1992 I could visit mortgage brokers to try and get their business. No more. Now you can't even talk to lenders and instead must sign up with appraisal management companies who take $ 150 an order just to hand the order from the lender to the appraiser. I must have gotten 20 or so people into the appraisal business over the years but now I would never suggest it as a viable career path. Luckily it all went South just when I was ready to slow down anyway. In the "good old days" of 2000-2007 I was doing 120 appraisals a month at full fees. Now if I do 20 I feel swamped (something about getting old). I mostly do private appraisals for divorces and dead people now with the occasional lender appraisal thrown in. But I have to say, it was an amazingly rewarding business to be in before the government screwed it up.
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Old 08-07-2018, 08:34 PM
 
Location: Raleigh NC
8,347 posts, read 6,559,301 times
Reputation: 7472
Quote:
Originally Posted by WRM20 View Post
$1.50 for 5 miles of driving? The IRS flat rate for mileage is 54.5 cents per mile. It's more than just gas costs when driving for business.

You lack any real understanding of how much people are paid for professional jobs. Your $50 per hour equates to $100,000 per year. Where I work, anyone with a degree and 10 years of experience makes more than that, with many making in the mid-$200k range.

Your purported $25 per hour is completely unrealistic, and wouldn't come close to covering all of the costs for an appraiser.
don't forget - that's 100K grossed up. 15%+ for self-employed tax, plus health insurance cost, no paid time off, etc. then the mileage, license costs, software, etc etc

I'd guess you're looking at $50K net, which is $25/hr.
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Old 08-08-2018, 12:45 PM
 
Location: Massachusetts
9,084 posts, read 9,507,175 times
Reputation: 12739
Just pulled up my old appraisal to see what fee i had to pay for it.

Metro-Boston area which is a high COL area, about 3 years ago. Got a pretty nice ~50 page report with good details, photos, neighborhood info, etc. ~$500K SFH about 2600sf on a 1/4 acre lot.

$350.

Mortgage survey was an additional $250.
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Old 08-09-2018, 01:58 PM
 
132 posts, read 332,987 times
Reputation: 162
Quote:
Originally Posted by WRM20 View Post
$1.50 for 5 miles of driving? The IRS flat rate for mileage is 54.5 cents per mile. It's more than just gas costs when driving for business.

You lack any real understanding of how much people are paid for professional jobs. Your $50 per hour equates to $100,000 per year. Where I work, anyone with a degree and 10 years of experience makes more than that, with many making in the mid-$200k range.

Your purported $25 per hour is completely unrealistic, and wouldn't come close to covering all of the costs for an appraiser.
You must be living in San Francisco or NYC or something.

I don't know how accurate it is, I'm sure it is definitely more accurate than your utopian perception of the professional world you live in... "Some degree" to "associate" is about 40-50k for most of this country, premium ZIP codes excluded.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...ion_Income.jpg

Quote:
Originally Posted by JustMike77 View Post
I've been appraising homes for 26 years and I wouldn't get out of my chair for $ 50/hour. Tomorrow's job is a 4,400 sq ft home for $ 950. The whole thing will take about 5 hours.
I know quite a few people who won't get out of their chair for millions. You just can't beat welfare. It's in the culture. The sense of privilege and entitlement. It can get pretty high. The higher the sense, the heavier the butt and greater the effort required to lift it off the chair. Sometimes when I'm at Walmart I see a lot of highly educated people as reflected by the size of their butts who are just too good for those petty $50/hr jobs...

Quote:
Originally Posted by kukumjacka View Post
But I can't shake off this weird feeling that this is a bit of a add/subtract game. Refinance company appraised the home at a certain number. Then they sent out the appraiser who, somehow, came exactly at the that same number.

So I ask... WTF?
That's what I said. ALL my properties where appraised within 2% of what I asked for. And I asked for a number that I felt will work for me, e.g. how much money I wanted back. I guess,

me without any appraisal education = guy with 4 years of pro educaiton and 10 years experience

Otherwise I can't explain how do my own appraisals that I spend like 3 second on get confirmed by these appraiser gods.

Sorry, I can't take this profession seriously. I know some lots of people just like worshipping and dropping on the knees in front of any fat important looking dude who shows up at their doorstep looking all tough and smart and very very important and very educated and professional like if he had been through hell and fire to become what he became, but reality is that he probably just has 3 months of evening school in some community college which he barely made it to the end in between smoking joints and playing video games with his buddies in his mom's basement.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scooby Snacks View Post
Not necessarily. The rest is correct. And I agree with everyone else. It takes skill and outside research to perform an accurate appraisal. That's where the cost comes in.
What job does NOT require skill? And what is "outside research"? Taking a look at county appraised tax value, a checking zillow?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Silverfall View Post
Well, that's because people aren't going to go through the training and requirements for $25 an hour. Appraisers are independent contractors so $25 an hour isn't going to cut it. They have to pay taxes, continuing education, licensing, business expenses, etc. $25 an hour won't even cover the costs of running the business.
Most business have to pay that. BUT:

- continued education is minimal. It's not a medical field where there are new hundreds drugs, procedures, technologies, studies every month. Houses and what's in them are the same and have been for century. All that changes is demand/supply. The rest stays the same.

- licensing? It's $300 one time thing, and should be paid by the guy as part of his education expenses which nobody owes him a refund for. This is why people invest in education so they can make more later. Why is this even being mentioned?

- business expenses? Do appraisers use machinery that they put wear and tear on? They use lots of materials? Uhmmm. NO. They just drive to the place which in most places (big cities exluded) is under 10 miles per transaction, walk around with a very important look, measure the insides maybe, and leave with an equally important look like they just did a very hard work. The only wear and tear is on their car seat that have to carry that butt that won't lift itself for less than $50/hr.

Quote:
Most states disagree with you on what an appraiser is and the qualifications to be one. As such, people with a bachelor's degree who run all over the place expect more than $25 an hour. I can tell you that if you understood what it was really like to be an appraiser you wouldn't do that work for $25 an hour.
I agree, $25 for a Bachelor is low. But $35-50 is right on. So for 4hrs of work done by Bachelor which is I bet rare as most appraisers are not Bachelors, it should be no more than $150-200 + same for their company. So $300-400 for TOP END JOB done by highest grade appraiser with the biggest gut and most important looking face in the history of faces.

Still not seeing where $800 per less than 1000 sq ft house come from.
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Old 08-09-2018, 02:28 PM
 
Location: Honolulu, HI
5,442 posts, read 1,486,993 times
Reputation: 7749
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mounty View Post
Would you be ok if someone erected a toll booth on your commute charging $20 one way and saying "if you don't like it, just walk".

Just because some racketeering practice exists doesn't mean we should be ok with it.
Well you’re always welcomed to build your own home from scratch. Then you can give yourself the expert estimation of value.
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Old 08-10-2018, 04:30 AM
 
Location: Cary, NC
32,333 posts, read 56,544,084 times
Reputation: 31045
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocko20 View Post
Well you’re always welcomed to build your own home from scratch. Then you can give yourself the expert estimation of value.
Or, get an appraisal license, and reform the industry with a new value-based model.
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Old 08-11-2018, 07:20 PM
 
17,186 posts, read 18,580,981 times
Reputation: 24951
I looked at my appraisal fee from two years ago. $450 bucks.
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Old 08-11-2018, 08:27 PM
 
Location: Salem, OR
13,836 posts, read 32,107,106 times
Reputation: 12416
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mounty View Post



Most business have to pay that. BUT:

- continued education is minimal. It's not a medical field where there are new hundreds drugs, procedures, technologies, studies every month. Houses and what's in them are the same and have been for century. All that changes is demand/supply. The rest stays the same.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Mounty View Post
- licensing? It's $300 one time thing, and should be paid by the guy as part of his education expenses which nobody owes him a refund for. This is why people invest in education so they can make more later. Why is this even being mentioned?
In Oregon it is every two years with 30 hours of continuing education in between. It is mentioned because it is a business expense. Licensing isn't the cost of the class that you pass. It is the fee that you pay to the state for having a license in that state.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mounty View Post
- business expenses? Do appraisers use machinery that they put wear and tear on? They use lots of materials? Uhmmm. NO. They just drive to the place which in most places (big cities exluded) is under 10 miles per transaction, walk around with a very important look, measure the insides maybe, and leave with an equally important look like they just did a very hard work. The only wear and tear is on their car seat that have to carry that butt that won't lift itself for less than $50/hr.
Business need to have a place of business. So that means an office with utliity costs, a computer, software to run the appraisal forns, E&O insurance. In my county, a business pays property tax on all personal property to run a business so I pay property taxes on every desk, chair, etc in my office. You clearly have no idea what kind of expenses there are in running a small business.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Mounty View Post
I agree, $25 for a Bachelor is low. But $35-50 is right on. So for 4hrs of work done by Bachelor which is I bet rare as most appraisers are not Bachelors, it should be no more than $150-200 + same for their company. So $300-400 for TOP END JOB done by highest grade appraiser with the biggest gut and most important looking face in the history of faces.

Still not seeing where $800 per less than 1000 sq ft house come from.
I don't know an appraiser without a degree. It is hard for them to get work if they aren't certified or general residential appraisers which require degrees. Just because it fits your agenda better to think of them as non-educated baffoons doesn't make it true. The good news is that you CAN do something. You can write your state representatives who are the ones that make the laws regarding what is required to become an appraiser. You can write to your reps and tell them to lower the standards so that you don't have to pay as much. Easy peasy.
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Old 08-18-2018, 08:24 AM
 
Location: OK
2,738 posts, read 6,373,736 times
Reputation: 1880
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mounty View Post
From what I know, it's about 2-3hrs worth of work. At $25/hr for a non-diploma type education clerk work that requires minimal skill and zero intellectual work and 50% company fee this should not exceed $150.

How on Earth did we end up eating $700-800 fees and thinking it's ok?

1. It takes far more time than that to research, analyse and develop an appraisal report. Some of the rural appraisals I do can take several days.

2. The fee you pay includes the fee for the Appraisal Management Company (AMC). These are the worst thing that ever happened to appraisers and consumers. I bet the appraiser received half of that.

3. Appraisers are highly educated. They are required to work as an apprentice for at least 2 years during which time they get paid very little yet have enormous education costs.

An appraisal is more than measuring a house and find sales in the neighborhood. Much more. Especially in rural areas.
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Old 08-18-2018, 08:52 AM
 
Location: MID ATLANTIC
7,678 posts, read 18,034,062 times
Reputation: 8283
I still cannot find where the OP told us about the property being appraised. By this, I mean type of property, location (zip code) and purpose. An investment report easily adds $150 - $200 for the income analysis and rent comp schedule. Condo appraisals add on costs. Multi unit? Near one of the current fire outbreaks? State with a known shortage of appraisers?

I recently had an appraisal in Oregon that took over 4 weeks and cost $1500. The other bid was $2200! It was an 800K home on the coast. The OP basically said the equivalent of saying i just paid $40,000 for my car, isn't that awful? Depends.
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