Probably shouldn't be posting this... (man, therapy, hubby, kids)

[trm]

Oh Crème – This post made me cry. My heart goes out to you. I have a 14 year old son and on Christmas he was with his dad and I found myself taking a walk down the street and all I did was cry. I can not say that I understand fully what you are going through but I do understand the love a mother has for her only son. I am “very” new to this site so I am not familiar with the entire situation…but, is there anyway to have a relationship with your son in the midst of his own family. It seems like such a shame and I feel so bad for you. I can feel your hurt as I read your post… I am so sorry.

[cremebrulee]

Originally Posted by trm

Oh Crème – This post made me cry. My heart goes out to you. I have a 14 year old son and on Christmas he was with his dad and I found myself taking a walk down the street and all I did was cry. I can not say that I understand fully what you are going through but I do understand the love a mother has for her only son. I am “very” new to this site so I am not familiar with the entire situation…but, is there anyway to have a relationship with your son in the midst of his own family. It seems like such a shame and I feel so bad for you. I can feel your hurt as I read your post… I am so sorry.

Thank you TRM....love your son...always, he will always be your son...but...in the same, educate him, as that is your job to do so...please teach him that love is not simply latching onto some pretty woman and taking abuse the rest of his life, explain to him, when he comes of age, that there are a lot of women out there who have had really horrible lives and are dysfunctional and just looking for someone to take care of them...teach him that people who have experienced dysfunctional lives, cannot give love as well as receive it...you cannot give what you've never knowns.

Don't cry, as these are real facts of life...be willing to allow your son to make mistakes, but first and foremost teach and give him confidence...teach him to watch for how others talk about their families and life...to pick his friends and not allow them to pick him...that he does NOT have to be married to be successful...allow him to travel, to form his own personality...to go off to college...to live and learn...but do not, teach him that marriage is the only life that society will accept as normal.

Teach him about girls...don't be afraid to discuss sex...when he comes home with B's instead of A's, take him out for a special trip to say thank you....let him know that B's are fine...

Teach him to be self providing, teach him to cook, clean, do his wash, dust, be organized...so that he doesn't have to depend on someone else, and most of all, teach him to be consciencious of the hearts of others.

Don't be afraid to allow him to make mistakes and get hurt...you cannot protect him from everything. Enjoy him now, and then let him go and go off and experience life....

If you do all these things...then, he will come back to you...but if you teach him only religion and that he should go to church every week and never discuss any of these other issues with him, he won't know...religions are very very good, to live one's life by, but, there are other things he must know...and if he chooses a confident wife, who has goals, who is basically someone who thinks and feels like he does, he will bring her home to you....but if he chooses someone who is really insecure, and has really had no parents, understandibly, she will be not only intimidated by family, but by your love for him....he and you, do not deserve that.

If you are seperated or divorced, and you love your son, regardless what your ex thinks or believes in, allow your son to spend time with his father and the new wife, b/c he needs his father's influence, as long as his father is not way out there, doing drugs, and other against the law things. You see, if you do this, he will pull all the positive qualities from their personalities which will help him problem solve and identify who He would like to be, and what he would like to do...

I never wanted to be the kind of smothering mother that some are....I wanted my son to experience life, and I encourged him to go off to the Air Force, and he got out of our small town concepts....and learned there were other things in life. My goodness, he rode horses, he traveled, he hunted, fished, he learned how to fly a plane, and took me his mother, with him...he took me with him when he went all over the place interviewing for police officer jobs....many many people have commented about how shocked they are, that this has happened b/c we were so close and functioning, but never, ever, did I think, he would choose someone for a wife that had such a dysfunctional background...nor, and get this, does he to this day, know all of her background???? Why, because we really didn't discuss this to much.

What I did do, was say to him, no matter what, you make certian you do nice things for your wife, you play with her, meaning, invent trips and vacations, and have fun together, cuz it shouldn't be about the wife sitting home and never going anywhere. I tried to teach him not to live over his means...which he doesn't, but he has a woman now, that is so high maintenance, that he thinks HE has to be the one who brings in all the money, and he has no hobbies now, he does nothing for himself...and she is less then appreciative. And He has allowed her to drive a wedge between family and friends...it's all about her or nothing...he doesn't deserve her, and I believe deep down in her heart of hearts, sadly she knows this, and that is why she hates me...b/c she fears that she couldn't live up to me, plus she fears I wouldn't like her....if she treated my son with respect, and real love and committment I would, and I'd forgive all, but the point is, she doesn't and he will live the rest of his life in torment, and now, he has also allowed the chain of dysfunctionality to spill over into his daughters life, therefore, she to, will be like her mother...and a big problem for some man some day.

I have a neighbor who lived across the street from me in the Poconos, years ago...she then said, I was her role model as to what kind of mother she wanted to be to her child...she loved to sit back and watch how close we all were, meaning all his friends, him and I...she tells me, I was an excellent mother...which makes me cry all the time when she says that...and now I tell her, well, make certain you learn from my experience now and teach your son about women and sex...that is very important...because if you pick a woman who has had a very bad background, she will inevidbly, contaminate the relationship from the get go, and remember, the man/husband usually goes, where the woman chooses, b/c he is a peace keeper, and if you don't get along with your daughter in law...then you will see very little of him. Now, she is so upset when we talk, that my son, has done this to me....and I try and tell her, he doesn't realize...she said, she would be devestated if her son did this...well, you can't give up, what you have to do, is learn from my mistake...and when they leave, you've got to say, you did the best you could do at the time, and now it's they're turn at life...you cannot protect them always...and forever....it wouldn't be normal to try...so, now, I've got to do what is best for him once more....even if that means, giving him and my GD up. Many told me they were afraid she'd use my GD to hurt me and she has, but only if I allow her to...I still have control and I know deep in my heart, I've tried everything...I have no regrets except fearing her....I should have put her in her place from the very beginning as she is nothing but a bully.

Anyway...it hurts yes, and is sad, yes...but my job is over...and so that I may have some peace in my life I look at it this way...and maybe this is wrong, but it's my survival kit....she is his problem, not mine, and I won't allow her to be my problem any more...and if that means never seeing any of them again, so be it, but she has been so rude to me, beyond what I would have ever allowed anyone to be...she has lied and accused me of doing and saying things I did not do...I live alone, and am so bread winner, and I'm a very giving person, love to give gifts and have been very generous to them, only to find out, unless I gave them money, my gifts ended up in the waste can...and that hurts....and many in here have said....well, give them a gift certificate, and I have many times, but a grand mothers loves to purchase gifts for her grandchildren...and as much as I didn't get along with my smothering mother in law, I made certain, that my son, had on clothes that she bought for him when she was around, just to say thank you...even though I hated them...why, because she bought it, and it was special to her. Anyone who tells you, well, you should knuckly under and buy exactly what she wants, no...b/c then that takes the joy away from you...so don't do it all the time. It's not always about making everyone else happy 100% of the time at the cost of your joy...no sir.

I had people tell me after they were married about all the dysfunctional stuff she did at the wedding...I myself saw, but didn't want to believe....she even caused a problem with a business associate of mine from work.....I believed her and not him...afterwards I cannot tell you how embarrassed I was when I saw her calculate this entire situation...and beleive me, when she did this in the beginning, started lying to him about me, I couldn't believe inside, or even understand what was happening, all I know, it felt like a knife cutting my stomach and saying, this is going to be a problem for the rest of your life....I knew, I really knew.

Do you see? Good luck and God bless
remember, this is life, this is reality...and it is very important to be a teacher to your child and not sit back and think, b/c he goes to school and church, he will be fine...he won't unless you do your share to...

Don't be a smothering mom, but in the same, if he wants to be there, then let him and enjoy him when you can, but encourage him to go out there and live life....and don't expect him to live out your dreams....watch him, and learn from him to, and you will...children are a joy, and my son was the light of my life...he made it all seem possible...yanno....and I gave him up, and allowed him to go and live with his dad, and That my friend was difficult...but I knew in my soul, he needed to have his father's/a man's influence....but what I didn't realize is, that his father's wife was like my son's wife now...and those were very influencial years of his life, from 10th grade on....and I should have said, you can live with your dad all summer, but you must come home and finish school here in the winters....but at the time, I didnt' know any better and wanted to do what was best for him....it wasn't...b/c he watched his father sit back and take the cruelty of his step mother....and thought that was normal behavior. Sad, really really sad....and all my fault, as now, it sometimes seems to me, that all else/all positive things that I did for him failed....and means nothing....


So, there you have it, learn from my mistakes...don't be sad and cry, but learn and read books and try to do the best you can in this area...it is not enough to allow them to go to school and church, but to be a parent, you have to teach them about people who will take advantage of them....and that it is wrong to compromise your identity for others....it is your signiture, who you are....don't give that person up for anyone.


Hugs and thanks for reading
I think this Website is a great learning tool.
Love to you and yours
Creme

[dreamofmonterey]

Originally Posted by cremebrulee

I'm sorry, but I just cannot get past the hurt right now, and can't remember anything funny he did of late, b/c you have to remember, for the last 10 years she has been driving a wedge in our relationship, so we saw each other less and less, to boot, he lives out of state....but the hurt of what he has done, has driven way to deep that there are no longer good memories, other then his childhood....whenever we were together for the past 10 years, you either said nothing, and were on egg shells all the time.....she is unbearable...dictating the subjects you discuss, and if she becomes boared, which her social skills and knowledge on anything beyond make up, jewelry and clothes, is next to nill. As I said, there is no going back....she has been striving for this...and now says, she will never be around me again...b/c of MY Behavior???????? But doesn't admit to him that she yelled at me over and over again, when he wasn't there....turned to me and yelled at me, like I was some diseased adult.."will you chill out and just go away?"

Sorry to be such a downer today...but, this is not mendable, and right now, I cannot see anything positive in this entire situation...what I've done is come to terms with the hurt that he has instituted...to me, it is a coward's way out...to turn on your family instead of facing the issues at hand...I hold him more accountable then her, actually.

I don't expect much, but respect and consideration....and believe me, since she has entered the picture, there hasn't been much....you have no idea.

And then there is my girlfriend, who has 4 DIL's and they function normally, and get along fine...yes, there are small issues, but they are all mature enough to get along, plus they all love her so much, they want her there, at their parties, New Year's Eve Parties, etc. That is how my son Used to be...he always wanted me there....so much so, that I had to say no sometimes....and now, nothing...

such a shame...that he allowed this to happen and didn't put her in her place in the beginning.

see, when this all started, we decided that when they came home, my son and I would have one day together, as they had other people to visit...well, she didn't like this either and demanded to be there....see, she couldn't stand it that we had one day, maybe twice a year when they came home that we, my son and I spent together????? She found out, she could control the situation, much more to her liking, by pretending to tollerate me. We used to go out, and go see and do things...now, last visit, we just sat around, b/c she didn't want to do anything. Oh, and the one resturant, I always looked foreward to going to when I go visit them, we couldn't go, cause there was another SHE liked better????????

She is draining.....

Creme alot of us care about you here, but the last sentence says alot: she is draining you. If she is this controlling and insecure that she needs to make you miserable, something is definitely wrong with her.

I dont have kids and am sorry for your son, but you need to forget her- detach and get away from ANYTHING she thinks or says. She is toxic.

[trm]

I was up very early this morning reading your response to me and I was so emotional I could not respond at that time. I can tell that you are a wise woman and I applaud you for your strength and words of encouragement. I just want to slap the hell out of your son so he will wake up and take heed to the wisdom and love you are tying to convey. I realize that you’ve been on this earth a lot longer than I, but I do not agree with your approach of washing your hands of the situation. I get the fact that it takes two and you can not make your son do anything that he doesn’t want to do, but you have NOT exhausted all efforts and it not possible for you to “ever” exhaust all efforts until you are gone from this earth. I am my sister’s keeper and as a mother YOU CAN NOT STOP TRYING. You are such an intelligent woman and the encouragement I read in your postings to others in their lives must manifest itself in your own situation at all cost. Come on Crème, you know that you can not give up. Be creative…do something. Sometimes we have to bite the bullet and bow down for the good of what the possibilities can be in the future. You are constantly in my thoughts and prayers and its weird but I really do care about what happens with you and your son. Much love…take care!

[girleylips]

Creme ....you are an awesome person

[miu]

Originally Posted by cremebrulee

What I did do, was say to him, no matter what, you make certian you do nice things for your wife, you play with her, meaning, invent trips and vacations, and have fun together, cuz it shouldn't be about the wife sitting home and never going anywhere. I tried to teach him not to live over his means...which he doesn't, but he has a woman now, that is so high maintenance, that he thinks HE has to be the one who brings in all the money, and he has no hobbies now, he does nothing for himself...and she is less then appreciative. And He has allowed her to drive a wedge between family and friends...it's all about her or nothing...he doesn't deserve her, and I believe deep down in her heart of hearts, sadly she knows this, and that is why she hates me...b/c she fears that she couldn't live up to me, plus she fears I wouldn't like her....if she treated my son with respect, and real love and committment I would, and I'd forgive all, but the point is, she doesn't and he will live the rest of his life in torment, and now, he has also allowed the chain of dysfunctionality to spill over into his daughters life, therefore, she to, will be like her mother...and a big problem for some man some day.

A friend shared these Gandhi quotes with me yesterday, and these three made me think of you:

“Nobody can hurt me without my permission.”

“The weak can never forgive. Forgiveness is the attribute of the strong.”

“Whenever you are confronted with an opponent. Conquer him with love.”

http://fiu.edu/~fcf/Gandhi.quotes.html (broken link)

I am wondering if you step back from this situation but when you do encounter your DIL, just throw her off guard by showing her love and telling her that you do accept her because she is the woman that your son chose to spend the rest of his life with. And any time that she is nasty to you, ignore it and give her love back. Lie through your teeth and praise her. Stop the cycle of antagonism. I know that you are a better and bigger hearted person that all of them. Anyway, just don't lower yourself to her level of bad behaviour.

[cremebrulee]

Originally Posted by miu

What a sad situation. I'd say stop the tug of war with your son's wife. Don't lecture your son anymore and fall into the I told you so role. Just be there when he needs you and just love him unconditionally. Too often I've seen the most loving parents produce children that grow up, make some questionable choices and drift away from their families for a while, sometime permanently.

I guess this is why I say to parents that don't have children and count on them taking care of you later on. Once they become adults, fall in love and marry, they are off to have their own lives.

Anyway, I know that you are a good person and that you raised your son well and in the best way you could. But he is an adult now, so let him go. Your job as a parent is done, now focus on yourself and find other passions and activities to occupy yourself. Do some volunteer work, mentor a child.

One day, your son will return to you. Just greet him with open arms and lots of love. Don't say anything about his dreadful ex, because if you do, it will only make him hesitate to return to you. Just keep that door open for him and your granddaughter. Keep sending birthday and Christmas presents. If you think that the ex will interfere with them, mail or drop them off where he works.

I have a dear friend in Iowa. My heart breaks for her. She is many years divorced. Her son has just graduated from law school and his schooling was paid for with a combination of loans and all the money she inherited from her late and awful mother. She is struggling to make ends meet. Her son never visits her, when she is in his city he avoids her, and he has also coldly told her to never expect any financial help from him. Meanwhile, he is still fond of his dad's side of the family, even though his dad never helped pay for college or law school. Oh and his college that was paid for by his mom was located in Hawaii. So this Christmas, I gave her a warm down jacket from Cabelas that I found on eBay. I told her that I wished that I could do more for her. And I told her that if I ever won Powerball, I would really take care of her. However, I would make sure that her son would never be affected by my generosity to her. She understood, and I think she felt better because I felt and understood her disappointment with her son. She's been the best mom she could to that young selfish man. So what if she wasn't a rich supermodel mother that he could be proud of?

Anyway, these stories make me feel sad and frustrated. Big hugs to you creme!!! I hope you know how much all of us here at C-D love ya!!!!!

thanks so very much for sharing this, for the great care and love you share.

Hugs
Creme

[cremebrulee]

Hi

Just wanted to come back and write a reply to everyone, who has not only taken the time to read this grewling thread, but also, to think about it and respond with suggestions....I am greatful for your thoughts and suggestions...

I have given this much thought over the years...and have concluded, that if this were simply a personality conflict with a normal person, this thread wouldn't be exisiting....but, it is not...and it cannot be worked out....

Regardless, until and unless you are in the situation, you cannot understand how smothering & draining this woman is. There are no ways to resolve this as, she will not allow it.

As I stated before, I would love to see my son, for some quality time, like we used to do, but she won't allow that? She didn't like the fact that he and I had time together and had fun, therefore, she pretended to like me just a little, so she could be around and control the situation further.

Not to mention, she lies, and I don't want to be in a position where I am alone with her, and that does happen, b/c I go and visit...and it would cause my son more grief to take a hotel near his home, and ask him to spend time with me, without her...she would drive him nuts.

So, to make is easy on everyone, I have concluded the only resolve for peace I can think of, and believe me, she is perfectly happy with this....if I wouldn't have done it, eventually she would have, and to be candid, like I mentioned before, I bet she was shocked that I held out so long and without a verbal war.

Yes, it is his life, and there is nothing I want to do, or can do, to make it better, anything more would be interferring....if he is happy this way, then so be it....I won't put him in the middle any longer...besides, it got to the point that I was really walking on egg shells. She is not fun to be around....and everything has to be her way..when she says at all cost to others. I can't tollerate that.

Here I was, being very generous with gifts to my grand daughter, only to find out, she was throwing them out...sheesh what other hurts can she impose.

The woman scares me, there isn't anything she wouldn't do to win, so, I've done what is best for all concerned.

I'm not giving up...but simply moving to another phase of my life. What has transpired, has caused my son, to be someone I don't know to begin with, adding on top of that...it's been 10 long years, and I don't even know him anymore, really. Sad to say..but they live far away, and when ever we get together, he is no longer the person I knew...he is so pre occupied with thoughts, probably afraid something will again transpire between her and me, cuz I don't know what she says, when I'm not there...she has made up stories before.

I believe this has gone way to far...your dealing with a person who feels very guilty inside for what she has done, or she believes her own lies.

Whatever.....


I can't deal with it any longer and to boot, when I'm around my son, I feel like he's judging me, like he really believes I am no good. We are stangers, it's like he's some acquaintence...anything more, she won't allow...and he doesn't see it, b/c she actually encourages him to see me...you have no idea how caluculating and manipulative she can be.

I do feel sorry for both of them, b/c someday, their little girl will grow up, and there are going to be problems..big time.

But, I wish, more then anything else, even if I'd never see my son again, that they would go for counseling.

Don't feel bad, I have accepted this and it's been going on for way to long. I don't know if anyone has ever come to the point, that enough is enough...you just can't take anymore....and I won't be made to feel, like all of this is my fault.

She yelled at me once, that they went to counseling b/c of me? Yet, I wasn't there...and apparently the counselor told them that I did some things wrong...well, I will say this...when this all occured, I did the best I could do at the time, without spazing out...I couldn't believe it was happening, I was in total shock and confussion, plus I didn't want to say anything, I'd be sorry for later, so I clammed up...if I knew what I know now, I should have stopped it from the get go...as my girlfriend feels, beings she is a bully, I should have put her in her place in front of him, but I didn't. How can one know...I wanted to keep peace, and I was wrong.

I am not a fighter and loose all concept of emotions when someone starts accusing me; and I hate confrontation. She on the other hand; has verbal come backs that totally dis shelve me, and am not able to argue my point, cuz she thows you way off track......my son's stepmother was just like that, they are very convincing, and I can't compete with that, nor do I want to. They start yelling and screaming and you can't get a word in edge wise, plus, they say what they need to say, and walk out or away?????

You take me for who I am...I am not a lier, nor wish any harm to anyone, and if we can't be good when we're together, then why keep on keepin on, something that will never work out?


I was really looking for a vent, as it is sometimes painful, but with time, I know, I'm doing what is best for all of us....besides, I can't express enough, how my son is a stranger any more....all these years, and he has not but one time, been interested on going to visit my family, friends, I mean, that boggles my mind?????

Maybe in addition, I wan't someone to feel sorry for me, as there are times, when I'm totally engulfed in self pity over this...so, I try to be strong and move on....

There is way to much distance between my son and I now, plus, the way he has talked to me, yelled and screamed at me, well, simply put, he would have never done that and gotten away with it years ago, be he right or wrong, that is no way to talk to your mother....and he will no longer get to do that now.

Also, I don't trust her, after the way she has orchastrated this entire situation, which to me, is very deviat and cruel. I don't know, maybe it's just me, but even though, I didn't like my ex mother in law much, I would have never treated her with such disrespect, or even tried to cause such a problem between us all...I mean, there are so many lives here to take in to consideration, and that is why, I know, my DIL has no soul. I mean, how could you erase emails, telephone messages, lie and make up stories...sheeesh???

I am his mother and to revisit this situation with him, is unavoidable, as he's always asking questions.

Listen...I know why he is doing what he is doing, I know he loves her...she is absolutely beautiful....plus, I believe he enjoys what she offers him...meaning, he loves the fact that she pretends to be so co-dependent on him to do everything...whatever, they both need counseling, but it's no longer my cross to bear....I won't allow it to be.

Thanks again, so much....for all your comments....I hope not one of you, ever has to experience this...and if you do, make certain, you first exhaust all else, but then, know, there comes a time, when enough, is enough...you can feel sorry for someone only for so long, and then afterwards, you have to do, what is best for your stability, mental health and peace, and....I won't play games and pretend I like her anymore...I can't, b/c I don't. She's caused way to much pain and life long saddness....I won't be her victim, b/c she knows I want to see my son and grand daughter...no thank you.

Hugs
Creme

[Roselvr]

Creme, I typed this out over a few days.. tried to get it posted yesterday but didn't have time. Hopefully something will be useful to you.

Originally Posted by cremebrulee

It was a difficult holiday this year....we lost our mom...and I couldn't get my son off my mind.

I'm very sorry. I was very close to my dad, when I lost him 2 years ago, it hurt more then anything.

Right now you need to focus on yourself & healing. I don't doubt you're in shock from losing your mom.. and to have this toxic relationship with your DIL.. well I don't doubt you're a bit extra sensative.

You need your son right now.. My FIL got sick within days of my dad dying.. I let my husband go to be with his mom, even though I needed him. My husband allowed me to care for my dad during his 9 months of being sick, the least I could do is put my own needs aside and let him be with his dad / mother / family. It hurt, trust me. Him being gone days / a week; multiple times during the next few weeks. I'd cry.. I felt so alone.

His dad died a few weeks later.. I couldn't fly out due to my back, but my hubby was there at the time. To this day I feel guilty for not being able to go out there.. I'm not even sure if his mother knows what I gave up..

Originally Posted by cremebrulee

such a shame...that he allowed this to happen and didn't put her in her place in the beginning.

I know what you're saying and if the tables were turned would she do this with her family? Probably not. But he does it with his.

There was a way everyone could have lived in peace. If the two of you don't get along, you see your son & GD without her. He has an obligation as your son.

I was in a similar situation with my son for 4 years, thankfully they didn't get married or have kids but it was hard to let him go & I did. Once "she won" she didn't want him any more.

Originally Posted by cremebrulee

see, when this all started, we decided that when they came home, my son and I would have one day together, as they had other people to visit...well, she didn't like this either and demanded to be there....see, she couldn't stand it that we had one day, maybe twice a year when they came home that we, my son and I spent together?????

Yes, you deserve at least one day together.. as long as she has people to visit or something else to do, then fine. Had I gone to my MIL's house in another state, I knew no one and while I don't mind him leaving for a few hours (I can jacuzzi or watch my daughter swim @ the hotel), having him leave for a full day would get to me. Easier to just stay home.

Originally Posted by cremebrulee

You know, in front of my son, once, a long long time ago, she yelled at me and said, "You never ask to talk to me on the phone". I said, "well, I really didn't think you wanted to talk to me?" So after that, I called her all these years, and by the way, she to has a cell phone, so she can look and see that it is me calling and not once, in all these years, has she answered the phone when I called, let alone called me back. Once I mentioned to my son, that I had called her and she didn't call back, b/c I wanted to ask her something.

I can relate to this. I shouldn't say this but am going to.. My MIL won't call my house.. she calls his cell. I've been trying to get a relationship with her for years.. unsuccessfully. So, if I see her number on the caller ID for those few times she will call the house, I don't pick it up because I know she's not calling to talk to me. I don't know how similar your situation is but on Christmas either she'll call or my hubby will call her, never once has she asked to say Merry Christmas to me.

Originally Posted by cremebrulee

whew, yes, that is how I feel, and I'm real tired of him being caught in the middle, I tried to tell her once, how hard this much be hurting him and she screamed at me..."It's not about him", it's about you and me??????

If the two of you can't get along, then yes, it's between the two of you. My SS doesn't like me; it's driven a wedge between my hubby & I at times. No matter what I do for this "kid" he hates me. My hubby & I finally came to terms with this.. he doesn't want to hear from his kid how he thinks I'm this or that.. and things are better. I in turn don't vent about wondering what I've done that his son is mad at me.

I am very supportive of his relationship with his son, always have been. Deep down I wish he would stop disliking me so much, but it's his problem not mine as I can't change it just like you can't change the way your DIL feels.

I don't doubt it would help if your son took the attitude that it's between both of you to her and told her that he's going to have a relationship with you with or without her and it includes your GD. Hopefully he will come around one day.. you won't live forever & he can't take back time. I hope he comes to his senses.

Originally Posted by cremebrulee

But yeah, you are right....I feel right now, I'm doing what is best for everyone, not just me...besides, I'm real tired of the whole deal...and I know some people might think, how can she do that....believe me, it was not an easy decission.

Right now you have to do what you have to do. You might want to explain to your son that right now after losing your mom you can't deal with this BS right now.. tell him that maybe you're too sensative right now.. but right now it's about you and in order to heal from the death, you need to focus on happy things and not things that bring you down.

You can still have him in your life, he can call you while he's driving to work. He should also make it a point to tell his wife that you need communication from your GD and that he won't deny you that. Chances are she has him where she wants him from what you say and he won't. Just try to be there for him if he calls you and try to understand that right now he's probably hurting too; trying to make sense of all she's said against you.

Keep it in your mind that if something happens to your son, you might not get a phone call. I know we don't want to think of these things but my hubby was injured 2 months ago.. his son was one of my 1st phone calls & after that experience, I might think twice before I call him. It will depend on the situation. Of course since I'm the way I am, I'll probably set myself up for some more of what I got because after all it's his kid.

Originally Posted by cremebrulee

Early on, before I went for the visit, I had sent my DIL, a picture of a few homes I wanted to see while there. (as I've always wanted to retire in a warm climate) She sent me an email back....which said...."are you thinking about moving here) I said yes....I think that threatened her and that is why she acted the way she did.

If you want to move closer to your son, then do it. Look at houses online then go out and see them. Don't tell him you'll be there, just go. When you are finishing up what you went there to do, call him to let him know you're in the area and can you meet for lunch.

Originally Posted by cremebrulee

Yes, I continue to send my GD money gifts at their home....which I wrote him and letter and told him so in it...and sent it to his work. I honestly do not remember all that was in the letter...but I was pretty blunt....I do know that. It started out that I wanted him to know that my mom died...and I told him I didn't want anymore phone calls, that I couldn't manage this any longer.

Have you considered making a bank account for your GD? This will allow you to feel like you are giving her gifts. We do this with my hubby's GD. I will send something small, then we put the rest in the account. When she gets old enough to realize it, I think she'll be pleased with how much money she'll have

[cremebrulee]

[quote=Roselvr;2451945]Creme, I typed this out over a few days.. tried to get it posted yesterday but didn't have time. Hopefully something will be useful to you.

Thank you deeply for the time and offering here...

I'm very sorry. I was very close to my dad, when I lost him 2 years ago, it hurt more then anything.

Yes, no matter how old you are or they are, they are still your parents, and I miss mom to...sorry you've had to experience the heartache of this....

Right now you need to focus on yourself & healing. I don't doubt you're in shock from losing your mom.. and to have this toxic relationship with your DIL.. well I don't doubt you're a bit extra sensative.

Yes, I was, very, as I also took care of my mom for the past 12 years, so that in itself was pretty stressful, especially the last 4 years. It was my choice, I wanted to do it with no regrets.

You need your son right now.. My FIL got sick within days of my dad dying.. I let my husband go to be with his mom, even though I needed him. My husband allowed me to care for my dad during his 9 months of being sick, the least I could do is put my own needs aside and let him be with his dad / mother / family. It hurt, trust me. Him being gone days / a week; multiple times during the next few weeks. I'd cry.. I felt so alone.

No, I don't need my son, not the way he is now...like I said, he is so different, like a stranger. He's not allowed to joke around much, she gets mad if he does...he seems pre occupied in thought all the time. My guess is, he is worried about making her angry or what he's going to find when he walks in the door....if she gets angry, it is not a pretty sight.

His dad died a few weeks later.. I couldn't fly out due to my back, but my hubby was there at the time. To this day I feel guilty for not being able to go out there.. I'm not even sure if his mother knows what I gave up..

One thing I never vocolized before....I had two knee replacements...total knee replacement....and he never came home for a day or two to be there....but, he did phone me every single day...although, I guess since he lives in another state and has a family...I can understand....and I did have my sister. It would have been nice if he had been there....but, I will say this, although I'm certain, he knew it couldn't happen, he offered me to come where he lives and have it done, but that would have been impossible.

I know what you're saying and if the tables were turned would she do this with her family? Probably not. But he does it with his. Yes, she would, her mother abandoned them all when they were kids....made a living out of marrying men to take care of her, then divorced them and took them for all she could get. My DIL and her mother and sister are off and on all the time...yes, she has been hurt deeply in her life, and there was a time, when I hoped we could be friends....but she refused...she allows you so close, and then that is it, and that is not very close....but understandable, she fears failing me and then loosing the friendship, I think. I think, and this is just me, deep down, she sabotoges relationships at her convenience...or b/c she fears no one will like her...? I dunno, I'm rather tired of trying to figure her out.

There was a way everyone could have lived in peace. If the two of you don't get along, you see your son & GD without her. He has an obligation as your son.

Yes, we tried that, but she didn't like that either, so, she pretended to like me just a little so she could have more control, and forgive me, cuz I could be wrong, but, sometimes, I think she enjoys hurting me? I dunno. Believe me, I have not put down everything she has done...it would take days....

I was in a similar situation with my son for 4 years, thankfully they didn't get married or have kids but it was hard to let him go & I did. Once "she won" she didn't want him any more.

Yeah, I hear ya there, sometimes they loose interrest...someone even suggested that she may miss my being around...beleive me I was very generous with money to them...and she may come around....but I know her, and this is what she's been striving for all along. Thank God your son didn't marry her, or you would be in the same situation....young women who have had very bad backgrounds are really hateful, jealous and immature, also self imposed....and they fight the mother in laws and call them all kinds of names???? I don't get it, fighting never solves anything. I've read some Daughter In Law stories on line and you should hear the way they talk about their mother in laws...and, some of them, have just cause, but not to call them fowl names, regardless, these women were the mothers of their hubbys and you'd think they'd realize how badly they are hurting their husbands by being like this?



Yes, you deserve at least one day together.. as long as she has people to visit or something else to do, then fine. Had I gone to my MIL's house in another state, I knew no one and while I don't mind him leaving for a few hours (I can jacuzzi or watch my daughter swim @ the hotel), having him leave for a full day would get to me. Easier to just stay home.

Yes, I agree, but it can't be. Soon after she started involving herself in my life....they came to visit me...and my son and I were having a conversation...everything was going well, and all of a sudden, she just got up, and said, like a hissy fit, "Good Bye" and walked out...?????? Right then and there my son should have known what was going on. Here is the clincher, she returned to my son's father's home, and they told me when she returned, she acted as if nothing happened, walked around the house, smiling and all happy???????? Sheesh????? Meanwhile my son came back, and the end of our conversation, he started blamming me, screaming at me, and I threw him out and screamed back,,,,it was awful, very heated and very hurtful...I still cannot believe my son and I have resorted to this...I can't. It is something I never knew before.

I can relate to this. I shouldn't say this but am going to.. My MIL won't call my house.. she calls his cell. I've been trying to get a relationship with her for years.. unsuccessfully. So, if I see her number on the caller ID for those few times she will call the house, I don't pick it up because I know she's not calling to talk to me. I don't know how similar your situation is but on Christmas either she'll call or my hubby will call her, never once has she asked to say Merry Christmas to me.

Well, as I said, I really didn't think she wanted to talk to me, so then, when she said that, I started calling for the past 6 years, and only once, in those six years, did she ever return the call. And if I sent her a gift, she would call my answering machine and thank me so she didn't have to talk to me, she was sending me a message, and pretending in front of my son, like it hurt HER b/c I didn't call. She is very manipulative and sets up situations....amazing....my sister says, I'm to naive...and am never ready to respond to such goings on, and I'm not. It shocks me. Then I really get pissed and clam up so I don't say things I cannot take back.

If the two of you can't get along, then yes, it's between the two of you. My SS doesn't like me; it's driven a wedge between my hubby & I at times. No matter what I do for this "kid" he hates me. My hubby & I finally came to terms with this.. he doesn't want to hear from his kid how he thinks I'm this or that.. and things are better. I in turn don't vent about wondering what I've done that his son is mad at me.

What I was trying to explain to her, that this has to be hurting him...big time, and it is not fair of both of us to do this to him...but she wouldn't allow me to finish, you see, he was on the other end and she had to have control....otherwise, if she would have allowed me to talk, then he might have started to think about things, yanno?

I am very supportive of his relationship with his son, always have been. Deep down I wish he would stop disliking me so much, but it's his problem not mine as I can't change it just like you can't change the way your DIL feels.

Maybe it's not you he dislikes really, maybe it is misdirected anger at loosing his mother, cuz son's most of the time, are very close to their mom's and maybe he has never been able to accept loosing her....?

I don't doubt it would help if your son took the attitude that it's between both of you to her and told her that he's going to have a relationship with you with or without her and it includes your GD. Hopefully he will come around one day.. you won't live forever & he can't take back time. I hope he comes to his senses.

I think that is what happened before, but like I said, she didn't like the fact that we had a great day together??????

Right now you have to do what you have to do. You might want to explain to your son that right now after losing your mom you can't deal with this BS right now.. tell him that maybe you're too sensative right now.. but right now it's about you and in order to heal from the death, you need to focus on happy things and not things that bring you down.

Nope, I'm done talking and explaining, remember, this has been going on for 10 years, and like I explained, that is a long time...and sadly I don't even know who he is anymore b/c of the time we've been apart...mentally and geographically. I don't know, if I could ever forgive him, and the more I'm around him, the more he seems short tempered, he isn't the patient man he used to be...he seems to bring things up b/c he to wants to win the conversation....that, is the only importance...it's not about feelings anymore...and when we discuss the issue, he is constantly trying to convince me, she's a decent person? Then he asks me what happened, and when I tell him he'll say, wull she didn't mean it, or I took her wrong...or I was the one who initiated it???? That is not fair to him or me. No way to be.


You can still have him in your life, he can call you while he's driving to work. He should also make it a point to tell his wife that you need communication from your GD and that he won't deny you that. Chances are she has him where she wants him from what you say and he won't. Just try to be there for him if he calls you and try to understand that right now he's probably hurting too; trying to make sense of all she's said against you.

He used to call me like that, but since my last visit, I want nothing to do with him. Once, when this was going on, he was driving me to the airport...he started yelling at me, like I was some kind of terrible person, no good or something....I tell you, I cried all the way home on the plane, I was so embarrassed, but I couldn't stop crying. Awful

Keep it in your mind that if something happens to your son, you might not get a phone call. I know we don't want to think of these things but my hubby was injured 2 months ago.. his son was one of my 1st phone calls & after that experience, I might think twice before I call him. It will depend on the situation. Of course since I'm the way I am, I'll probably set myself up for some more of what I got because after all it's his kid.

I know that....and I've contemplated it b/c of his career choice, but I'll have to deal with it if and when it happens. I can't go on like this, and with time, I'll be happier and more confident about myself. But I won't allow her or him to pull me down to that level any longer...and by the way, they go to church every week????????? Never ceases to surprise me. His stepmother abused him verbally, and even hit him, and she went to church every week...???? Go figure??????

If you want to move closer to your son, then do it. Look at houses online then go out and see them. Don't tell him you'll be there, just go. When you are finishing up what you went there to do, call him to let him know you're in the area and can you meet for lunch.

I've thought of that, and maybe someday I will, not to be closer to them, but to move down south as the cold weather is not my favorite thing? My girlfriend said, you can move anywhere you want to move, don't let her stop you, and she is right...I just don't want to make the situation worse.



Have you considered making a bank account for your GD? This will allow you to feel like you are giving her gifts. We do this with my hubby's GD. I will send something small, then we put the rest in the account. When she gets old enough to realize it, I think she'll be pleased with how much money she'll have

Yes, I have, but, my son can really use the help right now....so, that is why I send it...and have told him so, b/c its sad to say, but I just do not trust her, I can't. And that is another reason why I've cut it off...if she hadn't been my son's wife, she'd never have had the control to hurt us so badly....but, unfortunately?

I figure, there is a lesson for me somewhere in all of this...time has been good to me, and I've lived a very good life, and I cherish the time I've been given with my son, since the day he was born, he was a special child and a good son, easy to raise and a joy to be around. He used to be a people magnet.....
Now it's his time, his life, and he must do what he's got to do...

Thank you for your care, this was so kind of you to disect the conversation and add your thoughts...I appreciate everyone's advice and who knows, maybe in time, right?

And I hope all works out for you to...good luck...and stay the course.

Hugs and love to you
Creme