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Old 01-28-2015, 05:12 PM
 
5,121 posts, read 5,324,348 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dewdroplet76 View Post
How so? Women never get their heart broken? Women never get cheated on? Women never get lied to?

Love is always a risk but if you find the right person - it's worth everything.
Risk, and a lot of work (which is probably a lot of the reason I am getting tired of dating). My ex husband was a lot of risk... wracking up debt, spending all our joint savings, all before telling me he was gay and asking for a divorce. It sucked... especially after years of being a devoted wife who endured those long, over seas deployments and sacrificed job advancements and earning potential to follow him to his commands. It's like all my love, devotion, and sacrifice was for nothing.

Now that I am out dating again, I am dealing with either messed up men or men who are great, but are too focused on re-marriage (a goal I don't share) to make it a good match. Then I keep reading what some of these guys write and how they really feel about women and it makes me question the motives of every guy out there. I think I am just getting a bit tired of it all (and need a good long break. I already removed myself from the dating pool so to speak by taking down my online profile and quitting my speed dating and singles groups). I am not closing any doors... I am just not trying anymore for a while.

But I will agree, if you can find that right person, it's worth all the frustration, heartache, and such. But when it becomes too much for you, take a break (before you become bitter and hateful).
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Old 01-28-2015, 05:33 PM
 
1,255 posts, read 1,246,709 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jillabean View Post
Marriage rates are declining for three reasons:

1) People are getting married later in life/delaying marriage. The age of first time marriage is at an history high. It's pushing 30-years-old.
2) People are getting divorced less often (the divorce rate is also been dropping steadily... which means less people divorcing and marrying again).
3) Some people opt not to get married and instead go for co-habitation. The rate for co-habitation is up and it's more socially acceptable.

People are pairing up just as much as they ever did. It's just the timing (delaying marriage) and dynamics of how they pair up (like co-habitation) that are different.



I am finding I am starting to think this way too. When I date I find two types of men. The "messed up in the head" (mean, jerks, liars, cheaters, or just plain mentally ill) or are great guys but they are chomping at the bit for marriage (I don't want to marry again). Been dating for three years and every man I've met falls into one of those two buckets and it's annoying, frustrating, and disheartening. That, combined with what goes on in so many men's heads and how they judge and value (or don't value) women just because they don't have a Y chromosome (which I've learned from this forum), kind of just turns me off to dating in general (don't want to risk my happiness by getting stuck with "one of those" kinds of men).

That said, I am in the minority and I know it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by timberline742 View Post
this

Reason why divorce rates appear to be "stagnant" is the following:
1. it became a standard for divorced folks to cohabit indefinitely/stay "single" instead of remarrying (marriage rates for divorced folks is very low). Pay note that divorced folks were almost universally remarrying at about same rates as unmarried folks at this changed in last few decades, divorce rates were and still are significantly higher for those who remarry.
2. it became almost universal rule to cohabit before even planning to marry these days and mainstream couples who marry these days also happen to cohabit for at least a year. This has put a stop to so-called "test marriages" which were very common some 50-60 years ago. Test-cohabitation has put a stop to almost all of these instances and thus it doesn't affect statistic significantly these days.
3. it became a mainstream way to have a child together before marrying. About half of all first-born children are born outside of marriage, over 40% of total annual births are out of wedlock, about 60% of birth for mothers under 30 y/o are births out of wedlock. Many of these couples frequently separate without ever marrying in first place. This further decreases divorce rates since couples WITH a child have always had significantly lower divorce rates. I.e. childless married couples have close to 90% chance to divorce within their lifetime if they remain childless. Childless cohabiting couples have a 95% chance to split within the next 20 years if they remain unmarried and childless. Enough said.

Please notice that there's only one more thing that perpetuates desire for younger generations to get married - the myth that marriage plays a role in parenting. It's rather a correlation and not a causation.
Another "reason" often revolves around Jesus, Mohammad, Buddha, Shiva, JHWH, Rainbow Unicorn, religion in general.

Like I said in my previous post, a good argument for most couples to marry SHOULD be social security - thanks to government-imposed discrimination. They also plan on to implement "singles taxes" as well as "common-law marriage" enforcement on a global level - effectively showing that they don't care about justice, they only care to perpetuate this dying institution.

Only factor that bumps both children born in wedlock AND marriages (and remarriages) is the immigration, especially the immigration from very conservative countries.... or it keeps statistics a bit more stagnant, at least. These trends were shown in UK, where they confirmed that immigrants (born in Pakistan, India and Bangladesh) and their children who are born-in-UK almost universally marry and have children within wedlock at increasing rates. They also have higher number of children when compared to average native folks.
If anything, native UK folks with no immigrant background (i.e. born to native-born folks) happen to increasingly cohabit and they increasingly cohabit indefinitely. This is why they want to implement "common-law marriage" and "singles tax" over there, just like they'd wish to do in USA - to implement institution of forced marriage upon people who deliberately eschew it and to impose penalties for those who want to avoid this failing institution.
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Old 01-28-2015, 08:55 PM
FBJ
 
Location: Tall Building down by the river
39,615 posts, read 48,645,623 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rego00123 View Post
why do people care so much about what others decide to do together?

Live your lives and worry about your own "mistakes"


I never understood it either
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Old 01-28-2015, 08:58 PM
FBJ
 
Location: Tall Building down by the river
39,615 posts, read 48,645,623 times
Reputation: 9451
Quote:
Originally Posted by jillabean View Post
Risk, and a lot of work (which is probably a lot of the reason I am getting tired of dating). My ex husband was a lot of risk... wracking up debt, spending all our joint savings, all before telling me he was gay and asking for a divorce. It sucked... especially after years of being a devoted wife who endured those long, over seas deployments and sacrificed job advancements and earning potential to follow him to his commands. It's like all my love, devotion, and sacrifice was for nothing.

Now that I am out dating again, I am dealing with either messed up men or men who are great, but are too focused on re-marriage (a goal I don't share) to make it a good match. Then I keep reading what some of these guys write and how they really feel about women and it makes me question the motives of every guy out there. I think I am just getting a bit tired of it all (and need a good long break. I already removed myself from the dating pool so to speak by taking down my online profile and quitting my speed dating and singles groups). I am not closing any doors... I am just not trying anymore for a while.

But I will agree, if you can find that right person, it's worth all the frustration, heartache, and such. But when it becomes too much for you, take a break (before you become bitter and hateful).
Your post confirms why Friends with Benefits is so popular
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Old 01-28-2015, 09:58 PM
 
33,063 posts, read 22,978,590 times
Reputation: 30086
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheSmuggler View Post
I'm just guessing here that you're a woman.

If that is the case, of course love is worth it to you, it's all reward and very little risk.


Not sure why this is gender based to you. I'm a guy, and I think love is worth almost anything.
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Old 01-28-2015, 10:18 PM
 
6,884 posts, read 4,480,417 times
Reputation: 12081
Quote:
Originally Posted by nald View Post
... childless married couples have close to 90% chance to divorce within their lifetime if they remain childless. Childless cohabiting couples have a 95% chance to split within the next 20 years if they remain unmarried and childless.
Source, please? I am avowedly child-free, and divorced. The cause of the divorce was my then-wife diametrically changing her mind about parenthood, deciding that she'd want to have a child after all. She's since remarried and indeed now has a child.

Were there to have been any serious reason to suppose that 90% of child-free marriages end in divorce, I would never have married. Which brings me to....

Quote:
Originally Posted by vigueur2014 View Post
Yeah, so if you want to make that comparison, that would mean that if traditional relationships end with a 90% failure rate, that a wiser man would just invest in his left hand, and a bottle of hand lotion.
The failure rate of casual dates, occasional flings and half-baked amorous ventures might be 90%, or 99%, or whatever. But the failure-rate of marriages is [I assume] not 90%. Even the failure rate of serious non-marital romantic relationships is [again I assume] not 90%. If it were, then indeed I'd not have bothered pursuing a long-term relationship, let alone having gotten married.
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Old 01-28-2015, 10:20 PM
 
6,884 posts, read 4,480,417 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timberline742 View Post
I'm a guy, and I think love is worth almost anything.
I'm a guy, and I don't think that there's really anything that's worth "almost anything". And by that I mean romantic or filial love, patriotism, loyalty, health, scientific progress, justice, human rights, pursuit of truth and so forth. By my reckoning, very few things are worth much of anything. Full stop.
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Old 01-28-2015, 10:23 PM
 
Location: Katonah, NY
21,199 posts, read 20,232,724 times
Reputation: 22104
Quote:
Originally Posted by ohio_peasant View Post
I'm a guy, and I don't think that there's really anything that's worth "almost anything". And by that I mean romantic or filial love, patriotism, loyalty, health, scientific progress, pursuit of truth and so forth. By my reckoning, very few things are worth much of anything. Full stop.
Then what do you think the purpose of your life is? Love has given my life meaning - and I don't just mean the love I feel for my husband.
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Old 01-28-2015, 10:27 PM
 
33,063 posts, read 22,978,590 times
Reputation: 30086
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dewdroplet76 View Post
Then what do you think the purpose of your life is? Love has given my life meaning - and I don't just mean the love I feel for my husband.


For me, learning, creating (whatever, music, art,whatever), and making connections with people I care about, as friends, lovers, etc is what drives life. That and seeing the world (travel).
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Old 01-28-2015, 10:28 PM
 
6,884 posts, read 4,480,417 times
Reputation: 12081
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dewdroplet76 View Post
Then what do you think the purpose of your life is? Love has given my life meaning - and I don't just mean the love I feel for my husband.
I quite sincerely (as opposed to cynically) question there being a "purpose" or even a utilitarian benefit to life. In an operational sense, my "purpose" is perhaps to advance science (however incrementally) in my workplace, perhaps to write an occasional poem, to take an aesthetically stimulating photograph, and so forth. But this is "purpose" in the sense of daily animating drive, or reason to get up every morning. It's things to which to look forward on a recurring basis. In the same category I'd include romantic association with another person. But as for grand, cosmic "purpose"? None, none at all.

My antinatalism ultimately stems from belief that the production of new human life is mistaken and morally misguided. It needlessly punishes the new human being, by sentencing him or her - to life.

Last edited by ohio_peasant; 01-28-2015 at 11:02 PM..
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