Would you be willing to date someone of a different religion than you are?

[Metaphysique]

Originally Posted by John13

I couldn't do it. It may work for others but it wouldn't work for me.
I'd rather be lonely.

Nor could I.

Originally Posted by John13

I'm talking top scientists:

"Biological scientists had the lowest rate of belief (5.5% in God, 7.1% in immortality), with physicists and astronomers slightly higher (7.5% in God, 7.5% in immortality)"

Nature, "Leading scientists still reject God"* July 23, 1998

Furthermore, I'm not the only one on this board or even on this thread that dismisses any idea of a god.
This is due to a lack of evidence.

I'd like a partner intelligent enough to have an open mind to recognize that no invisable man is in control of anything.

I'd have considered you dense and obtuse back when I was a Christian due to the fact that there are intelligent theists. One can be "intelligent" and still accept questionable, uncorroborated, unfalsifiable fantastical beliefs.

Can someone believe in a fantastical claim and still be intelligent? Sure. However, it doesn't take away from the fact that their critical, objective analysis stops right at their own presuppositions. It's easy to be critical and objective about beliefs outside one's own. True critical, objective analysis is being able to apply this method of examination to one's own presuppositions.

Not everyone possesses the critical thinking skills or want to truly evaluate their presuppositions. I've come across many intelligent Christians (as opposed to other followers/practitioners because "genie in the sky"/omnimax and anthropomorphism is associated with Abrahamic theism), and I'd like to consider myself very intelligent, and I'm a former Christian, of varying flavors. However, while I was intelligent then, when it came to critical and objective analysis, I was not quite skilled in applying this to my own fantastical beliefs.

My father is a very intelligent man, but he's still a Bible-thumping, right wing Christian (Baptist) fundamentalist. He is a critical thinker in some regards, but when it comes to deep intellectual, philosophical, and religious matters, not so much. He may be in his own way, in his own religious paradigm, but outside his comfort zone, he flounders. As do most individuals who are only or mostly familiar with their own religious and ideological paradigm.

Think about it, how many Christians would take me seriously if I said I believed in the Norse pantheon? How many would mock and trivialize someone for believing in Jedi Magic? What about the Invisible Pink Unicorn? The absolute vast majority would not and do not take such beliefs or ideas seriously, for they are "make-belief."

Truth: there's just as much proof for Thor as El/Yahweh, Yeshua and Holy Spirit. That is to say, there is none. None whatsoever. And the same applies for every other fantastical, mythical and mythological character.

A good way to demonstrate critical and objective thinking is to avoid using god-awful logical fallacies, especially false dichotomy.

Originally Posted by John13

That's not what I said.

Do I think believing is dumb, yes.

That's quite different.

It doesn't make me a "bigot" just because I won't go out with a person who attends church services.
It's called a preference.

If I said I dislike people who go to church you would have a point. Fact is I do not feel that way at all.
You need to chill out, Jill. You sound very angry.

It may make me an intellectual elitist in some ways, but I do only date Humanists, secularists, non-conformists, and nontheists (there are a variety of positions). There are just certain positions, doctrines, dogmas, precepts, that I feel are at enmity with critical and objective thinking. I'm highly critical of mainstream theology and what it espouses, so being involved with someone who held completely antithetical beliefs would be a fundamental flaw in the relationship.

I avoid dating Christians (there are very few I would date - e.g., Gnostic, mythicist, mystic, pluralist, but these are extremely hard to find).

I tried dating a guy a few months back who identifies himself as spiritual in the pantheistic sense. He came from a Pentecostal upbringing, and was very involved in the Church. We shared a similar religious background. He knows scripture, but due to rote memorization. He didn't actually know or understand the deep doctrinal and theological bits.

And this applies to most people. He was able to rattle off various passages, but he didn't actually know their meaning or context. He left organized religion, or so he claimed/believes, and he appreciates and incorporates many other traditions and philosophies (sort of a pluralist) into his beliefs. However, I could sense that while he supposedly left organized religion, he still clung to the faith of his birth. He'd quote scripture and talk of spiritual warfare. We got into a couple debates because I could clearly tell we had fundamental differences. I felt strongly that pantheism is not compatible with mainstream/mainline Christian/Pauline theology. It's not. He was one of the types that try to blend many different, though antithetical, ideologies. The whole East meets West thing. No. They're not the same. They're not even similar. The East and West propose very different philosophies and ideologies, though many go out of their way to be all Kumbaya-lets all hold hands and be friends. Ecumenicalism is great and all, but it works best within Christendom itself.

I started digging deep into his beliefs to see where he stood on important doctrinal matters. The fact that he believes in the Biblical narrative alone made me recoil. Same for the Genesis myth. He was still in many ways a literalist and inerrantist, though just a bit more selective about where to apply this method of interpretation. We did the whole back and forth thing for a bit before he conceded.

Now, this gentleman is a brilliant man, genius IQ. Gifted writer and poet. He's very understanding and accepting of many views and beliefs, though what he knows is more superficial. However, I clearly saw he was still deeply attached to the faith of his birth and he was unwilling (as opposed to unable) to apply critical and objective analysis to his own presuppositions. That's a no-go (in the context of a relationship).

[Metaphysique]

Originally Posted by JC84

I'm going to go ahead and add fuel to the fire as to why many people do not want to be with a very religious person:

"A team led by Miron Zuckerman of the University of Rochester found “a reliable negative relation between intelligence and religiosity” in 53 out of 63 studies. Even in extreme old age, intelligent people are less likely to believe, the researchers found - and the reasons why people with high IQs shun religion may not be as simple as previously thought.

Previous studies have tended to assume that intelligent people simply “know better”, the researchers write - but the reasons may be more complex.

For instance, intelligent people are more likely to be married, and more likely to be successful in life - and this may mean they “need” religion less.

The studies used in Zuckerman's paper included a life-long analysis of the beliefs of a group of 1,500 gifted children - those with IQs over 135 - in a study which began in 1921 and continues today.

Even at 75 to 91 years of age, the children from Lewis Terman’s study scored lower for religiosity than the general population - contrary to the widely held belief that people turn to God as they age. The researchers noted that data was lacking about religious attitudes in old age and say, “Additional research is needed to resolve this issue.”

As early as 1958, Michael Argyle concluded, “Although intelligent children grasp religious concepts earlier, they are also the first to doubt the truth of religion, and intelligent students are much less likely to accept orthodox beliefs, and rather less likely to have pro-religious attitudes.”


***before anyone jumps on me, I didn't create the study, nor am I speaking in absolutes. There are certainly exceptions to this.

My 9 year old daughter to her friend at school.

Friend: "Do you go to church?"

Daughter: "No. We don't go to church."

Friend: "Why not? Don't you believe in heaven and hell?"

Daughter: "No."

Friend: "You don't believe in god?"

Daughter: "I don't believe in gods."

Teaching her to avoid falling into the false dichotomy trap. She, along with her sister (and little brother), are implicit, weak atheists. They do not believe in mythological deities of any kind due to said mythologies not being part of their environment. They have not been formally proposed or introduced to these stories and characters, and they need not be until they can fully grasp them and can approach them in a critical and objective manner. They are familiar with other people's beliefs. That other people believe in various deities. They also know the names of various deities. They understand them to be characters in ancient folklore. Athena, Aurora, Lucina, Demeter, Eostre, Asherah (El/Yahweh's wife), are goddesses in ancient literature. The same goes for Zeus, Thor, Ba'al, Mithra, Horus, Sol Invictus, Monkey, Apsu, Tiamat, Ra, El/Yahweh, Jesus, Holy Spirit, and the thousands of others posited throughout recorded history.

When she is of an appropriate age, when she is interested and willing to delve into meaty and heavy fields and topics like ancient history, comparative religion, 1st century history, philosophy, etc., is when she will be introduced to First Cause concepts. That's a whole 'nother ballgame that requires the ability and desire to think critically and objectively.

[Huckleberry3911948]

would and do, what is critical is common core values. if they are mean to small children and animals watch out.

[monumentus]

Originally Posted by John13

I'd like a partner intelligent enough to have an open mind to recognize that no invisable man is in control of anything.

I think people who think there is a god have reached an erroneous and unsupported conclusion. I do not think that makes them close minded or unintelligent. Intelligent people can be wrong too. Some of the most intelligent minds this planet has ever produced - have bought into some seriously nonsense ideas.

While the occasional famous pastor in the US - sometimes live on heavily watched televisions shows - tells people that theists should break up with atheists because it will never work - I am of the completely opposite opinion. There are many people who are not just willing to date people of differing - or lacking - religions - but to marry them and have successful and happy lives together.

The OP asks us "Would you be willing to date someone of a different religion than you are?" and I honesty can not see any reason why not.

[DennyCrane]

Religion isn't a trivial issue. It's a big part of who you are, your values, and how you see the world. That's why I would never date someone of a different religion. Sure there are interfaith couples who manage just fine. But relationships already require hard work so why make it even harder? If you're not looking for a serious relationship, then religion isn't a big deal. But if you want something long term and especially if you plan to have children, it's better to be on the same page with respect to religion.