"Men telling their dates how to dress" (issues, handsome, respect)

[captaincatfish]

Originally Posted by Vic 2.0

I'm looking to discuss the difference between definitions of "brutal honesty", as well as "tact", more than anything.

There's been a lot of focus on the question "Why would a guy do this?", which I've answered by giving practical reasons. But there hasn't been much focus on the question, "Why not?", which has been answered with anything but.

'The Gambler'? Y'know the one---'you got to know when to hold 'em, know when to fold 'em, know when to walk away, know when to run'?

I bolded the one part because, there's a part of me that hates to see you basically getting carved like a turkey each time you try to answer posts...I understand, you asked the question with the best of intentions, but over the course of 20 pages now, it's devolved into a bunch of ladies and gentlemen barking back and forth at each other like a roomful of overheated Yorkshire Terriers...

Suffice to say though, your name should be Gunga Din and not Vic, because you're a better man than me...since I first joined here in 2006, I've had to on occasion, disobey a particular life rule I have for myself---to wit:

If you bark at me, then trust me, I'm gonna bark right back

I do this because sometimes, my barking back at someone doesn't solve anything...I really wish that this thread hadn't succumbed to that, because you DID raise a very interesting topic, and there HAVE been very good and lively answers here, from both women and men...

But this brings me to another of my rules, which ahs sometimes gotten me in trouble here in CityData Land, and that's this one:

If you ask me a question, or if I have an opinion on something, then you will get my answer in no uncertain terms---head-on point-blank non PG-rated, be you man or woman, and depending on my mood at the time, should you disagree with me, I will either engage in spirited cross-dialogue with you, or if I have offended, then man-up and apologize...or once again, depending on my mood, I'll tell you to kiss my a** and go skydive with a lead parachute...

Because I take crap from no one, male female child or beast...if I have something to say, I'm gonna say it, out loud, 24-7-365---that's just the way I've always been, online and offline

Vic, again, I applaud you for both your intent when you started the thread, and your guts for hanging in and trying to give all an honest answer

[Vic 2.0]

Originally Posted by UnexpectedError

Why not? Because, as evidenced by this poll and the responses it received, most women would find it offensive.

I understand that. But that's just the thing. If (IF) the woman's not inclined to compromise, it'd be better to end it quick than to wait and have to end it later. And as we've already discussed, if the man just stops calling and doesn't say anything (or tell the truth) as to why, he looks like a jerk that way too (which is, best I can tell, the only "reason" to avoid saying anything at all). Maybe not to you, but to many women out there. Or else they may guess incorrectly about why he stopped calling. A whole bunch of assumptions that get in the way, this is what we opt for by not opening the door to communication right off the bat. Yes, even about something as sacred as short shorts.

Originally Posted by Braunwyn

I don't equate nitpicking with meaningful conversation

And I don't equate this with nitpicking.

[Vic 2.0]

Thanks again, Capt.! I do "bark back" at times, but not here because I don't believe people are attacking me so much as the controlling type of guy they think I'm more or less defending. And I love that Kenny Rogers song! But me, I "know when to walk away" when I see that the woman isn't willing to discuss something. You can't know until you try

[Dewdrop93]

Originally Posted by Vic 2.0

I understand that. But that's just the thing. If (IF) the woman's not inclined to compromise, it'd be better to end it quick than to wait and have to end it later. And as we've already discussed, if the man just stops calling and doesn't say anything (or tell the truth) as to why, he looks like a jerk that way too (which is, best I can tell, the only "reason" to avoid saying anything at all). Maybe not to you, but to many women out there. Or else they may guess incorrectly about why he stopped calling. A whole bunch of assumptions that get in the way, this is what we opt for by not opening the door to communication right off the bat. Yes, even about something as sacred as short shorts.



And I don't equate this with nitpicking.

Okay - it is nitpicking. And the thing is - if my husband had an issue with me - we would discuss it. We have both compromised many times in our relationship. However - he doesn't tell me how to dress and I don't tell him how to keep his hair. These are expressions of who we are. I love him - all of him. Sometimes his outfits can make me chuckle - but I wouldn't have him change it for anything in the world! And in terms of compromising - that is something you do with someone you are in a committed relationship with - not someone who is picking you up for a first date and prefers you wear a different outfit.

[Yzette]

Originally Posted by captaincatfish

Because I take crap from no one, male female child or beast...if I have something to say, I'm gonna say it, out loud, 24-7-365---that's just the way I've always been, online and offline

The right to say what you want does not also guarantee the right to be taken seriously.

And it's better to be silent and thought a fool than to open your mouth and prove it.

Hubert Humphrey and Mark Twain, respectively.

[UnexpectedError]

Originally Posted by Vic 2.0

I understand that. But that's just the thing. If (IF) the woman's not inclined to compromise, it'd be better to end it quick than to wait and have to end it later. And as we've already discussed, if the man just stops calling and doesn't say anything (or tell the truth) as to why, he looks like a jerk that way too (which is, best I can tell, the only "reason" to avoid saying anything at all). Maybe not to you, but to many women out there. Or else they may guess incorrectly about why he stopped calling. A whole bunch of assumptions that get in the way, this is what we opt for by not opening the door to communication right off the bat. Yes, even about something as sacred as short shorts.



And I don't equate this with nitpicking.

I agree, best to end things quickly if one can't look past their date's attire. And I'm finding out that, though I'm not alone in my disappearing act preference, most people seem to want some words of finality. But that doesn't mean you have to detail exactly why you are ending things. There are plenty of vague but honest things one can say along the lines of "I'm sorry, I just don't think we should see each other anymore." or "I don't think we click." I've never known a person to demand specifics as to why a one or two date relationship is coming to a close.

[Yzette]

Originally Posted by UnexpectedError

I agree, best to end things quickly if one can't look past their date's attire. And I'm finding out that, though I'm not alone in my disappearing act preference, most people seem to want some words of finality. But that doesn't mean you have to detail exactly why you are ending things. There are plenty of vague but honest things one can say along the lines of "I'm sorry, I just don't think we should see each other anymore." or "I don't think we click." I've never known a person to demand specifics as to why a one or two date relationship is coming to a close.

Wow, you're lucky! I've had some real obtuse and relentless people demand reasons. Best response there is, "You want a list?"

[Caltovegas]

In 2012 a man can get killed or at the very least get into a serious situation if a woman is dressed a certain way. I myself have told GROWN women that something was too revealing and I was not about to put my life at risk if some fool makes a comment.

I firmly believe you attract what you project.

[Braunwyn]

Originally Posted by Vic 2.0

And I don't equate this with nitpicking.

Obviously you don't. It's normal for you. To me, it would be a pain in the ass to deal with. Who needs that from strangers? Life is too short imo to be bothered with people judging you right off the bat.

[UnexpectedError]

Originally Posted by Yzette

Wow, you're lucky! I've had some real obtuse and relentless people demand reasons. Best response there is, "You want a list?"

Oof, another reason I prefer the disappearing act when ending frivolous relationships.