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Roles have to be negotiated now. My relationship with my husband is similar to Djuna's. We do what we do best and most enjoy. Oftentimes it follows tradition but not always. Where we get into trouble is when there are expectations that are not met and resentment builds.
Right now at this moment I'm feeling annoyed with my husband because he thinks it's okay to interrupt me while I'm working to ask me to do small favors for him that he is perfectly capable of doing himself. Specifically, he wants me to purchase an online gift for his step-father's upcoming birthday.
Why, in the name of gawd, doesn't he just do it himself?
I told him "no" and now he's grumpy so I'm going to have to have another "discussion" with him about our "roles".
Further, the changing of gender roles might be confusing some people. I'll give you that. But, for those of us who do not acknowledge gender roles in our personal lives, not so much. The money needs to be made, the lawn mowed, the house cleaned, the dog walked, etc, and none of those care whether it's a vagina or a penis getting it done.
I applaud you for that. You honestly do not acknowledge gender roles in your life at all? Ever? That's impressive. I haven't seen a relationship like that in real life.
I'm probably showing my age when I say that many traditional gender roles feel most natural to my husband and I. When we step outside of those roles, it's when the most misunderstandings happen.
But neither of us view gender roles as leader/follower (at least not consciously). It's not a 50-50 arrangement, it's a 100-100 arrangement, even if we're not trail blazers like you and your husband.
For the most part, I think it works out okay in my marriage but as my previous post shows, we're not always on the same page.
I applaud you for that. You honestly do not acknowledge gender roles in your life at all? Ever? That's impressive. I haven't seen a relationship like that in real life.
I'm probably showing my age when I say that many traditional gender roles feel most natural to my husband and I. When we step outside of those roles, it's when the most misunderstandings happen.
But neither of us view gender roles as leader/follower (at least not consciously). It's not a 50-50 arrangement, it's a 100-100 arrangement, even if we're not trail blazers like you and your husband.
For the most part, I think it works out okay in my marriage but as my previous post shows, we're not always on the same page.
At all, ever? I try to imagine what that would look like between us. I suppose when we're pregnant, or better yet, when I'm breast feeding, that will be a defined gender role, tho, it will be between me and our baby. Or, maybe him pulling my chair for dinner? Sure, we do that. He was a fine dining waiter for years, so he has the protocol down pat. Beyond that I'm not sure how it's supposed to play out. I don't see us as trail blazing, rather it's just being who we are. We're both trippers, so that is key. We're both scientists and we love the earth. And that's what we engage about a majority of the time when we're 1:1. Gender doesn't have much of a place in that space. The only time gender roles come up is from outside sources, not within us.
I know one thing for certain. Career women make horrible wives and mothers. Most of them don't want children and they are constantly trying to prove they can make more money than men. They aren't nurturing at all and they focus way too much energy on things you can't take with you when you die. They grow old alone and reflect on the past wondering why they spent so much of their youth being so serious. An older woman told me to get a career woman. I told her HELL NO! I'd rather have my eyes jerked from the sockets repeatedly. It would be a life of hell. You will be at war whenever you enter your home. Your only refuge would be death. Avoid them at all costs. Find a woman that's fun, sweet, appreciative, and nurturing(that's if you can find one out there).
Ok, change of scenario. Let's say you like the cute guy at work you greet each morning at work and have a brief chat. Would you take the initiative to approach him to start up a conversation, ask for his phone number, set a date and ask him out, make reservations, take him to dinner, take him to an event, take care of all expenses, drop him off at home, etc.? You doing it all for him or do you feel this is something a man should do instead?
I don't expect those things done for me and I don't know many who do. What is up with your long list of tasks and why do you feel the need to repeat them every post?
I enjoy the gender roles associated with being a female. I also enjoy the roles I get to do that are decidedly un-female.
I love cooking and cleaning (yes, I genuinely enjoy both), BUT the minute someone tells me that's my role I ain't doing it. MY role is whatever I say it is, NOT society.
I'm girlie, to an extent. I like make-up and clothes, and SHOES!!! Which I'm sure my SO appreciates, but he loves me because I have strong opinions, which I voice often. He loves that we are equals and butt heads.
He in turn became my gay BFF when I was laid up sick after surgery, and watched and participated in commentary, while I indulged in reality shows (don't knock Top Chef!!!). Which is awesome because he has two very manly jobs.
So how has the lack of gender roles affected my relationships? Quite well actually.
At all, ever? I try to imagine what that would look like between us. I suppose when we're pregnant, or better yet, when I'm breast feeding, that will be a defined gender role, tho, it will be between me and our baby. Or, maybe him pulling my chair for dinner? Sure, we do that. He was a fine dining waiter for years, so he has the protocol down pat. Beyond that I'm not sure how it's supposed to play out. I don't see us as trail blazing, rather it's just being who we are. We're both trippers, so that is key. We're both scientists and we love the earth. And that's what we engage about a majority of the time when we're 1:1. Gender doesn't have much of a place in that space. The only time gender roles come up is from outside sources, not within us.
Thank you for elaborating. It sounds like you and your husband are beautifully matched and have a nice thing going.
This discussion about gender roles was focusing on housework, so I was mainly wondering about how your lack of gender roles played out in other ways. I wasn't really thinking about things like pregnancy and childbirth.
My line of questioning was more about things like dancing. I know I like to be led on the dance floor, for instance, yet I still consider dancing a "partnership". I don't take offense or feel less than because I follow my partners lead. And I view my marriage much the same way. It's like a dance. I don't know how a couple can dance well without one person leading.
I'm having trouble expressing myself well so I hope I'm making sense.
Thank you for elaborating. It sounds like you and your husband are beautifully matched and have a nice thing going.
Thanks boodhabunny, and likewise to the two of you.
Quote:
This discussion about gender roles was focusing on housework, so I was mainly wondering about how your lack of gender roles played out in other ways. I wasn't really thinking about things like pregnancy and childbirth.
My line of questioning was more about things like dancing. I know I like to be led on the dance floor, for instance, yet I still consider dancing a "partnership". I don't take offense or feel less than because I follow my partners lead. And I view my marriage much the same way. It's like a dance. I don't know how a couple can dance well without one person leading.
I'm having trouble expressing myself well so I hope I'm making sense.
Dancing is another good one that is often used. I wish we could dance salsa together, tho, my husband's hips don't work they way lol. Trust me, I tried. We went to dancing lessons for our wedding and the teachers were dismayed. If we could then I wouldn't take issue with him doing the traditional leading. We love to dance, but we free style it. Honestly, when my husband dances it's best if everyone stays the heck out of his way. So, I guess context is important here.
An analogy that would fit for us is similar to how it goes at my job. I have a lab mate. We both have different responsibilities, but we have to work together as a team. If we have a project to do, one of us will lead the project, but it depends on what expertise is needed. I defer to him in certain areas and he defers to me in other areas. We can't be experts at everything, so it's more symbiotic. I see my relationship that way.
Still, I'm not sure what it looks like with one person being the primary leader in a relationship. I'm curious about specific examples if you have any. For example, in a traditional relationship, as I understand it, it would fall to the husband to make the decision of where to buy a home and what kind of home. Right? We looked at a lot of homes when we were shopping, but the decision did not fall to him. It was mutual. I liked one home, but he thought too much work needed to be done. He liked another home, but it was too far from my job. We finally found one that we both could live with via compromise.
I know one thing for certain. Career women make horrible wives and mothers. Most of them don't want children and they are constantly trying to prove they can make more money than men. They aren't nurturing at all and they focus way too much energy on things you can't take with you when you die. They grow old alone and reflect on the past wondering why they spent so much of their youth being so serious. An older woman told me to get a career woman. I told her HELL NO! I'd rather have my eyes jerked from the sockets repeatedly. It would be a life of hell. You will be at war whenever you enter your home. Your only refuge would be death. Avoid them at all costs. Find a woman that's fun, sweet, appreciative, and nurturing(that's if you can find one out there).
Nice broad brush. I work with career women all day, every day. Most of them are married with children. Most of them take the time to volunteer in their communities. And most appear happy from where I sit.
Nice broad brush. I work with career women all day, every day. Most of them are married with children. Most of them take the time to volunteer in their communities. And most appear happy from where I sit.
Didn't say women with jobs. My mother had a job until she retired. But she wasn't defined by her work. She didn't dedicate hours of overtime(unless she needed extra money) and she didn't put my father and children second to climbing corporate ladders. She left work at the workplace. It was a means to an end. You're not describing "career women".
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So, I guess context is important here. 
