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Old 04-07-2012, 12:59 PM
 
2,560 posts, read 2,634,791 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SomeGuyInFairfax View Post
Re: #2 -- When a woman needlessly withholds sex from a man his first though, even if fleeting, is "Where else can I get some?"
Though I do enjoy the trope of "he'll cheat if you don't X". From my experiences/observations and what many guys I met & know say as well as statistics that thought tends to comes whether she "withholds" or not.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SomeGuyInFairfax View Post
Re: #3 -- True. However some women can become quite resentful of a husband's/boyfriend's interests that remove focus from her.
I'm quite unsure of what your however has to do with that from my experiences/observations that most women give the guy his time but find that they don't get the same treatment.

What does resentment of his interests removing focus from her have to do with my statement that many find out that free time is not a two way street?
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Old 04-07-2012, 01:06 PM
 
8,679 posts, read 15,245,698 times
Reputation: 15342
Quote:
Originally Posted by SomeGuyInFairfax View Post
Men:

List your key insights and advice that you believe women MUST understand in order to effortlessly relate to us.

I'll start:

1.) Ignite his protective, nurturing instinct.
2.) Never use sex as currency or to reward/punish him.
3.) Respect his need for personal time for hobbies and other creative endeavors.

A man will tolerate nearly anything a woman does if she obeys rules 1 and 2. He will give her a blank check if she additionally obeys rule 3.
Please take the first item back to the patriarchy circa 1950. We don't need paternalism, as we are not children. We do not need to be nurtured. Or, at least, the healthy among us don't. We're adults. Well-adjusted men understand this, and they want capable, confident women, not little girls who can't capture a bug under a glass and let it go in the back yard. The days of standing on a chair screaming because there's a mouse in the house are long gone--or dang well should be.

The second item is subterfuge for the brotherhood. Sorry, no, you aren't getting laid if you sit on the couch and play video games while your partner attends to cooking, cleaning, and child-rearing after a full day at work. We do not owe you sex, and you are not entitled to sex regardless of your bad behavior. Ever. If we don't feel like it, or we are angry at you, or there are issues in the relationship, we do not have to bang you. If we are angry or annoyed with you, you can be assured that we are turned off by you and do not want your hands on us. If you want sex, be the kind of man your partner wants to have sex with.

The third item is not gender-specific. Healthy men and women give each other some alone time and don't feel the need to be up in each other's faces all day.

And finally, your use of the word "tolerate" is off-putting. It assumes that women automatically behave in ways that men would find intolerable, but if they do your three things, men won't mind.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SomeGuyInFairfax View Post
I am very single.
It's obvious.
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Old 04-07-2012, 01:10 PM
 
2,560 posts, read 2,634,791 times
Reputation: 1484
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yzette View Post
If you want sex, be the kind of man your partner wants to have sex with.
From my experiences/observations that concept tends to be called using sex as a weapon as it seems many view being his partner means you owe him sex and that whether she wants it or not is irrelevant.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yzette View Post
The third item is not gender-specific. Healthy men and women give each other some alone time and don't feel the need to be up in each other's faces all day.

And finally, your use of the word "tolerate" is off-putting. It assumes that women automatically behave in ways that men would find intolerable, but if they do your three things, men won't mind.
I'm not sure that would be such a way off base assumption as going by many MRAs, male anti feminists, my observations/experiences, and many guys I met & know if a woman is not doing what the man wants she's behaving intolerably.
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Old 04-07-2012, 01:16 PM
 
8,679 posts, read 15,245,698 times
Reputation: 15342
Quote:
Originally Posted by udolipixie View Post
From my experiences/observations that concept tends to be called using sex as a weapon as it seems many view being his partner means you owe him sex and that whether she wants it or not is irrelevant.



I'm not sure that would be such a way off base assumption as going by many MRAs, male anti feminists, my observations/experiences, and many guys I met & know if a woman is not doing what the man wants she's behaving intolerably.

No, it's not. Bad behavior is a turn-off. If a man is a lazy slob who lets himself go, talks down to his partner, treats her poorly, runs around on her, or otherwise behaves like a complete jackarse, well, only a codependent lunatic would be able to get wet for a man like that, in plain English.

As for the male anti-feminists, they will never, ever have to worry about my behavior, because I don't get with aholes to begin with.
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Old 04-07-2012, 01:25 PM
 
2,560 posts, read 2,634,791 times
Reputation: 1484
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yzette View Post
No, it's not. Bad behavior is a turn-off. If a man is a lazy slob who lets himself go, talks down to his partner, treats her poorly, runs around on her, or otherwise behaves like a complete jackarse, well, only a codependent lunatic would be able to get wet for a man like that, in plain English.
I agree though your example of bad behavior are extreme to me. most men going by my observations/experiences seem to think of it as it doesn't matter what you feel towards me or relationship (anger, sadness, resentment, unloved, lacking attraction) if I'm not being criminally bad (rape, abuse) you owe me sex as I'm good by my definition so any negative feelings towards me are irrelevant.

I was just stating what that concept of being a man your partner wants to have sex tends to be labeled using sex as a weapon or bitterly begging for sex. Whether it's communicating more, romance, doing your part in the household or what many guys call helping out for some reason, doing your part in parenting or what many guys call babysitting. Seems that will the quality/quantity of romance/maintaining attraction to desire sex is called the honeymoon phase and acceptable o decline the quality/quantity of sex is not and called a bait/switch if it declines. Oddly enough to me sex is often regarded as a duty/obligation but one that the gal can't treat like one especially one she dislikes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yzette View Post
As for the male anti-feminists, they will never, ever have to worry about my behavior, because I don't get with aholes to begin with.
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Old 04-07-2012, 01:49 PM
 
Location: Fairfax, VA
1,020 posts, read 1,008,708 times
Reputation: 1349
Quote:
Originally Posted by erasure View Post
Sorry, but after reading this, I can't help but picturing a boy, writing a note to his parents after a bad day...

1.) I am mighty and powerful - don't you ever forget it, I have a magic wand - just watch me.
2.) ..And don't you ever try to take candies away from me when I've been bad..
3.) The toys are all mine, and when I'm playing with toys, I shouldn't be bothered, because it's important. And so that you wouldn't bother me with dinner and stuff, I can even close the door if I want to.

( Sorry again - nothing personal OP, just thinking about my son...)
Re: #1 -- Or, "Afford me ample opportunities to extend simple acts of kindness."

Re: #2 -- You defaulted to the negative. And it is equally iffy to use sex as a reward.

Re: #3 -- Not a real analogy. This one is simple being allowed time to do something as simple as read a book, or do some work, etc. Many men, surprisingly, do not always have that luxury.
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Old 04-07-2012, 01:55 PM
 
Location: Fairfax, VA
1,020 posts, read 1,008,708 times
Reputation: 1349
Quote:
Originally Posted by udolipixie View Post
Though I do enjoy the trope of "he'll cheat if you don't X". From my experiences/observations and what many guys I met & know say as well as statistics that thought tends to comes whether she "withholds" or not.


I'm quite unsure of what your however has to do with that from my experiences/observations that most women give the guy his time but find that they don't get the same treatment.

What does resentment of his interests removing focus from her have to do with my statement that many find out that free time is not a two way street?

Cheating is probably much more assured if she withholds.

True, some women may not get the same treatment/it is not always a two-way street but I was staying within the context of men's wishes/expectations.
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Old 04-07-2012, 02:05 PM
 
2,560 posts, read 2,634,791 times
Reputation: 1484
Quote:
Originally Posted by SomeGuyInFairfax View Post
Cheating is probably much more assured if she withholds.
Probably, probably not. It's a toss up to me.

Considering that cheating is likely a thought either way, would be taken up if the opportunity arises, and what seems to be an increasingly common attitude towards from men using sex as currency or a punishment/reward system doesn't seem a disadvantage to me or the gals who have taken the advice.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SomeGuyInFairfax View Post
True, some women may not get the same treatment/it is not always a two-way street but I was staying within the context of men's wishes/expectations.
I was questioning how does resentment of his interests removing focus from her have to do with my statement that many find out that free time is not a two way street. I stated I agreed with your third point but it doesn't seem that it's a two way street and you stated "true. however" and to me that however implied relevance.
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Old 04-07-2012, 02:07 PM
 
Location: New Jersey
8,711 posts, read 11,714,133 times
Reputation: 7604
Quote:
Originally Posted by SomeGuyInFairfax View Post
Men:

List your key insights and advice that you believe women MUST understand in order to effortlessly relate to us.

I'll start:

1.) Ignite his protective, nurturing instinct.
2.) Never use sex as currency or to reward/punish him.
3.) Respect his need for personal time for hobbies and other creative endeavors.

A man will tolerate nearly anything a woman does if she obeys rules 1 and 2. He will give her a blank check if she additionally obeys rule 3.

Oh look just what I wanted. More information on how to conduct myself for a man's approval because Cosmo and Glamour aren't enough.
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Old 04-07-2012, 02:16 PM
 
Location: Fairfax, VA
1,020 posts, read 1,008,708 times
Reputation: 1349
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yzette View Post
Please take the first item back to the patriarchy circa 1950. We don't need paternalism, as we are not children. We do not need to be nurtured. Or, at least, the healthy among us don't. We're adults. Well-adjusted men understand this, and they want capable, confident women, not little girls who can't capture a bug under a glass and let it go in the back yard. The days of standing on a chair screaming because there's a mouse in the house are long gone--or dang well should be.
Nurturing can be as simple as supporting her endeavors and ideas, e.g., her notions of what constitutes a healthy woman.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yzette View Post
The second item is subterfuge for the brotherhood. Sorry, no, you aren't getting laid if you sit on the couch and play video games while your partner attends to cooking, cleaning, and child-rearing after a full day at work. We do not owe you sex, and you are not entitled to sex regardless of your bad behavior. Ever. If we don't feel like it, or we are angry at you, or there are issues in the relationship, we do not have to bang you. If we are angry or annoyed with you, you can be assured that we are turned off by you and do not want your hands on us. If you want sex, be the kind of man your partner wants to have sex with.
What if he is the one working and she is sitting on the couch playing games? Or i if both are working and neither is sitting around? It is not balanced to choose one extreme example to make a blanket statement.

It is obvious that sex is unlikely when angry or if she is ill or on her period or some other such reason and I saw no reason to specify that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yzette View Post
The third item is not gender-specific. Healthy men and women give each other some alone time and don't feel the need to be up in each other's faces all day.

And finally, your use of the word "tolerate" is off-putting. It assumes that women automatically behave in ways that men would find intolerable, but if they do your three things, men won't mind.

It's obvious.

The gender-specifics were addressed in a previous post. "Tolerate" is off-putting and was used to describe the petty and major annoyances men often complain of. It assumes nothing other than what you chose to interpret. But many men will overlook a lot of those things when they are generally satisfied.

"It's obvious" = petty annoyance that I effortlessly tolerate.
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