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Location: Halfway between Number 4 Privet Drive and Forks, WA
1,516 posts, read 4,590,499 times
Reputation: 677
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sheenie2000
I wonder what all the RE bulls on this site were saying during the bubble? Probably the same thing, that the RE bears are nuts and that housing would never crash.
Now that it's happened, I don't know why people still feel more declines can't happen? Why the pushback?
WHO said there won't be more declines? Certainly not me.
I'm just guessing cuckoo friend's rent costs significantly more than his mortgage would at $167k. That usually makes it a no brainer for the majority...
Give it to the landlord or give it to yourself...ya know, that kind of thing...
I wonder what all the RE bulls on this site were saying during the bubble? Probably the same thing, that the RE bears are nuts and that housing would never crash.
Now that it's happened, I don't know why people still feel more declines can't happen? Why the pushback?
There are less than a handful of real estate bulls who frequent this forum, with any frequency. To the best of my knowledge, they are investors or homeowners.
The majority seem know know, we all have to live somewhere and there is a cost associated with this, be it rental or so called ownership.
To clarify: Once some one refuses to acknowledge that homes selling for a tiny fraction of their list price are "a deal" and they instead believe that the price must fall to a level that is almost certainly far below the value of the raw land they are not longer in the realm of the rational.
To me this suggests that it is not a financial decision but some sort ofemotional revenge they seek, not only is this not helpful to other buyers / sellers / the over all marketplace, it suggests a sort of viciousness that will widen the suffering of all.
I really, really like the way you framed this, Chet.
The culture who purchased at or near peak, with little to no skin in the game, thought they had their ticket to Easy Street.
The culture who is walking away from their debt, because it is not convenient to owe more than the underlying asset is worth, feel justified in doing so, especially given there are no serious long-term consequences.
The culture who feel entitled to paying no more than 20% of peak are seeking what they feel is their due and it most certainly reeks of emotional revenge.
For now, I am going to stay planted in my own hope that these are sub cultures and not evidence of the majority. God help us all, if I am mistaken, as most folk will find themselves living filthy in tent cities or as squatters, due to unprecidented massive unemployment and econmomic depression.
Location: Halfway between Number 4 Privet Drive and Forks, WA
1,516 posts, read 4,590,499 times
Reputation: 677
Quote:
Originally Posted by middle-aged mom
I really, really like the way you framed this, Chet.
The culture who purchased at or near peak, with little to no skin in the game, thought they had their ticket to Easy Street.
The culture who is walking away from their debt, because it is not convenient to owe more than the underlying asset is worth, feel justified in doing so, especially given there are no serious long-term consequences.
The culture who feel entitled to paying no more than 20% of peak are seeking what they feel is their due and it most certainly reeks of emotional revenge.
For now, I am going to stay planted in my own hope that these are sub cultures and not evidence of the majority. God help us all, if I am mistaken, as most folk will find themselves living filthy in tent cities or as squatters, due to unprecidented massive unemployment and econmomic depression.
I agree, MOM.
I also find it ironic that the much touted argument "prices must return to affordability levels" is mysteriously left out of these posts...
Like I said before, the doom is not all about affordability. There's something else fueling these type buyers once you scratch the surface
HUDs increasing mandates to FHLMC/FNMA for affordable housing, was the launching pad for the bubble.
The end result was that housing became less affodrable, for the masses.
Depreciation of home values means homes are more affordable for the masses. The more affordable homes become, the more people will be unemployment and unable to afford housing.
There are less than a handful of real estate bulls who frequent this forum, with any frequency. To the best of my knowledge, they are investors or homeowners.
The majority seem know know, we all have to live somewhere and there is a cost associated with this, be it rental or so called ownership.
It all depends on where your market is. Here, in Denver, many neighborhoods have leveled off and we're seeing some appreciation. Again, we started in 2003 so we're seeing the end of our cycle plus the fact Colorado attracts residents. With that type of scenario you eventually get a balance between supply and demand, and that's where we are in some price ranges.
There are still areas in the country where declines can (and are) still happening, and maybe this isn't the time to buy in those areas, but who knows the answer for that. Everyone would like to buy at the bottom of the market, but people don't know where the bottom was until they see the market going up.
I also think Sheenie2000 is over genealizing about what people said in years past. It sounds like he's making the case that people in real estate are the cause for home values going up to rediculous levels over the 90's. It's been well documented that a wide range of people had some part to play in the price run up, from the boys on capitol hill, investment bankers, lenders, appraisers, real estate brokes, TV shows featuring the big money to make by flipping homes, and the public. Not everyone involved on the service side had bad intentions, they were just doing what they were hired to do, but it was all driven by the desire to provide a service, and to get ahead by making money (or the desire for personal gain).
I really, really like the way you framed this, Chet.
The culture who purchased at or near peak, with little to no skin in the game, thought they had their ticket to Easy Street.
The culture who is walking away from their debt, because it is not convenient to owe more than the underlying asset is worth, feel justified in doing so, especially given there are no serious long-term consequences.
The culture who feel entitled to paying no more than 20% of peak are seeking what they feel is their due and it most certainly reeks of emotional revenge.
For now, I am going to stay planted in my own hope that these are sub cultures and not evidence of the majority. God help us all, if I am mistaken, as most folk will find themselves living filthy in tent cities or as squatters, due to unprecidented massive unemployment and econmomic depression.
I also agree. There has been too much entitlement and self-righteous judgment all around.
I would think it would be a "deal" to that buyer if they couldn't afford to live in a certain neighborhood a few years ago but now can afford to be in that neighborhood. Or if someone can buy a bigger or nicer house with that same amount than they could have a few years ago.
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