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Was this rape and is she a victim ? It depends on how old she is and what state she's living in if this was consensual. It depends on if she ever said "no" or "stop" if she's not too young.
Whatever the case, "John's brother" is obviously a jackass. I think everyone agrees with that. Not someone anyone who isn't also a jackass should want to hang out with.
However, the OP had multiple opportunities to heed the advice of her boyfriend, and avoid contact with these *******s. But she chose their company over respecting the wishes of someone who loved her.
Bottom line is her situation was completely avoidable, and she needs to learn how to avoid situations like this in the future. That needs to be the learning experienced out of this for her.
This is, IMO, definitely the take-home message for the OP.
If she literally believes she was raped given the laws of her state, she should go to the police. Anyone who has been raped should go to the police. Period.
Um, folks, we still do not know how much "older" this older brother is. She's 17 or 18 (I can't remember which). He could be as young as 19. We don't know. We do know he's in college. That's about it.
There are definitely close-in-age laws in most states that lessen the crime/punishability factor, so that's another thing to consider.
As for "drugging and raping her," the image there is that she innocently went to a party or something and someone gave her acid and then threw her down on a bed. Or even at least that she was so drunk she couldn't make a decision and wasn't coherent, another thing that definitely doesn't bear out considering her uninterrupted memory of each night/day in question.
She very clearly remembers the detail of every incident (and then went on to go ahead and do this again while sober) so I doubt that part but I'm not the prospective judge in this case. So that part is only my observation, common sense and opinion. These three still do not relate immediately to "fact" except as decided by a judge and jury if that's the route the OP goes (she hasn't said she plans to, it's just that it's been brought up over and over again on this thread by others besides the OP). A judge might deem it as rape, s/he might not, we can't know.
She may be easily led, she may be fairly easily taken advantage of, she may be confused as to how to get attention and keep friends, but none of these actually mean "rape." I am not trying to "revictimize the victim" or anything here. However, I do hope the OP sincerely seeks new ways to have and keep friends, to have an enjoyable time (without drinking, and not alone with groups of guys who have already proven themselves many times to see her as an object/a plaything, and with friends who aren't "pushy") and that she begins to learn the value of being with and being loyal to someone who really does have her interests at heart (i.e. her boyfriend, or former boyfriend).
Being young, stupid (as many of us are while young, I surely was, dear God it makes me shudder), and "going along" because someone whines at and wheedles you do not automatically equate to rape, I think you'd have to actually have been raped (even coercively) to realize this. Once again, though, perhaps this was indeed legal rape, we can not know either way based on what little we've read on a message board.
I only read the first page of this thread because the OP was so long it almost sounded like a Lifetime movie. Sounds to me like this girl is a very immature teenager with no self-esteem or morals. From what I read, seems like the BF made the right move...away from this little girl. If she flat out told him that she wasn't leaving when he caught her feeling this other guy up, then she wanted to be there and not with BF. She knew exactly what she was doing and being drunk doesn't cover it in the excuse/reason department. BF, don't keep walking away....RUN! Never look back! It's obvious from her behavior that she not only didn't care about your relationship status, but she aslo didn't care about your friendship or you as a person either. Afterall, even though she was "saving her virginity" for her BF and was in a relationship with said BF, she "somehow" gave it up to this random guy. Really?!? Grow up, little girl. Seems to me that she was not a virgin at all and she seems to have viewed her BF as the doormat she could keep walking on to get back in good graces with. Such the user. I really think and hope she gets help to straighten her life up before she "just happens" to get pregnant by a guy she can't remember or who won't remember her.
If she flat out told him that she wasn't leaving when he caught her feeling this other guy up, then she wanted to be there and not with BF.
Agree.
Flat-out telling your boyfriend to his face, standing right there that you're going to continue having sex with another man right in front of him does not exactly sound like rape to me.
If i were your boy friend, i'd be just a wee bit angry. But he seems pretty desperate. Who knows, maybe you can get away with this on an ongoing basis. If not, find someone who can.
You seem to be avoiding the fact that she also chose what to do with her body in that case. She was not unconscious, she was not pulled into an alley, she was not threatened, she was not bribed, she didn't say no, she didn't think no (according to her descriptions), she describes every act in detail with no distaste, only the fear that when she's done it once again, her boyfriend might not continue to go out with her. She didn't object to the acts while they were going on, she only objected to them afterward and not on the basis of how she herself felt about it, but on the basis of whether or not she could still have a boyfriend waiting around afterward.
She also made the choice but you continuously say she isn't responsible because the men (also) made the choice.
In fact, in the second fooling-around episode she describes with the friend of the brother, she wasn't drunk at all, she was even interrupted and yet she still didn't stop, she and he kept fooling around.
How is it rape if both (or all) partners made a conscious choice? It's rape because even if she decided to go, drink, strip, sit in laps, ultimately sleep with another guy and THEN begin to sleep with him again...but deep down it might have been, in our opinion for the wrong reasons?
That's rape?
You do a horrible disservice to women who really are raped. Dear God, no wonder nobody believes them half the time. Just great.
I haven't avoided that she chose what to do with her body. Nowhere did I once much less continuously say she isn't responsible because the men (also) made the choice. In fact show me where I once stated she is not in control of her choices...oh that's right you can't because I didn't. In fact I stated she is in control of her choices.
I did state that I disagree with the notion of being in control of your body as people can chose to do what they want to one's body without one's control. That is not stating she isn't responsible for what she chose to do that's me stating I disagree with the notion of having complete control over one's body since others can act upon it without one's wishes.
Nowhere did I state, suggest, imply, or mention it's rape if both or all partners makes a conscious choice. You do a horrible disservice to yourself by bull****ting and trying to trope this as justifying why rape victims aren't believed. More likely it's mindsets like yours that rape victims aren't believed.
How did you get me stating it's rape if both partners make a conscious choice/she's not responsible because he made a choice from: I disagree with the notion one has control over their body because others can act on it without one's wishes equates? I mean my statement isn't even referring to her scenario it's disagreeing with your notion that one can be in control of their body.
Flat-out telling your boyfriend to his face, standing right there that you're going to continue having sex with another man right in front of him does not exactly sound like rape to me.
I mean come on.
This is rape?
Really?
Plenty of rape victims continue to have sex with their attacker in my experience just because it doesn't 'sound' like rape to you doesn't necessarily make it so.
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