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Old 07-15-2019, 07:00 AM
 
998 posts, read 281,532 times
Reputation: 2808

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Quote:
Originally Posted by allison7 View Post
I'd have to find the right man before I could say, and I'm thinking one important ingredient to the mix would depend on how old I am at the time this comes up.

I don't like to date men who are locked in one particular way of thinking. If a man tells me right away, "no way am I having kids" or if he says, "I want kids, how many do you want?", I probably woudn't date either guy. It's not the first thing I want to talk about, and if he hates kids, or if it's all he thinks about, who needs either one? I like men who are well educated, successful, and not too set in their ways. They should be open for seeing where the relationship and life takes them, that's all I would ask.
Anyone who's "well educated and successful" probably didn't get there by coasting through life to "see where life takes them" without having made definite decisions about what they want for their present and future. You want someone to be set in their decision about their career, being with you, etc., right? So why shouldn't they be certain about their other life decisions as well?


Mod cut.

Last edited by PJSaturn; 07-15-2019 at 10:02 AM.. Reason: Baiting; bickering.

 
Old 07-15-2019, 08:36 AM
 
150 posts, read 25,837 times
Reputation: 199
Quote:
Originally Posted by wasel View Post
Um, having kids (or not) is a pretty big life decision. Feeling one way or another about THAT is not "closed mindedness." It's not like you're talking about whether to become vegan or something for god's sake.
You are re-writing what I said. Wanting kids or not is okay with me, I have dated both. Do you think people never change at 28 or 35 from what they felt at 22 in both directions?

My point was this: I don't find either extreme alluring in a man I have just started to date, if the first words out of his mouth are he doesn't want kids ever or he's looking to have a kid yesterday and wants to know how many I want. Wait to discuss kids, or not, further into the dating relationship because more than likely, it isn't going to be needed. People that think they need to divulge how they feel about kids, pro or con, on the second date are irritating.
 
Old 07-15-2019, 08:52 AM
 
Location: Colorado
12,033 posts, read 7,407,885 times
Reputation: 21659
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lou View Post
It happens enough for a man to be mindful of the possibility. Sometimes she'll try to pass it off as an innocent accident. Sometimes she'll think she has him pegged as the kind of man who will feel duty-bound to stay. Sometimes, she'll want a baby so much that she'll accept the probability of him leaving. Along with the men who have been gutted by that worst betrayal are the men who don't know it happened to them (which doesn't make it any better).
Quote:
Originally Posted by TashaPosh View Post
If you think your Gf or wife would betray you like this....or if you know she wants a baby THAT badly, then why would you stay with her?
A lot of people do not realize that they are with a user or an unethical person until way down the line. It's amazing how we can fool ourselves. I don't think it could be a common thing for one person to "trick" the other into reproduction, I really think it's got to be incredibly rare. But I don't go so far as to say it is impossible.

I think what is more common is probably a situation where it looks like an accident, and it IS an accident, but after a nasty breakup when people are taking score of the wrongs they believe a partner inflicted upon them, they get a seed of doubt in their minds...

This is kind of where I am at. Finding out after being with my ex for 18 years, during our breakup, that with his previous wife he was desperate to be a father to the point where they kept trying through numerous miscarriages and even though it endangered her health... I look back to the beginning when I told him repeatedly that I did not want to be a wife or a mother, and yet he proceeded with our relationship, even knowing that absolute commitment was the only thing he would find acceptable and that he wanted kids very badly, and HE DID NOT TELL ME any of that at the time... I feel tricked. I feel that he just let our life's circumstances force me into the relationship form that he wanted. I don't feel that I was given all of the information to make a solid choice, even if I'd been older and wiser to make one.

So yes, I wonder if he tampered with our birth control. But not only do I have no proof, so I cannot and do not go so far as to accuse him of that... But it hardly matters, because we were only using condoms for a while there and I know that you just cannot really count on them as solid, reliable contraceptive coverage.

I think if you took the group of people who simply BELIEVE that their partner deliberately allowed a pregnancy to happen against their wishes...but they have no proof and it was actually an accident...

And you compared that group, to one where the person who facilitated the incidence of pregnancy actually admits to this, or there was actual proof... The first group would be far, far bigger than the second. But all that first group has really got is, "My ex is shady, and I would put nothing past them." Well jeez, how many of us feel that way?
 
Old 07-15-2019, 09:04 AM
 
Location: D.C.
2,878 posts, read 1,834,060 times
Reputation: 3908
Quote:
Originally Posted by allison7 View Post
You are re-writing what I said. Wanting kids or not is okay with me, I have dated both. Do you think people never change at 28 or 35 from what they felt at 22 in both directions?

My point was this: I don't find either extreme alluring in a man I have just started to date, if the first words out of his mouth are he doesn't want kids ever or he's looking to have a kid yesterday and wants to know how many I want. Wait to discuss kids, or not, further into the dating relationship because more than likely, it isn't going to be needed. People that think they need to divulge how they feel about kids, pro or con, on the second date are irritating.
This is crazy. Why continue dating someone when you know you want or donít want kids. I did exactly what you suggested several times when I was in my twenties. One woman I had dated for several months and the kids thing was never mentioned. I finally brought it up and she said she definitely wanted kids. I said I didnít. Her next response was ďoh youíre young Iím sure youíll change your mind in a few yearsĒ. I just stared at her for about 10 seconds and explained to her that I will NEVER change my mind, I do not want kids, ever. After several minutes of silence I said we should just end it there. She became very upset and called me every four-letter name in the book. If this had been discussed earlier, like the second or third date, this would have been avoided. From then on, I always brought this up on the second date. This is way too important to wait.
 
Old 07-15-2019, 09:13 AM
 
150 posts, read 25,837 times
Reputation: 199
Quote:
Originally Posted by david0966 View Post
This is crazy. Why continue dating someone when you know you want or donít want kids. I did exactly what you suggested several times when I was in my twenties. One woman I had dated for several months and the kids thing was never mentioned. I finally brought it up and she said she definitely wanted kids. I said I didnít. Her next response was ďoh youíre young Iím sure youíll change your mind in a few yearsĒ. I just stared at her for about 10 seconds and explained to her that I will NEVER change my mind, I do not want kids, ever. After several minutes of silence I said we should just end it there. She became very upset and called me every four-letter name in the book. If this had been discussed earlier, like the second or third date, this would have been avoided. From then on, I always brought this up on the second date. This is way too important to wait.
I don't want to hear about it on the first or second date, it's premature. If I haven't slept with the man yet, it is unappealing to hear he is wanting a baby yesterday.
 
Old 07-15-2019, 09:18 AM
 
7,649 posts, read 3,009,598 times
Reputation: 12613
I didn’t want kids at all. Never even babysat in my life. After marriage, feeling more secure in myself and the process of aging that brings on a more open mind of who I could be or who I am, I changed my mind! Just like my husband hoped for.

Luckily I was sure enough in that opinion that any blame and resentment, about MY choice didn’t come into play, no matter how one can not predict the future of their relationship.
 
Old 07-15-2019, 09:29 AM
 
Location: D.C.
2,878 posts, read 1,834,060 times
Reputation: 3908
Quote:
Originally Posted by K12144 View Post
Anyone who's "well educated and successful" probably didn't get there by coasting through life to "see where life takes them" without having made definite decisions about what they want for their present and future. You want someone to be set in their decision about their career, being with you, etc., right? So why shouldn't they be certain about their other life decisions as well?
Great post. I donít understand why some people still canít comprehend the idea that you can actually know what you want at a young age and that you will never change your mind on that. I knew I didnít want kids when I was in my teens, and at 52 now I have never wavered on that, even though I was in several relationships where she thought she was certain I would change my mind.
 
Old 07-15-2019, 09:36 AM
 
150 posts, read 25,837 times
Reputation: 199
Quote:
Originally Posted by david0966 View Post
Great post. I donít understand why some people still canít comprehend the idea that you can actually know what you want at a young age and that you will never change your mind on that. I knew I didnít want kids when I was in my teens, and at 52 now I have never wavered on that, even though I was in several relationships where she thought she was certain I would change my mind.
If that's you, that's okay. People accept it. It is unappealing for me to be just starting to date a man and he starts telling me how he never wants kids or if he wanted them yesterday. How does he even know I want marriage? It's too soon to jump into that playpen. If I haven't even slept with him yet, what makes him think I want to know his feelings on kids? It's presumptuous. Give us some air, and let's see if we have other things in common and if we like to be together, and then it becomes more important to know. Most first or second dates do not go into long relationships so why get into it so early?
 
Old 07-15-2019, 09:51 AM
 
7,649 posts, read 3,009,598 times
Reputation: 12613
Quote:
Originally Posted by david0966 View Post
Great post. I don’t understand why some people still can’t comprehend the idea that you can actually know what you want at a young age and that you will never change your mind on that. I knew I didn’t want kids when I was in my teens, and at 52 now I have never wavered on that, even though I was in several relationships where she thought she was certain I would change my mind.
And some people truly change. They change their mind. They are a different person 5 years later. Especially as a young adult. Probably not much mind changing after 40 though...

I didn’t want kids, didn’t think I could be a good mother. Didn’t think it was my calling...then saw some really horrendous parents and average parents, and some great parents. Realizing that at least I know enough to not be rotten, that must mean I can succeed at this thing!

Now I’m really hoping for a grandchild. My daughter’s at the age I was and saying the same things: she has other priorities and probably wouldn’t be any good at it. So in my head I’m thinking: There’s hope for that grand baby yet.
 
Old 07-15-2019, 10:02 AM
 
Location: D.C.
2,878 posts, read 1,834,060 times
Reputation: 3908
Quote:
Originally Posted by allison7 View Post
If that's you, that's okay. People accept it. It is unappealing for me to be just starting to date a man and he starts telling me how he never wants kids or if he wanted them yesterday. How does he even know I want marriage? It's too soon to jump into that playpen. If I haven't even slept with him yet, what makes him think I want to know his feelings on kids? It's presumptuous. Give us some air, and let's see if we have other things in common and if we like to be together, and then it becomes more important to know. Most first or second dates do not go into long relationships so why get into it so early?
So I got a vasectomy when I was 24 after a pregnancy scare (she had a miscarriage). Based on what you are saying I should just not disclose that as soon as possible because as you say ďmost first or second dates do not go into long relationshipsĒ.
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