I wasn't there for my Fiance when she needed me, and she doesn't forgive me. Should I let her go, or ask her to stay? (date, boyfriends)
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I have been with my GF-now-fiance for 4 years now. She is the most amazing person i ever met, and always makes me want to learn and grow and fight to make our dreams come true.
She has been in a lot of abusive relationships in the past, and generally has had a fairly unhappy life with parents and boyfriends and people in general. She always says that noone has ever treated her like a real person, they've just kept her around as a doll or a trophy and only loved the idea of her and her interests, not who she actually was. Or they only wanted sex and didn't care about her feelings.
I tried for three years to prove that i was different from that...that i did care about her and i wanted to support her and her dreams. Finally i could see she was opening up and actually told me that she really trusted me. I had no doubt that she was the best person i could ever meet, so i proposed a year ago. We were going to wait three years for the wedding to have enough time to plan and save money, and also to fit her family traditions.
She has a very traditional family and half of them wouldn't even be able to attend, as they are overseas in Asia. We both really wanted to represent them in the wedding by following their traditions, but all we've gotten from vendors and planners and friends and even family is grief about how we are wasting money or how we shouldn't bother following tradition if the people who care wont even be there, but we both thought it was worth it.
About a month and a half ago, we were both going through a lot of stress because i had just graduated and realized i screwed up my life with my degree plans. She has just ALMOST gotten her dream job (writing for her favorite publishing company and working with someone she's idolized) but lost it due to her own miscommunication. We were both dealing with moving to a new place, only temporarily, while still commuting 2 hours for a couple days every week for everything we still had going on in our own town. We were both unemployed and just trying to figure what the hell to do with our lives.
Anyway, we had a particularly stressful week and went through really unpleasant experiences. Since she was feeling like opening up, we allowed two friends she felt comfortable with into our sex life, as she needed more good experiences with people, and i had never been with anyone else, and felt loyal to her. It was kindof impulsive, but i agreed. Long story short, it was too much for me, and we backed out. She was fine with it but i couldn't handle it, which made her feel hurt and violated. Afterwards, we tried to have some "private time" to re-assert ourselves, which she really needed, but i couldn't perform, which made her feel like i rejected her.
Afterwards, we met some of the other couple's friends, to try to open up and understand, who were apparently part of the BDSM community, and they just treated her like someone without feelings, just talking about sex, even without knowing went went on. She couldn't handle it, as there was another girl who created a "fetish personality" (used for roleplay, i suppose) that was essentially the same as her natural personality. Everyone kept telling her "you have to meet this girl, shes just like you, you'll get along so well". My fiance wanted to learn more so she could feel better, but i just wanted to stop interacting with those people. She ended up confronting the girl (in a calm and polite way), telling her that people were treating her differently because of how the girl was portraying herself, but she somehow made my fiance feel like she was picking on her, making her feel guilty and worse. I told her that it would have been better to just not interact with these people, as it wasn't healthy for her.
We had some difficulty but she forgave me for everything because she loved me, but after a few days the emotions she went through triggered a repressed memory of a time she was raped. I held her as she cried herself to sleep that night.
I was still in a state of shock from everything that had been going on. We still weren't set in our life and we were unemployed, so i just fell back into our daily routine of trying to find a job. She told me she wanted to have the wedding this year so she could feel like she belonged to me and was safe with me, but i told her no because it would be 4 1/2 months away, we were still bot established and we didn't have the time or money to achieve what we had wanted. She came up with a financial plan and pointed out how it would be a good idea to do it sooner both for our families before we move out of state and so we can use it as a new start to life. I couldn't really understand because of the stress and said we could do it next year, but didn't think it would work this year.
I took a few days so i could calm down and relax and think clearly about everything that had happened and decided that it was a good idea. I realized though that i had been prettymuch ignoring her and keeping to the same old routine in the mean time. She was feeling particularly lost and hopeless and doubting our wedding one night so i took her out to dinner and said that we should do it. She told me that she didn't believe i really felt that way and that i was only agreeing to make her feel better. I told her that she had brought up good points about our life and our family and i agreed.
She told me that she couldn't feel the same way about the wedding, and that it felt like i wasn't just rejecting the idea, i was rejecting her. She said the thought of the dress she picked out just made her sad and angry, but once again, because she loves me, she decided to try it with me, hoping that planning our wedding and actually going through with it would make her feel differently.
We started planning things, but didn't have anyone to talk to about it. We took out the money we needed from our savings to be the wedding budget. My father and uncle started giving me grief about spending money when neither of us had a job.
Then our cat developed cancer... Our pets have always been like family members to us, and especially her. She always said she preferred pets to children (though we had talked about having human children someday) It took us a week and a half of vet visits to even figure out what was wrong, and that we couldn't fix it. And, as I knew, nearly everyone in her life who HAD treated her well had died from cancer. We ended up spending the rest of our wedding budget on figuring out what was wrong, and i borrowed some money from my parents in order to give our cat a basic treatment so she could live for maybe a couple more weeks, so we could say goodbye.
My fiance was devastated, but i tried to make her feel better in any way that I could. Unfortunately she has a habit of spending money when she's depressed (which she has acknowledged is a bad trait), so i tried to be careful with money, and tried even harder to get a job (ignoring my field and applying at fast food places). She started resenting me for saying 'no' when she wanted to go out for sushi, or telling her that we couldn't afford something... She told me that I was controlling her life, and I had been.
Our cat passed away about a week ago. She was devastated.
We kept getting grief from everyone around us about the wedding, and I had a day or two of thinking we should wait, because we were trying to plan the wedding not only for ourselves, but for our families, and it seemed like they didn't approve. I told her what i had been thinking, and she said she was thinking the same thing, but we agreed that we would try to find the perfect location, and if we could find one nearby, that would be a sign. I, once again, let stress get the better of me and forgot WHY we wanted to do the wedding early in the first place.
I finally got a job yesterday. The same day that she decided that she can't handle it anymore. I can finally help plan everything, let her do what she wants while she tries to get another writing contract, and finally devote my time to her and NOT on job hunting hours a day. But she says she can't handle it anymore, that she hasn't cared about the wedding, or anything else in her life for more than a month.
She told me that she still loves me, but she feels like i betrayed her, lied to her, and that she can't trust me anymore. She said that once someone loses her trust, they can't ever get it back. She doesn't think the wedding would mean anything, doesn't even want to have it.
Her only really options are
1. leave me and move in with her mother (which is not a healthy environment, and i know would keep her from achieving her goals) and never speak to me again.
2. Start stripping so she can earn enough for her own place (she has tried to start stripping in the past to fix our money issues, but i wouldn't let her because i know it would make everything worse for her) and again, never speak to me again.
3. Stay with me and not care about anything in her life, or me, but play the perfect happy girlfriend. She would still go through with the wedding, if I wanted
She wanted me to decide, saying "you decide everything anyway". It wouldn't be fair to her to decide that she should stay with me when iv'e hurt her so much, but I know that staying with me is her best chance for doing what she wants with her life: moving out of state, maybe even to Asia eventually, writing, helping people through charity, and being able to swim in the ocean every day if she wants. If she goes back to her mothers, it'll impede her, and she's acknowledged she'll just stay in that town. Same if she gets her own place. If she gets a regular job, or starts stripping, she wont want to stop once she's used to something.
All three of the options wouldn't be healthy for her, but I think that I could regain her trust eventually, and maybe help her do something great. At least make her happy someday. I'm honestly worried about what she'll do if she leaves. She might fall in with the wrong people, get into another abusive relationship, turn to drinking or drugs, or even just kill herself, which she's said isn't my concern, because once she leaves, it doesn't matter to me what she does.
I hate that I've done this to her. I hate that i succumbed to stress, and couldn't realize she was crying out for help. I wasn't there for her when she needed me.
It's not fair of me to decide she should stay, when she always says i never let her make any decisions...but on the other hand, i feel obligated to help her. We've been through so much together, and it all got screwed up so fast. I think I should at least try to fix it, or help her through it.
I love her, and I know I would never forget her, and that noone would ever measure up. Even though she's been through so much, she's always been such a strong person, always mad me want to grow, be more responsible, and want to DO something with my life. She's the smartest person I've ever met, has the most interests, always gets ME interested in new things. She's made me appreciate class and culture and really look at the world around me.
I just don't know what to do. It's not that i don't want to lose her...i could understand that as an acceptable option, I just know she'll throw away her life (metaphorically or literally) if she does leave. Maybe if asked her to stay, she might get better. Or maybe she'd just resent me.
If she left and took our dog, maybe the responsibility would keep her from killing herself, or hurting herself, but she'd still throw her life away in another way...
Last night she told me she would stay just because I was being so pathetic. That's exactly different from what she did with her last, abusive boyfriend, for three years. She said it's different, because she really did love me, and she never did with him. She says that even though she doesn't trust me, and doesn't believe i love her, she'd stay.
I just don't know what to do. I'm going to try to make her feel better in any way I can. I'm taking her on a cruise-tour of local lakes later today, which is something she's always wanted to do. Maybe i'll write her a song...she always wanted me to get back into music.
I really feel like I should let her go, because it's not healthy to be with me if she can't trust me...but maybe i'm the only one that can help her through everything. She doesn't have anyone else to lean on, and without me, she'd be lost.
She's already turned down couple's counseling and the "take a break for awhile" idea... What do you guys think?
Welcome to city-data and thank you for an entertaining first post.
It's rather interesting that her dream job, and one she ALMOST got, is writing for a periodical. However, once you two breakup her only option is stripping.
Make an agreement to live together as roommates, and not have sex with each other or anyone else, or date anyone, for 12 months. And also not to plan the wedding.
Agree that if/when you do get married, the planning phase will be brief and there will not be a long engagement.
You can always change your minds on both these things later, but agreeing to take a break from them now should take the pressure off.
She is probably not going to be able to heal emotionally from the rape if she is having sex with you or anyone else. But if you date other people, that will just add drama.
A long engagement sends the message to her and to your friends and family that you two are not really going to get married. Don't do that.
I agree that you both should see counselors, separately.
honestly dude, if she isn't willing to help there isnt much you can do. you have to start asking yourself if this is really what you want out of life
you are not a slave to this person just because she has emotional issues. if you have tried to help her at every turn and it has always been spat on....im sure you know the definition of insanity
its time she actually started to take care of herself instead of having someone take care of her
seek some help separately from her, get your head in the right place and out of all the drama. things will become a hell of a lot more clear for you
Google "borderline personality disorder" and there will be a picture of your girlfriend. Get out while you can (you have the perfect opportunity now). Cut off all contact or she will find a way to drag you back in again with guilt and lies.
--Extreme reactions—including panic, depression, rage, or frantic actions—to abandonment, whether real or perceived
--A pattern of intense and stormy relationships with family, friends, and loved ones, often veering from extreme closeness and love (idealization) to extreme dislike or anger (devaluation)
--Distorted and unstable self-image or sense of self, which can result in sudden changes in feelings, opinions, values, or plans and goals for the future (such as school or career choices)
--Impulsive and often dangerous behaviors, such as spending sprees, unsafe sex, substance abuse, reckless driving, and binge eating
--Recurring suicidal behaviors or threats or self-harming behavior, such as cutting
--Intense and highly changeable moods, with each episode lasting from a few hours to a few days
--Chronic feelings of emptiness and/or boredom
--Inappropriate, intense anger or problems controlling anger
--Having stress-related paranoid thoughts or severe dissociative symptoms, such as feeling cut off from oneself, observing oneself from outside the body, or losing touch with reality.
But let me say something gently: Life is chock full of these curveballs. We've all run into jerks who mistreated, or tried to mistreat, us. People suffer trauma. No one's family is perfect. Jobs and job opportunities come and go. People get laid off. People have money struggles. Pets get sick and die. Couples have dry spells in their sex lives. There will always be someone richer, more attractive, and seemingly more together right around the corner--even though they, because they are human, are dealing with their own set of curveballs.
One major problem here is that neither of you are handling any of these things well at all.
Another major problem is that you somehow feel it's your job to try to be her therapist. So sorry, but no man should feel he has to spend three years convincing a woman of his love and intentions. You're codependent and an enabler.
You might benefit from some life coaching, but honestly? She needs a psychiatrist, big time. She has issues that you are simply not equipped or trained to help her with, and by trying to do so yourself, you're setting yourself up for failure.
But beyond that, her mental and emotional status are such that if it's not one thing to be unhinged about, it will be another. If it's not work, it will be money. If it's not money, it will be the cat. If it's not the cat, it will be sex. If it's not sex, it will be her parents. If it's not her parents, it will be you. It's always going to be something, and while life throws curveballs, not every curveball is something to get unhinged about. She needs to learn to bend like the reed, pick her battles, make priorities, get control of her emotions, and learn accountability for how she reacts to and handles things.
Anyway, we had a particularly stressful week and went through really unpleasant experiences. Since she was feeling like opening up, we allowed two friends she felt comfortable with into our sex life, as she needed more good experiences with people, and i had never been with anyone else, and felt loyal to her. It was kindof impulsive, but i agreed. Long story short, it was too much for me, and we backed out. She was fine with it but i couldn't handle it, which made her feel hurt and violated. Afterwards, we tried to have some "private time" to re-assert ourselves, which she really needed, but i couldn't perform, which made her feel like i rejected her.
Okay, I was with you up until this point and then you lost me. This really came out of left field. It's difficult for me to understand the appeal of swinging or orgies to begin with so I don't really understand why she would want to do this in the first place and I don't blame you for backing out. But what makes absolutely NO sense to me is why she would feel hurt and violated because you DIDN'T want to have sex with other people. You only want to have sex with her, no one else... and that makes her feel rejected by you? How?! Shouldn't it be the other way around? You're not rejecting her, you're reacting the other people! Am I missing something here?
I think you are seeing a whole other side to this woman.
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We had some difficulty but she forgave me for everything because she loved me, but after a few days the emotions she went through triggered a repressed memory of a time she was raped. I held her as she cried herself to sleep that night.
She forgave you? For what? For staying faithful to her? For giving her good advice and being supportive when she was upset? Seriously, you've done NOTHING wrong up to this point and if she's got you thinking that you have anything to apologize for or that you should be grateful for her forgiveness, she must be some kind of master manipulator and you need to get out of this relationship ASAP.
Honestly, I think this woman is overplaying the victim card and using it to manipulate you. She's tried to use it to manipulate other people but when they see through it, she just uses as evidence of more victimization to whoever will believe it (namely, you).
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We started planning things, but didn't have anyone to talk to about it. We took out the money we needed from our savings to be the wedding budget. My father and uncle started giving me grief about spending money when neither of us had a job.
And rightfully so... it's one thing to spend a lot of money on a wedding when you have the money, but when you don't, it's just plain stupid. But you have to do or she'll be the victim again, won't she? You try to be sensible about money and she'll twist it into you "rejecting her" again.
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Then our cat developed cancer... Our pets have always been like family members to us, and especially her. She always said she preferred pets to children (though we had talked about having human children someday)
Okay, I'm an animal lover but if she value animals over humans, this is a huge red flag. It suggests that she does not have much empathy for other people, especially children. Is that really the kind of person you want to be the mother of your children? You think your kids won't pick up on the fact that she prefers her cat to them? You think this won't royally screw them up? What are you going to tell them when they ask you "Daddy, why does Mommy love the cat more than me?"
The more I read about her, the more I am convinced she is a very disturbing individual and that you will never have a healthy relationship with her. GET. OUT. NOW.
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My fiance was devastated, but i tried to make her feel better in any way that I could. Unfortunately she has a habit of spending money when she's depressed (which she has acknowledged is a bad trait), so i tried to be careful with money, and tried even harder to get a job (ignoring my field and applying at fast food places). She started resenting me for saying 'no' when she wanted to go out for sushi, or telling her that we couldn't afford something... She told me that I was controlling her life, and I had been.
Oh my God, can you not see how she is manipulating you?! She is guilt tripping you into driving yourselves into debt! Basically, if she doesn't get her way on something, anything, she cries victim and claims you're rejecting her, you're controlling her... she's manipulating you!
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We kept getting grief from everyone around us about the wedding, and I had a day or two of thinking we should wait, because we were trying to plan the wedding not only for ourselves, but for our families, and it seemed like they didn't approve.
Because they're trying to make you see what is SO obvious to everyone else.
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She told me that she still loves me, but she feels like i betrayed her, lied to her, and that she can't trust me anymore. She said that once someone loses her trust, they can't ever get it back. She doesn't think the wedding would mean anything, doesn't even want to have it.
Good. Let her leave. I promise you that in time, when you have moved on and no longer have feelings for her, you'll be able to look back on this and you will think "What was I thinking?!"
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Her only really options are
1. leave me and move in with her mother (which is not a healthy environment, and i know would keep her from achieving her goals) and never speak to me again.
2. Start stripping so she can earn enough for her own place (she has tried to start stripping in the past to fix our money issues, but i wouldn't let her because i know it would make everything worse for her) and again, never speak to me again.
3. Stay with me and not care about anything in her life, or me, but play the perfect happy girlfriend. She would still go through with the wedding, if I wanted
She wanted me to decide, saying "you decide everything anyway".
Wow. This is just insane. All because you didn't want to have sex with other people and didn't want to wind up in debt. Somehow, that means you've betrayed her, lied to her, rejected her, and controlled her. You do realize these options are designed so that you, of course, choose number 3 - so that she can continue to use guilt and the victim card to manipulate and psychologically abuse you. Like any good human being, she KNOWS you can't choose to send to into either of the first two situations. So of course you will choose for her to stay with you - she knows this... but because she is setting it up so it's YOUR choice, it means that whenever she is unhappy she can always blame YOU for it. Get it? It's another manipulation tactic. DON'T buy into it. She is a grown woman, she has to make her own decisions, you can't make them for her. Stop playing her little games, stop allowing her to have this power and manipulation over you.
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I hate that I've done this to her. I hate that i succumbed to stress, and couldn't realize she was crying out for help. I wasn't there for her when she needed me.
I still don't understand how you've done anything but support her and do what's best for both your futures. You haven't done anything to her. Stop feeling guilty, stop allowing her to manipulate you.
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She's already turned down couple's counseling and the "take a break for awhile" idea... What do you guys think?
Of course she's turned down counseling - a trained professional would see RIGHT through her manipulation and she knows this.
I think you need to get as far away from this person as possible. Forever.
I've heard some crazy relationship stories but this one is definitely up there. Seriously, you need to open your eyes.
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