Why do you think dating/relationships have to be so socially darwinian? (wives, long-term)

[Knight2009]

We see things like this, all the time, on this forum:

1. game vs. no game
2. alpha vs. beta
3. (demonization of) the so-called "nice guy", (elevation of) the "alpha male"

What I don't quite understand though is, am I the only one who sees here, how inherently socially-darwinian these constructs are? What's with the harsh, judging, ruthless mentality, that any guy who is not the stereotypical "Type A", ultra-dominating personality, is doomed to failure, in all things to do with relationships? What about all of the proverbial "Type B" personality guys, who just want to be loved too? Our perception, and our reality is what we make it -- IMO, so many so-called "dating gurus", and the mass media, have made a self-fulfilling prophecy into a reality, so that the game is automatically "rigged" already, in favor of the alpha, and to the alpha's inherent advantage. Bingo -- so the deck is already stacked against the beta in popular society -- **women, have been *conditioned artificially*, to prefer the alpha...so, game over, for the beta**. Blame the 1970s and the "free love" / casual physical intimacy era, for that perhaps?

Another thing that's really eating me here is, don't at least some women understand, on a purely "psychological" level, that the "beta", the "nice guy" (a.k.a., the *underdog*, as opposed to the over-lauded, and over-rated "alpha"), may in fact make a more stable, loving, nurturing provider, and make a better father, for her children? Haven't they even ever seriously considered these things, at all?

When did "beta", become a 4-letter word to be trampled on, and ridiculed? After all, not everyone is cut out or designed to be an alpha, right?

<OK, rant mode off>

[JustJulia]

I think the alpha/beta stuff is just a psychobabble fad, and I hope it passes soon. Humans generally don't behave like pack animals. Some people put way too much stock in it, in my opinion.

[Whyte Byrd]

Something tells me you've only been reading the minorities posts.

[JSizzle225]

Do any intelligent people really take it seriously? I think it has kind of become like a tongue in cheek, joke, around here.

It is ridiculous to try and pigeon hole male behavior into one of two categories. In fact, besides male and female, it is pretty ridiculous to create just two categories for any faction of dating.

I don't really think it's a serious thing. Or if it is it is just terrible psychology. Whoever studies it should be laughed at.

[le roi]

well, y'all can laugh at me if you want, but i find it fascinating. i find that discussion of it helps explain a wide variety of social phenomena that i've observed during my life, but have struggled to explain or understand.

of course you have plenty of people who go off the deep end with it, especially on this forum. i won't name any names.

[mark303]

Because it's true. People may not be shallow enough to be after looks and looks alone. but they are either shallow enough to be after looks and charecter, or shallow enough to be to be after looks without being a good judge of charecter.

The result is that the only thing that really matters are looks and that lends itself to darwinism, and natural selection.

you may not like it, you may tell yourself it has to do with self confidence or personality. but a woman who is 5 ft 5 and weighs 300 pounds is going to have problems even if shes got all the confidence in the world. while a miserable self hating hottie will still maintain a line of suiters.

I don't see how anyone can deny this simple fact based on the evidence the world has provided. but people often choose to beleive what they want to be true.

[le roi]

Originally Posted by Knight2009

Another thing that's really eating me here is, don't at least some women understand, on a purely "psychological" level, that the "beta", the "nice guy" (a.k.a., the *underdog*, as opposed to the over-lauded, and over-rated "alpha"), may in fact make a more stable, loving, nurturing provider, and make a better father, for her children? Haven't they even ever seriously considered these things, at all?

men don't chase the ugly, obese girl. Clearly we must not understand that the ugliest girl in the county may in fact make a more stable, loving, and nurturing wife. yet, we still maintain these standards of looks, even though they may not be in our long-term best interests.

do you think you're "above" this? when meeting a girl, do you ignore what she looks like, and focus on her "inner beauty" ?

in any case, i think you have some warped and extreme ways of defining these words. To me "Beta" is not a noun. A person is not "a beta". Beta is a behavior, and it is synonymous with "weak". Women don't want a guy who behaves as if he is weak. Simple enough?

[Huckleberry3911948]

Originally Posted by le roi

men don't chase the ugly, obese girl. Clearly we must not understand that the ugliest girl in the county may in fact make a more stable, loving, and nurturing wife.

yet, we still maintain these standards, based on what we perceive is good for us.. just like women. Think of "beta" as an adjective, not a noun, and that it is synonymous with "weak". Women don't want a guy who behaves as if he is weak. Simple enough?

not so i married her she was a jerk. harry belefonte lied dont get an ugly to marry you.

[le roi]

Originally Posted by Huckleberry3911948

not so i married her she was a jerk. harry belefonte lied dont get an ugly to marry you.

I never said ugly women were better wives. I said they may be, and that is true. They may be, but most guys aren't going to care enough about an ugly girl to find out.

The point being, you can't criticize the preferences of women as shallow or shortsighted, when the preferences of men are right up the same alley. How hypocritical is it to hit on a girl because she looks good, and then complain that she isn't properly accounting for your "kind heart?"

[mark303]

Originally Posted by le roi

I never said ugly women were better wives. I said they may be, and that is true. They may be, but most guys aren't going to care enough about an ugly girl to find out.

The point being, you can't criticize the preferences of women as shallow or shortsighted, when the preferences of men are right up the same alley.

Both genders are guilty, i'm guilty, your guilty. It's not the act of being guilty that draws people to express it. It's that people are patholigical in their explenations of where someone has gone wrong. It's your confidence, it's your happyness, it's your personality, you just need to meet new people, theres someone for everyone. it's everything but the issue that matters.