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Hans - I'm sorry if you think I'm rude. But honestly - you and I are on completely different wave legnths and in many ways - it really isn't worth my time. I don't like your attitude towards women - which is what I have taken issue with. You even called women "sober and saggy" in one of your posts. I'm sorry - but I find a lot of what you say offensive to me as a woman. I'm not taking issue with you as a person - but I don't really feel like having to defend myself in terms of my honesty, my personality, my etiquette, and all the other things you keep insinuating about me. You say that you would rather have someone just come out with what they have to say - but in all of your posts to me - you have all these statements about me that are thinly veiled insults about who I am, how I view myself, and how honestly I know myself. The thing is - I'm a happily married pregnant woman who is about to give birth any day - who is surrounded by the best family and friends a person could ask for. I'm the person that most people turn to for a shoulder to cry on. I'm a good listener. I'm also a really silly person. I can also point out all my faults to you if you would like. I've been curious about your relationship history because you have all these theories and it sounds like you think you have women all figured out - and it's not a very pleasant portrayal of women. I'm sorry - I'm a woman. I can't help being offended.
Oh - and about a paragraph of mine that you took issue with where I was talking about gender bashing - I'm sorry if it was confusing but I wasn't addressing you. I was talking about all the people who come on here and gender bash. I don't get it. That whole paragraph was more of an inquiry to all the men/women haters out there - not you.
Someone else asked me about what makes someone successful in relationships. Okay - well, I think if you are happy with your love life - that makes you successful. If you don't view the opposite sex (or same sex if you are gay) as the enemy or as some different and lesser species - I think you are successful. And in my experience - the most successful people are people that base their opinions on individuals and not an entire gender, race, etc. Maybe I just attract a different set of people or maybe I'm just not old enough yet (although I feel plenty old!) but I don't have any friends that are so bitter towards the opposite sex. I can't imagine being able to form a successful relationship with someone when you bring a lot of bitterness and negativity to the table from the very beginning. Even my friends that have had lots of crappy relationships still seem to be looking for love and hoping to find it.
And finally - in terms of people changing. We all change. And it seems that we all have a different idea of what it means to sow one's wild oats. I dated a lot. I had fun. I went to parties. I've never done any drugs, I've never slept around, I've never dated losers. I had fun. I was in college. I actually had a boyfriend but we had an open relationship for a year or two because we went to colleges that were half way across the country from each other. We had a good time and 13 years after we broke up - we are still really close friends. We thought we were going to get married right after college and live happily ever after. Well - niether one of us were ready for that as we both found out. We needed to live a little more. And once we did - we realized that we were better friends than lovers. We are now both married and are still really close - the four of us hang out a lot together. Like I said - people are ready for different things at different phases in their lives. Also - sometimes it takes awhile to realize that you are with the wrong person. It sounds like people on here think that you have to meet your soul mate at 15, get married at 18 - and never change at all. Just because people change or they want different experiences at different times in their lives - it doesn't mean that you go from a crack wh*re to an amish housewife - and that you are most likely to miss the life of drugs and prostitution and go back to it. And just because a woman isn't interested in you and you consider yourself a nice guy - it doesn't mean that she only likes jerks. There is so much that goes into finding the right partner. The way that I always looked at it - if a guy wasn't interested in me - it was his loss. If he couldn't appreciate all that I was - I found someone who did. We are all so different - and different things are important to different people. And who I was attracted to at 15 was vastly different from who I am attracted to now. It's just called growing up.
Based on what I read in threads like these, it seems the main issue is the type of men many women want in their "fun years" vs. the type of man they want when they are ready to settle down. These guys seem to feel cheated since their type of guy is rejected for for ten years and then suddenly chased after once stability and marriage is desired.
I could be wrong, but I think many of these guys would have less of an issue if most women were having fun with decent guys (instead of the player/bad boy type) and then desiring to marry decent guys once the fun is over.
Reverse the genders and it may illustrate this point: Let's say a man dates nothing but party girls, strippers or hookers in his 20s (while rejecting decent women) and then decides to marry a decent woman in his 30s or 40s. Should a decent woman be OK being his 2nd choice after rejecting women like her for 10 years, only because he now wants a good mother for his children?
I don't think these things are as black and white as people are making it out to be. I went to 2 parties in college where I hooked up with a guy I had just met. I had no interest in dating these guys - I just wanted to have some fun. I also didn't sleep with them. One of them I ended up dating a couple times but we were not compatible at all. And no - I didn't stop calling him - he stopped calling me. And I really didn't care. I didn't do drugs. It's not that these guys were my first choice and then later I found my husband who was my second choice only because I wanted to settle down. When I was in college - I had fun. I dated. Most of the guys that I dated were super nice - and I'm still in touch with many of them. I'm also still on great terms with all my ex boyfriends.
Let's say you have a long term relationship in college. It doesn't work out and you break up. Then you meet your future spouse, fall madly in love, get married and live happily ever after. Would you consider your spouse your second choice merely because you met them after your college sweetheart? All this talk about 1st choice, second choice - it doesn't make sense to me. Until you really fall in love - all the other stuff is just, well, stuff. I don't look at the random guys I hooked up with or even the nice guys I dated as anything more than experience. I look at my husband as my first choice - regardless of when I met him.
I hope to cause people to look within themselves vs blaming others. You shouldn't change fundamentally. My whole point is that perhaps you need to change your social environment, your social circle, where you meet the opposite sex, et al. Most importantly, you need to learn how to decipher character and learn how to do so quickly. This is the general you, not you cdubs in particular.
I guess I'm tired of women and men complaining about lack of decent people when they really mean "lack of decent people who are attractive to me and compatible with me".
I'm eating lunch so that's all I got for now.
I'm right there with you. I also don't think anyone should change fundamentally - but it seems that many people want others to change fundamentally to suit them. All my friends that try to hide who they are when they are dating or get upset when a guy thinks they are too clingy or whatever - I tell them to just be themselves. If they are a little emotionally clingy - well - find a guy that is okay with it. If in order for them to be acceptable to a guy they are dating they have to make themselves into someone they are not - it isn't worth it. And the same goes for the guy. If they are dating someone that isn't right for them - don't try to change them - move on. Yes - every relationship needs some compromise - but you need to find someone that you are truly compatible with and who loves you for you - not who they want you to be.
And most of my friends that are always in crappy relationships tend to have crappy taste in partners. And yes, they know it. And yes, I tell them so, too.
I hope to cause people to look within themselves vs blaming others. You shouldn't change fundamentally. My whole point is that perhaps you need to change your social environment, your social circle, where you meet the opposite sex, et al. Most importantly, you need to learn how to decipher character and learn how to do so quickly. This is the general you, not you cdubs in particular.
Sounds like boiler-plate relationship advice. Just cut and paste into any relationships discussion.
Here's where we really see whether the advice is relevant to the discussion or not:
Quote:
I guess I'm tired of women and men complaining about lack of decent people when they really mean "lack of decent people who are attractive to me and compatible with me".
It's funny because your "common denominator" comment was for someone who was initiating with women on OKC and not getting responses. So it has nothing to do with him judging the women as being not attractive enough. That's why your advice to Hurricane still seems empty. But let Hurricane be the judge.
Maybe it would be best if armchair quarterbacks do not diversify into armchair psychology. Other than the armchair, they're two totally different fields. Just sayin.
I don't think these things are as black and white as people are making it out to be. I went to 2 parties in college where I hooked up with a guy I had just met. I had no interest in dating these guys - I just wanted to have some fun. I also didn't sleep with them. One of them I ended up dating a couple times but we were not compatible at all. And no - I didn't stop calling him - he stopped calling me. And I really didn't care. I didn't do drugs. It's not that these guys were my first choice and then later I found my husband who was my second choice only because I wanted to settle down. When I was in college - I had fun. I dated. Most of the guys that I dated were super nice - and I'm still in touch with many of them. I'm also still on great terms with all my ex boyfriends.
Let's say you have a long term relationship in college. It doesn't work out and you break up. Then you meet your future spouse, fall madly in love, get married and live happily ever after. Would you consider your spouse your second choice merely because you met them after your college sweetheart? All this talk about 1st choice, second choice - it doesn't make sense to me. Until you really fall in love - all the other stuff is just, well, stuff. I don't look at the random guys I hooked up with or even the nice guys I dated as anything more than experience. I look at my husband as my first choice - regardless of when I met him.
Hi Dewdrop,
I appreciate you sharing your experiences, but realize that people are going to accept their own experiences that counter your own.
As I said to you in another post or thread somewhere, if none of this applies to you then you shouldn't worry about it. You really shouldn't personalize some of the guys' opinions just because it's directed towards a percentage of the female population. Criticizing some women doesn't mean they are bashing all of them. Sure, there are both woman haters and man haters on this forum, but reading between the lines, most of the ones who are assigned the "bitter man" label are really just sharing unpopular (yet valid) opinions.
You have to realize, there really are men out there who have been rejected for years by women and then all of a sudden have tons of female attention in their late 20s or 30s. Upon further inspection, they learn these women dated nothing but jerks in their younger years but now want a responsible guy to marry or help raise the kids they created with the jerks. It can't be a conspiracy, since I hear this from men from all walks of life, in real life in different cities and states, and online, on various types of websites with various audiences. If you aren't that type of woman and didn't reject all decent guys in favor of jerks, they aren't talking about you.
It's kind of how some black posters get mad on these forums when posters discuss black males committing crimes. Hearing someone talk about that doesn't bother me, even though I'm a black male, because I'm not a criminal. I may submit statistics and facts in areas where they are wrong, but I never take it personally.
Based on what I read in threads like these, it seems the main issue is the type of men many women want in their "fun years" vs. the type of man they want when they are ready to settle down. These guys seem to feel cheated since their type of guy is rejected for for ten years and then suddenly chased after once stability and marriage is desired.
REP
Spot on, that's why those guys (if they have balls) just pump and dump women like that (thats what they deserve in the end).
Sounds like boiler-plate relationship advice. Just cut and paste into any relationships discussion.
So? Is any of what I write inaccurate? No, it's just uncomfortable to read for people who would rather not take some of the blame for their own difficulties.
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