Education as a Litmus Test (guys, calling, Latin, partner)

[Metaphysique]

Originally Posted by neutrino78x

Well, you don't have to be a genius to make a decent salary without a college degree.

True. But what does salary have to do with what some of us are saying? I never mentioned salary and college degree =/= high salary. A "decent salary" (which is subjective, right?) or earning potential was not what determined true long term compatibility for me.

You can be a sysadmin or even a programmer at Google without a college degree. A guy who retired from Google in his early 30s told me that Google often hires people as programmers based on their performance on programming competition web sites.

Again, it wasn't about earnings and financial success, and a lot to do with shared backgrounds, ideologies, intellectual pursuits/interests, ways of thinking, love for learning, shared hobbies, etc. I briefly dated a man who is a self-taught software developer who worked for Blizzard making upwards of $150k. He's also a self-taught music composer and producer. The serious partner I dated before my husband is also a self-taught software developer making $100k. My exH is a brilliant, highly gifted man, worked in the intelligence field in the military, is very talented and excelled in his field. He could have easily made $150k working for the DoD and DoD contractors. Those were the offers he got toward the end of his third enlistment. He did not have a degree at the time. He currently has an associates and loves his work as a mail carrier for the USPS.

So, yeah, a lot of people without degrees can be very talented, accomplished and successful. Apart from these men, my husband, and maybe a couple others, my most compatible matches had at least an undergraduate degree, and most a graduate or professional degree.

But all of these men, my highest matches, with and without degrees, have many things in common. They fit my type.

If somebody does have a degree, especially in a STEM field, they're more likely to be an atheist

Yep. This is my type. I dated agnostics, atheists and deists. The vast majority were involved in STEM, education and academia.

or support The ChildFree Philosophy or be ChildFree By Choice.

I met and dated a lot of nontheists. The vast majority in their upper 30s to mid-40s had children, as do I. My husband, an atheist since his later teens, always wanted kids.

Those are deal breakers for me. Well, a weak atheist might work, but not somebody like the Christina Wang character on Grey's Anatomy, who not only does not believe in a higher power, but looks down upon those who do and is also against even the idea of spirituality. Somebody like that could be a good friend, but even if I felt love for them, there would be serious long term compatibility issues.

There are far fewer women than men who fit this description. The number for atheists in the U.S. is pretty small, and even smaller for women who identify as atheist (one of the major hurdles my husband ran into since this was a big preference). I didn't run into a lot of child-free by choice men, and if I did, no big deal. I would think this is hardly the norm for women in the dating scene. Yeah, they exist, but they're not the norm in most areas.

It's weird because people assume that I would be into intellectuals, but actually I'm not. When I hear someone is an intellectual and has some kind of advanced degree, I feel like there are going to be those issues. I tend to be interested in people who are smart but not intellectual. I like tough girls more. Military, police, fire, emergency medical. That's hot.

I prefer intellectuals and creative/artistic types. It's a huge reason for why I fancied my husband from very early on, and why he was so into me. I don't necessarily associate intellectualism with higher education. I have known a number of people who possess advanced degrees that embrace anti-intellectualism. It's more complex than advanced degree vs. no degree or undergraduate degree. My having a graduate degree in popular fiction writing is not what would make me (or anyone) an intellectual. And the same for other fields and disciplines. There's much more to it than that.

[Runninglikethieves]

My best friend is another example, he's one of the smartest people I know.

He has zero college experience. The job he has is pretty good, not particularly a skilled one though. It pays good and he has about 5 months a year off, then works 85-90 hours a week the other 7 months a year.

He is really good with cars. He's made quite a bit of money from buying old cars and fixing them up and selling them at a profit. By quite a bit of money, I'm not talking millions. Just hundreds of thousands. He owns two homes, one is his house and the other is a house right next door that he rents out. He bought the other one a couple years after he moved into the one he lives in, and the one next door happened to be for sale. The one house he lives in is actually paid off and was completely paid off when he was like 27. He basically bought it in cash. He helped me completely renovate my house when I bought it. It was just the two of us doing the work. He also completely rewired this house and has also done this for a couple other friends of ours. His dad is an electrician and he knows a little about that.

He's also a talented musician (although I'm the superior guitar player and he wishes that he could play half the stuff that I can!) and was in a semi successful band for a few years, where he made a modest living off of for at least 2 years. There's no doubt in my mind that if he wanted to be a brain surgeon or rocket scientist, he could be one. But that's not his passion.

[ylisa7]

Bottom line people should not be judged because of their education or lack of education. Obviously for some people it is important and some people it isn't.

[Auraliea]

Originally Posted by ylisa7

Bottom line people should not be judged because of their education or lack of education. Obviously for some people it is important and some people it isn't.

Pretty much.

This is just another one of those things that is impossible to agree on because people want what they want. I don't see any point in discussing it any further. One of the biggest points in life is to go out and experience things on your OWN, and to find out what YOU like. It's okay to have preferences, just don't judge so harshly simply because a person is different from you.

[wanderlust76]

Originally Posted by david0966

I really don't care about other peoples relationship dynamics, I know what works and doesn't work for me. Believe me I have MANY years of experience here. As I said, I have been much more successful with people with a similar education background as me. I've found that we both have more similar interests/hobbies as well as other similarities. Yes, I know there are others that are total opposites, have different interests, etc. and yet have great relationships. That doesn't work for me. Once again, different strokes.

As far as wanting to be with someone with similar education background, it is simply a preference similar to all the others that are always mentioned here ad nauseum (large breasts/butt, tall, full head of hair, etc.). Shallow? Perhaps. However no more shallow than those others mentioned.

Originally Posted by Metaphysique

Exactly. I really don't care what works for others. I know what works for me, and I know there are certain education backgrounds and many other factors that are just a better fit for a long term relationship. If others have different preferences or relationship dynamic, great, but I know the type of dynamic I am most compatible with.

Folks get all defensive and take it as a slight against them or their choice of mate. It isn't about you if we're talking about what works for us.

lol because having a degree isn't a relationship dynamic that's why people such as myself think it's silly. Like I said it's not a personality type.

Let's say you were successful with 5 people that had degrees that doesn't mean the degree had anything to do with it. What if they had a degree, but you didn't. The relationship would have just magically not worked, just because you didn't? What if you dated 5 people with a degree and they were all physically abusive or were cheaters?

I just don't see the logic.

If a guy wants a woman with big breasts or a woman wants a tall guy they can see that with their own eyes...sure it might be shallow, but they're not assuming anything. A piece of paper doesn't make a person or involve physical attraction so there's no humanistic element to it. More women go to college than men anyway so if a guy says he has successful relationships with women with degrees it doesn't really mean anything.

Just like there's no mathematical equation that will give a winning formula at the casino on a long term basis there's no system to finding a compatible partner. It's like the people that think there's a system to win at roulette. Ok black came up 15 times so the next time HAS to be red. Nope. Wrong.

[Metaphysique]

Originally Posted by wanderlust76

lol because having a degree isn't a relationship dynamic that's why people such as myself think it's silly. Like I said it's not a personality type.

Let's say you were successful with 5 people that had degrees that doesn't mean the degree had anything to do with it. What if they had a degree, but you didn't. The relationship would have just magically not worked, just because you didn't? What if you dated 5 people with a degree and they were all physically abusive or were cheaters?

I just don't see the logic.

If a guy wants a woman with big breasts or a woman wants a tall guy they can see that with their own eyes...sure it might be shallow, but they're not assuming anything. A piece of paper doesn't make a person or involve physical attraction so there's no humanistic element to it. More women go to college than men anyway so if a guy says he has successful relationships with women with degrees it doesn't really mean anything.

Just like there's no mathematical equation that will give a winning formula at the casino on a long term basis there's no system to finding a compatible partner. It's like the people that think there's a system to win at roulette. Ok black came up 15 times so the next time HAS to be red. Nope. Wrong.

You obviously didn't read the rest of the thread.

[somebodynew]

When I was in college, I dated a guy who barely made it past high school. There was a reason. He was not the sharpest tool in the shed. If I were dating again, I would not make the "degree" a leading factor. But education? Understanding? Ability to converse on topics of interest? Yup. No feeling of guilt there. The thing about some educations. You get educated. It is kind of cool.

[somebodynew]

Oh incidentally, my DH, while highly educated, does not have a degree.

[Metaphysique]

Originally Posted by wanderlust76

lol because having a degree isn't a relationship dynamic that's why people such as myself think it's silly.

Let me do this all simple-like. A degree itself doesn't say a whole lot about a potential relationship or compatibility. Back when I was dating and interacting with potential "suitors" the majority of men I was matched with possessed a degree. Statistically speaking, this is simply true for my experience. Now, not all of these men were actually compatible for dating or a relationship for a multitude of reasons.

However, the majority of my type, emphasis on my type, possess at least an undergraduate degree, most a graduate degree. There was an obvious trend in the type of men I was most compatible with. As I responded to neutrino, they typically fit a certain type, a type that was a better fit for the kind of relationship dynamic that works for me.

I went on multiple dozens of one-and-done dates, with college-educated men, with lawyers, a couple physicians, business professionals, etc. (a lot of these men were Type A) None of these men were good fits. So like I stated before, it isn't the degree itself that can factor into compatibility (notice how I said factor into and not determine?), but their background and many other factors.

Like I said it's not a personality type.

No duh. I didn't date degrees, I interacted with and dated people, but these people, their personalities, worldview, interests, passions, life goals, can be influenced by their educational interests and backgrounds. That much should be obvious. Notice how I said educational interests and not degree? That can include more than formal education. You're misconstruing my statements of fact, for my experience, that the majority of my matches and men I met possess a degree. I preferred to date men who attended college due to the increased likelihood of having more compatibility, and based on my own experience and observation, this is true.

The majority of men I dated were atheist, agnostic or deist. They were nonreligious. Virtually all of my top matches, mid-90s+% fit this description, and all but a few went to college or possess a degree. Those few I dated, and one I married. One other man I dated for several months, who was also my type, was involved in education and STEM. He has an advanced degree, and yet he and the others are my type for many reasons. They possess many characteristics and qualities that made them my type. There are others I went on several dates with that also have degrees. My top matches, with an without degrees, have many things in common that made them good matches. Note: it isn't "a degree."

Let's say you were successful with 5 people that had degrees that doesn't mean the degree had anything to do with it.

A degree, no, but I'm not talking about "a degree," and am talking about specific educational backgrounds and interests. Like neutrino stated, there are a lot of nonreligious folks involved in STEM. My top matches were either involved in: STEM, education (teachers) or academia. The were also: sci-fi and fantasy geeks, gamers, comic book nerds, movie geeks, cosplayers, artistic/creative (writers, musicians, artists, etc.), identical or very similar taste in music, introverted, similar "love language," similar temperaments, similar intellectual interests, etc. (not everyone puts a lot of weight into MBTI, but they were all either INTP or INFP. My exH is ISFP. All of my best matches were very similar in personality and educational interests and careers)

I did not have these things in common with the absolute vast majority of others outside these fields and personality types. Not the lawyers, doctors, MBA holders, etc. My best matches were typically other introverts involved in and passionate about the things I am with similar worldview and outlook. These men were involved in certain fields of study or careers. They were educators, writers, video game designers, software developers, programmers. Get it? My husband dropped out of an engineering program after his freshman year, and then began working as a lifeguard and swim instructor, and has been working in the martial arts field for over a decade. He can code, is very STEM-minded, loves the humanities, is artistic/creative, loves comic books, gaming, sci-fi/fantasy, and is pretty brilliant. He didn't finish his undergrad. So, no, "a degree" is not the real issue here.

You're focusing on "a degree" and not the specific reasons for why certain backgrounds can factor into compatibility and relationship dynamics. It's like what others stated, doctors are often coupled with other doctors, and lawyers with lawyers, and engineers with engineers. My husband and I have near-identical backgrounds, though he is naturally more inclined toward STEM than I am. I find many STEM fields fascinating, but math and I aren't very good friends.

What if they had a degree, but you didn't.

Well, when I started dating again I hadn't gone back to school (I was conflicted between following my passion or going with the status quo), but I was very intelligent, educated and involved in intense academic study in my fields, and it was an ex-boyfriend, an educator, who saw my potential and encouraged me to pursue my passion. And I did. Not for a "piece of paper," 'cause I was already brilliant and knew my field like the back of my hand, but because I cannot formally pursue my field without a degree.

The relationship would have just magically not worked, just because you didn't?

They worked (until they didn't) because I was a compatible fit for them, which absolutely included educational background. We shared the same values and worldview (and not in the generic/basic sense).

What if you dated 5 people with a degree and they were all physically abusive or were cheaters?

What does "a degree" have to do with this? There are people with and without degrees who behave in questionable ways. I think you're focusing too much on "a degree" rather than factors that can influence many aspects of an individual's life and worldview. Educational background, which is specific to the nature or type of background, can play a significant role in relationship compatibility and dynamic. Perhaps not for you, but it certainly does for many others. I wouldn't have dated a minister with a MDiv. I also wasn't really into dating men of certain disciplines or careers due to lack of compatibility. After going on 100+ dates, I had a pretty good idea about the type I'm most compatible with.

I didn't pursue a relationship with men who weren't a good fit, whether or not they had a degree or two. I went on a lot of one-and-done dates with college-educated men. They didn't go beyond the first date, so does that mean college-educated men are incompatible? No. It means those men, for a multitude of reasons, were incompatible. But the majority of men who were, were also college-educated, and all of them possessed different backgrounds than the very incompatible dates.

[david0966]

Originally Posted by wanderlust76

lol because having a degree isn't a relationship dynamic that's why people such as myself think it's silly. Like I said it's not a personality type.

Let's say you were successful with 5 people that had degrees that doesn't mean the degree had anything to do with it. What if they had a degree, but you didn't. The relationship would have just magically not worked, just because you didn't? What if you dated 5 people with a degree and they were all physically abusive or were cheaters?

I just don't see the logic.

If a guy wants a woman with big breasts or a woman wants a tall guy they can see that with their own eyes...sure it might be shallow, but they're not assuming anything. A piece of paper doesn't make a person or involve physical attraction so there's no humanistic element to it. More women go to college than men anyway so if a guy says he has successful relationships with women with degrees it doesn't really mean anything.

Just like there's no mathematical equation that will give a winning formula at the casino on a long term basis there's no system to finding a compatible partner. It's like the people that think there's a system to win at roulette. Ok black came up 15 times so the next time HAS to be red. Nope. Wrong.

Wow you sure like to argue. Just FYI, I have never actively only searched for someone with "a piece of paper". It just turns out that nearly all the ones I hit it off with did have the same educational background as me. When I was on OKC, every woman I dated had at least a Bachelors, some had a lot more. I did not specifically seek this, it just turned out this way based on the questions I answered and shared interests and hobbies.

Also, I don't care what you say, this is just another preference. It's no different than choosing someone based on physical attributes which nobody seems to have a problem with. The bottom line is it works for me so that's all that matters. I don't care what works for others.