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Old Today, 05:25 AM
 
Location: Brackenwood
3,645 posts, read 1,444,415 times
Reputation: 7637

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roadrun1 View Post
She herself is the executor. She is threatening to withhold legal documents to stop the sale of the house. It will be difficult to convince my brothers and sisters to hire an attorney but I will try.
If the details you provide about her behavior is accurate, the first thing I would do is talk to an estate attorney about getting her removed as executor. She is obviously operating in her own interests rather than in the interests of the estate as required by law.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Roadrun1 View Post
I have not read it. She has all the legal documents and she is hiding it from everyone.
She doesn't get to hide anything. As a beneficiary of the estate you are legally entitled to a full accounting of the estate's assets, liabilities, and bequests; as executor she is required to provide said accounting. The probate court is supposed to have this information as well Get an estate attorney ASAP and get her replaced as executor.
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Old Today, 05:29 AM
 
Location: Cary, NC
34,028 posts, read 59,174,530 times
Reputation: 32952
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roadrun1 View Post
I have not read it. She has all the legal documents and she is hiding it from everyone.

So...
The house is worth $1.2 million. 8 heirs.
$150,000 each.

And Sis wants to sell for $600,000. $75,000 each.

1. Let Sis volunteer to not take a cut of the proceeds. 7-way split. $85,000 each.
The quibble is down to $65,000 difference.

2. No $1.2 million sale is guaranteed. Maybe it goes off for $1.08 million. $135,000 each.
And, it would seem the $600,000 sale is a sure thing.
If Sis declines a cut, the quibble is down to $50,000 each.

3. And, maybe Sis would be willing in careful and caring negotiation to increase the sale price to her DD to $700,000.
If Sis declines a cut, the quibble is down to $35,000 each.

Is this the hill the family wants to die on?

I have 8 brothers and sisters, and damned if I would participate in tearing my family apart over $35,000, or $65,000 for that matter. Particularly when the least affluent was making out the best.

I would walk away before lawyering up and digging siege trenches.
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Old Today, 05:36 AM
 
Location: Princeton, New Jersey
535 posts, read 886,439 times
Reputation: 862
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roadrun1 View Post
I have not read it. She has all the legal documents and she is hiding it from everyone.


You should be able to obtain a copy of the title from your State Tax Assessor's office (or similar) for a small fee. You may even be able to see it online, so look for websites in your area. In fact, a visit to the town should be sufficient. They should have that info on record. You could also pay for a title search and get it that way.


Since you and your siblings want the house sold ASAP, can you have a legal agreement drawn up, by a lawyer, that says you agree to a reduced inheritance for now, but that upon sale of the house by the niece, you're all owed the rest of your inheritance? And if you've passed away, the money would go to your heirs? Not ideal, because things can be "forgotten" over the years, but maybe an option. Would need a good lawyer, and something recorded with the town/county/state to memorialize the deal.


Good luck! I know how hard it is, having gone through probate. Thankfully my sisters did the right thing and gave up their inheritance willingly. But I only had 2, not 7, so yeah, more opinions, more problems.
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Old Today, 05:37 AM
 
Location: Brackenwood
3,645 posts, read 1,444,415 times
Reputation: 7637
Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeJaquish View Post
So...
The house is worth $1.2 million. 8 heirs.
$150,000 each.

And Sis wants to sell for $600,000. $75,000 each.

1. Let Sis volunteer to not take a cut of the proceeds. 7-way split. $85,000 each.
The quibble is down to $65,000 difference.

2. No $1.2 million sale is guaranteed. Maybe it goes off for $1.08 million. $135,000 each.
And, it would seem the $600,000 sale is a sure thing.
If Sis declines a cut, the quibble is down to $50,000 each.

3. And, maybe Sis would be willing in careful and caring negotiation to increase the sale price to her DD to $700,000.
If Sis declines a cut, the quibble is down to $35,000 each.

Is this the hill the family wants to die on?

I have 8 brothers and sisters, and damned if I would participate in tearing my family apart over $35,000, or $65,000 for that matter. Particularly when the least affluent was making out the best.

I would walk away before lawyering up and digging siege trenches.
Yeah, no. The sister has a legal, never mind moral, obligation to execute the will as directed by the parents. She has already taken enough advantage of her position by living in the place rent-free for a decade and now she wants to rip off the other beneficiaries even more? Hell naw. It's time to put an end to this canard.

Last edited by Bitey; Today at 06:00 AM..
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Old Today, 05:46 AM
 
Location: Princeton, New Jersey
535 posts, read 886,439 times
Reputation: 862
Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeJaquish View Post
So...
The house is worth $1.2 million. 8 heirs.
$150,000 each.

And Sis wants to sell for $600,000. $75,000 each.

1. Let Sis volunteer to not take a cut of the proceeds. 7-way split. $85,000 each.
The quibble is down to $65,000 difference.

2. No $1.2 million sale is guaranteed. Maybe it goes off for $1.08 million. $135,000 each.
And, it would seem the $600,000 sale is a sure thing.
If Sis declines a cut, the quibble is down to $50,000 each.

3. And, maybe Sis would be willing in careful and caring negotiation to increase the sale price to her DD to $700,000.
If Sis declines a cut, the quibble is down to $35,000 each.

Is this the hill the family wants to die on?

I have 8 brothers and sisters, and damned if I would participate in tearing my family apart over $35,000, or $65,000 for that matter. Particularly when the least affluent was making out the best.

I would walk away before lawyering up and digging siege trenches.


And then the daughter sells it for $1.2 million down the road and the oldest sister gets to double-dip through her daughter? And her daughter is set up with all that money that the other sibling's children didn't get access to? No. Not legal or fair.


Emotional attachment to house or not, I don't believe for one second that the oldest sister isn't fully aware of the financial boost this house would give her daughter. No one, except the super rich (and probably not even them), is unaware of securing $1.2 million in house asset for their child and grandchildren.
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Old Today, 05:59 AM
 
444 posts, read 132,333 times
Reputation: 1571
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bitey View Post
Yeah, no. Her sister has a legal, never mind moral, obligation to execute the will as directed by the parents. She has already taken enough advantage of her position by living in the place rent-free for a decade and now she wants to rip off the other beneficiaries even more? Hell naw. It's time to put an end to this canard.
Exactly. When my parents passed, my sister attempted to pull a very similar stunt. I was the executor. The estate lawyer and I were stunned that I actually had to explain my sister's lawyer, AND some lowly paid idiot of a county social worker, exactly how the world of probate works. Both of those fools were quite certain that my sister had the RIGHT to take possession and title to the home, regardless of a legitimate and enforceable will. The fact was that she would of quickly lost it to medical debt, or that she was about 50% short of the monthly income needed to even own and operate the dwelling, didn't seem to matter to any of the idiots on her side. It made for some pretty crazy times, and completely extinguished the relationship I had with my sister.

Not only is it time for the OP to bring this mess to a hard close, it should of never happened in the first place. Giving one beneficiary's spawn the gift of $600K in equity, in direct violation of the deceased parent's intent, is simply not acceptable, for any reason.
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Old Today, 07:04 AM
 
528 posts, read 198,955 times
Reputation: 1832
It only takes one of the 8 sibling heirs to force a sale through a partition suit.
It will be expensive but with the right estate lawyer the expenses (legal fees) will be paid by the estate so your sister will essentially be co-paying for the lawsuit against her.

It will cost very little to have a consultation with an estate lawyer to find out what remedies you have for the situation.
If some of the siblings want to "donate" their share to this sister that is up to them, it does not have to be a group decision.

The will should have been filed with the county and if she has not done that she can be removed as executor and a lawyer can serve in her place. This will cost money but again the "estate" pays the cost so each persons 12% share of the estate is reduced for all the costs (estate lawyer, real estate appraisal).

BTW I am NOT a fan of estate lawyers, they charge the legal maximum for their work even when it's a simple estate. When it's a fight like this the estate can be charged a lot. The lawyers are the real winners when heirs fight. Look up what your state says is the amount an estate attorney can charge, prepare to be shocked. Some states allow attorneys to charge a % of the estate but that will still be less than the 50% your sister wants as her discount.

IMO the first thing to do is remove her as executor since she is not fulfilling her legal duties.
That could be enough to get things moving.
But once the will is filed all any one of the 8 heirs needs to do is file a suit to partition the property.
You need to spend some money talking to a couple lawyers in your state.

Charles Dickens wrote a book about this subject call Bleak House. Don't read it, does not end well with money to inheritors.
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Old Today, 07:11 AM
 
Location: The Triad (NC)
29,164 posts, read 63,380,721 times
Reputation: 33487
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roadrun1 View Post
I have not read (the Probate reports and other Orphans Court docs).

She has all the legal documents nd she is hiding it from everyone.
Go down to the Court House and ask to see them.
ALL else you might do derives from knowing the current legal status.
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Old Today, 07:20 AM
 
Location: Ocala, FL
3,392 posts, read 6,261,038 times
Reputation: 2976
Even if the sister has the legal documents and is hiding them, I honestly believe in most municipalities that it is public record and easily obtainable, even if she objects. Any Real Estate attorney with a lick of common sense can get hold of such records at a certain cost fairly easily.
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Old Today, 07:25 AM
 
Location: Western Washington
9,442 posts, read 8,684,915 times
Reputation: 16261
Although frequently mentioned on this board, this might be the first post that actually has a situation that might qualify under adverse possession.

Sister has been living in the house, with the knowledge of the owners, paying all taxes and expenses, for a period of 10 years. A few more years, depending on jurisdiction, and she owns it outright.

Of course, I have no idea what happens when adverse possession and probate are in conflict with one another, but to my layman's eye, it might qualify. It certainly seems to be a more solid case than the typical one where a person places a fence on their neighbor's property.

If the sister is willing to demand $600k from her siblings, why wouldn't she be willing to steal the whole amount?
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