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Women are smart to know what the social convention is and how it works? Because 9 out of 10 times a woman asks a guy out he says no! Yes, despite us hearing that they would just LOVE to be asked out!
But why does this happen? Because guys hate something not being THEIR idea - if THEY didn't pick the woman or notice she was attractive, whatever in the first place she CAN'T be worth going out with. And geez, how desperate must she be for a date if SHE has to ask....so, now - see how it works in the REAL world? Like it or not, that's how it goes down.
You sound no better then the guy you are quoting stereotyping all men like this.
Yeah not all of us are that egotistical and anal about a woman asking us out.
I had a friend that says that when you ask a woman on a date unless he said "I invite you", you are suppossed to "split" everything. Because he is only "asking" not "inviting".
He had to change the M.O because he was getting a lot of complaints. And he's a very succesful lawyer. Now he is the one getting like 3 women on a bar and taking 2 friends to split the bill with women you don't know.
This is one of those perennial topics, and even I dont have time to go thru all 300 previous replies.
I'll just say what works for me, lately, based on the practice of *many* dates in the past couple of years.
Asker pays. Asker determines where we going. Its your FAULT if you bring her to a spendy restaruant on a first date (and yes I've done it).
The more pretty/desirable the girl, the more leeway she gets. The more traditional/conservative/materialistic she is, the more the man is paying for most. The more hangout/fwb/slippery-slope-friendzone/liberal the situation is, the more the woman insists on paying half. The more the woman does NOT want to sleep with you, the more she insists on paying her own way.
In all practically, the woman offers to pay, the man refuses, she playfully insists again, he says you can pay tax or tip or drinks / next time. I get the best RESULT OVERALL when the woman kicks in from 33% to 50% or we take turns paying. When the cashflow is 0%/100% in either direction, usually sometime else is going on, and the odds of subsequent dates, sexytimes and exclusivity go way down.
Asker pays. Asker determines where we going. Its your FAULT if you bring her to a spendy restaruant on a first date (and yes I've done it).
I agree that if the asker, mostly the man, picks something they can't afford then it's on them.
The issue I have with the platitude "whomever asks, pays," is that it's like saying a wolf and a sheep can have an equal decision on what's for dinner. The reality is so lopsided it's more honest to just say "we" expect the man to pay.
Location: Subconscious Syncope, USA (Northeastern US)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by manteca man
I agree that if the asker, mostly the man, picks something they can't afford then it's on them.
The issue I have with the platitude "whomever asks, pays," is that it's like saying a wolf and a sheep can have an equal decision on what's for dinner. The reality is so lopsided it's more honest to just say "we" expect the man to pay.
I agree. I would expect the man to pay. I would never ask a man out, but I would be looking for certain qualities that others may not be looking for, or even think they deserve.
I'm not gold digging, and would settle for a hotdog and fries, as long as he's not stupid enough to think he's going to get laid on this first date. Being a self respecting female, I wouldn't ask him to buy me something expensive for dinner, and if he insisted, I would need an explanation of his motive for wanting to do that for someone he doesn't really know yet. It could be something simple like, "because that's what I want to have." In which case, I would accept.
If you are good company, most normal women are going to enjoy the date regardless of the price.
In opinion, the idea that a man should pay for the date has nothing to do with whether or not he should approach a woman. You approach a woman to ask her out based on attraction, be it physical or otherwise. And any woman who would insist on going dutch isn't a woman I'd be interested in in the first place.
I agree that if the asker, mostly the man, picks something they can't afford then it's on them.
The issue I have with the platitude "whomever asks, pays," is that it's like saying a wolf and a sheep can have an equal decision on what's for dinner. The reality is so lopsided it's more honest to just say "we" expect the man to pay.
But "we" don't all expect the man to pay. Some women do ask and pay. Please stop lumping women together like we're a single entity.
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