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Old Yesterday, 08:32 PM
 
843 posts, read 211,282 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carly1983 View Post
I'm not sure you'd find a good or compatible partner with this method. Who knows, you could, but it'd be a bit of a fluke and I think it would turn most women off.
Is it that women like feeling as if they have been selected and chosen rather than...checked off of a guy's list, I guess? How selective is selective enough? Is a guy's actual interest the threshold in how often it's appropriate to ask women out, or is the threshold a certain number? Because frankly, my interest tends to be fairly wide. I can find something attractive about most women. It's why I want to get to know them at least a little first...physical attraction is easy, and should take more before I decide whether or not I want to go out with someone. But, at a given time, I would have several women I was interested in, working towards asking her out. It wasn't like one in particular caught my interest and I ignored all others in exclusion to her. So, not singularly chosen or pursued to the exception of others.
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Old Yesterday, 08:36 PM
 
843 posts, read 211,282 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carly1983 View Post
I'm not saying no-one has ever got into a relationship this way. I would wonder what that relationship would be like....the one you would get into by approaching loads of women one after the other. It sounds like you could end up with literally anyone, rather than someone you like. I mean, I am a straight woman so I don't know how to find a girlfriend, but I can smell it a mile off when a guy tries it on with everyone and is now trying it on with me, and it doesn't go down that well. If he is funny or interesting I might tolerate it, but I probably won't trust him or be interested in dating him, because this is the very definition of a player.
As was pointed out earlier in this thread...is he really a player if he is failing that hard at getting a date? Players play their field and use their attractiveness and skills to maximize the amount of sex they can have. I don't think that's the kind of guy he's talking about. Kind of the opposite, really.
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Old Yesterday, 08:44 PM
 
Location: Continental Europe
705 posts, read 123,841 times
Reputation: 1120
Quote:
Originally Posted by At Arms Length View Post
Is it that women like feeling as if they have been selected and chosen rather than...checked off of a guy's list, I guess? How selective is selective enough? Is a guy's actual interest the threshold in how often it's appropriate to ask women out, or is the threshold a certain number? Because frankly, my interest tends to be fairly wide. I can find something attractive about most women. It's why I want to get to know them at least a little first...physical attraction is easy, and should take more before I decide whether or not I want to go out with someone. But, at a given time, I would have several women I was interested in, working towards asking her out. It wasn't like one in particular caught my interest and I ignored all others in exclusion to her. So, not singularly chosen or pursued to the exception of others.
It's hard to describe. I've known men like this, and all that comes across is their agenda - to get a girl, they don't care who she is, they just want one, any will do. They try all sorts of tricks. They tend to gain a reputation.

I mean, it can be flattering to some people, or appealing maybe if they just want sex.

Obviously as a woman, I've never asked a woman out nor do I understand how attraction works for men. We women might be more selective in that sense. I think the best thing to do is experiment and see what works for you. I can only tell you how things seem from my personal perspective.

I don't think you need to worry too much about being threatening or disrespectful. You seem very in tune with and aware of other peoples' feelings & needs. And for that reason I doubt you would come off as a player if you did ask loads of women out.
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Old Yesterday, 08:45 PM
 
Location: Continental Europe
705 posts, read 123,841 times
Reputation: 1120
Quote:
Originally Posted by At Arms Length View Post
As was pointed out earlier in this thread...is he really a player if he is failing that hard at getting a date? Players play their field and use their attractiveness and skills to maximize the amount of sex they can have. I don't think that's the kind of guy he's talking about. Kind of the opposite, really.
You can come off as a player without necessarily being successful at it.
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Old Yesterday, 09:20 PM
 
843 posts, read 211,282 times
Reputation: 1083
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carly1983 View Post
It's hard to describe. I've known men like this, and all that comes across is their agenda - to get a girl, they don't care who she is, they just want one, any will do. They try all sorts of tricks. They tend to gain a reputation.

I mean, it can be flattering to some people, or appealing maybe if they just want sex.

Obviously as a woman, I've never asked a woman out nor do I understand how attraction works for men. We women might be more selective in that sense. I think the best thing to do is experiment and see what works for you. I can only tell you how things seem from my personal perspective.

I don't think you need to worry too much about being threatening or disrespectful. You seem very in tune with and aware of other peoples' feelings & needs. And for that reason I doubt you would come off as a player if you did ask loads of women out.
"See what works for me", that's funny.




"In tune with and aware of other peoples' feelings and needs," not really. It's an overcorrection on my part. My formative social experiences were of being excluded and ostracized. In my first two years of school I can remember having only one friend. Other kids didn't want me around them...I used to stand by myself on the playground at recess because other kids would kick me out of their groups, or make fun of me until I left. Those sorts of experiences would continue with lesser intensity through college. In retrospect I chalk it up to a marked lack of social intuition and skill.



For instance I can remember once, end of sixth grade, being at a teacher-supervised school party at the local lake. By this point I had pretty much stuck to myself all along...some friends, but not many...and I badly wanted to be accepted into a group. I wasn't invited to sit with any of the little clusters of my classmates that had gathered, so I decided to just join in on one uninvited. No one in the group really paid any attention to me, and I probably could have just sat there and been ignored but not rejected by the group. But, like I said, I badly wanted to be accepted by them. I just didn't know how. But this was about the age that dirty jokes and innuendo were becoming both understood and popular among us. And I'd heard popular kids get a positive reaction from others many times by telling a dirty or scatological joke.




So, I decided, with this new group that I'd never hung out with before, that a good way to be accepted by them was to be edgy like I'd heard the popular kids do. The teachers had grilled hotdogs for us, that's what we were eating, so I made a crass comment about "weenies and buns." When that failed to get anything but weirded-out looks, I switched tactics and tried the scatological..."I'm not drinking Pepsi, because Pepsi makes me farty." At this an uncomfortable silence fell over the group and they looked at me like I was...well, a weird kid that they didn't want to be around. So I left in shame. Spent the rest of the night walking in a miserable, pain-addled haze along the water, beating myself up in my head.



And that's how things went for me through high school. Being angrily thrown off the recess basketball court by the most popular kid in school because I accidentally smacked him in the face with an errant pass ("Get off the court! Get out of here!"). Being made fun of because of my weight. Having guys in high school do things that today would be considered sexual harassment if not sexual assault trying to get a rise out of me (I was well-known by that point for eschewing physical contact with anyone, being extremely shy and stand-offish...they would do things like grab my butt, bear hug me from behind and kiss my cheek, drape their arm around me and fondle my man-boobs...and I was also slow, so I couldn't catch them when they did things like this). Led me to extreme social withdrawal. I became a prolific reader as a way to both cope and to give me an easy reason to be socially disengaged...I could be That Quiet Guy Who Reads A Lot rather than That Weird Guy Who Stands Around And Doesn't Talk To People.



As a result, I didn't really work to overcome my natural social clumsiness until much more recently, about a year and a half ago. But I didn't start with good social awareness...that's what led to a lot of my social difficulties in the first place. And I'm still very new at navigating social circumstances and using hard-won social skills, compared to everyone else my age, who have probably 30 years of social development on me, much less romantic social development. So I'm not naturally in-tune with people's social cues and their feelings and needs. But I am hypersensitive about stepping on people's social toes once more due to my lack of social intuition...hence my paranoia about missing their discomfort in my inexperience. Especially in dating, because comparatively I've had so few opportunities to engage with people in that sort of setting, and what opportunities I did find were over ("No, thanks, I'm...busy that weekend") nearly as soon as they began.
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Old Yesterday, 09:36 PM
 
Location: Continental Europe
705 posts, read 123,841 times
Reputation: 1120
Quote:
Originally Posted by At Arms Length View Post
"See what works for me", that's funny.




"In tune with and aware of other peoples' feelings and needs," not really. It's an overcorrection on my part. My formative social experiences were of being excluded and ostracized. In my first two years of school I can remember having only one friend. Other kids didn't want me around them...I used to stand by myself on the playground at recess because other kids would kick me out of their groups, or make fun of me until I left. Those sorts of experiences would continue with lesser intensity through college. In retrospect I chalk it up to a marked lack of social intuition and skill.



For instance I can remember once, end of sixth grade, being at a teacher-supervised school party at the local lake. By this point I had pretty much stuck to myself all along...some friends, but not many...and I badly wanted to be accepted into a group. I wasn't invited to sit with any of the little clusters of my classmates that had gathered, so I decided to just join in on one uninvited. No one in the group really paid any attention to me, and I probably could have just sat there and been ignored but not rejected by the group. But, like I said, I badly wanted to be accepted by them. I just didn't know how. But this was about the age that dirty jokes and innuendo were becoming both understood and popular among us. And I'd heard popular kids get a positive reaction from others many times by telling a dirty or scatological joke.




So, I decided, with this new group that I'd never hung out with before, that a good way to be accepted by them was to be edgy like I'd heard the popular kids do. The teachers had grilled hotdogs for us, that's what we were eating, so I made a crass comment about "weenies and buns." When that failed to get anything but weirded-out looks, I switched tactics and tried the scatological..."I'm not drinking Pepsi, because Pepsi makes me farty." At this an uncomfortable silence fell over the group and they looked at me like I was...well, a weird kid that they didn't want to be around. So I left in shame. Spent the rest of the night walking in a miserable, pain-addled haze along the water, beating myself up in my head.



And that's how things went for me through high school. Being angrily thrown off the recess basketball court by the most popular kid in school because I accidentally smacked him in the face with an errant pass ("Get off the court! Get out of here!"). Being made fun of because of my weight. Having guys in high school do things that today would be considered sexual harassment if not sexual assault trying to get a rise out of me (I was well-known by that point for eschewing physical contact with anyone, being extremely shy and stand-offish...they would do things like grab my butt, bear hug me from behind and kiss my cheek, drape their arm around me and fondle my man-boobs...and I was also slow, so I couldn't catch them when they did things like this). Led me to extreme social withdrawal. I became a prolific reader as a way to both cope and to give me an easy reason to be socially disengaged...I could be That Quiet Guy Who Reads A Lot rather than That Weird Guy Who Stands Around And Doesn't Talk To People.



As a result, I didn't really work to overcome my natural social clumsiness until much more recently, about a year and a half ago. But I didn't start with good social awareness...that's what led to a lot of my social difficulties in the first place. And I'm still very new at navigating social circumstances and using hard-won social skills, compared to everyone else my age, who have probably 30 years of social development on me, much less romantic social development. So I'm not naturally in-tune with people's social cues and their feelings and needs. But I am hypersensitive about stepping on people's social toes once more due to my lack of social intuition...hence my paranoia about missing their discomfort in my inexperience. Especially in dating, because comparatively I've had so few opportunities to engage with people in that sort of setting, and what opportunities I did find were over ("No, thanks, I'm...busy that weekend") nearly as soon as they began.
Ugh. High school is brutal. I was lucky to go to an all girls' school, although I have several brothers who were obsessed with WWF so I got a lot of wedgies at home lol. I'm not sure why young guys need to be quite so "hands on" in their humiliation tactics, growing up.

Kids being vicious is part of the reason I won't have kids, or if I end up accidentally having one he/she would be home schooled.

We've all done or said cringe making things in our youth. I try not to remember some of the things I've done; although as a fellow over-thinker I was dwelling on something of that nature today.

You sound like someone who has developed or improved social skills recently and that can only bode well for future relationships of all kinds. And even though you feel like you're overcompensating for a weakness, that comes across as a strength to me (although I can only say from how you come across in writing.)
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Old Yesterday, 09:55 PM
 
843 posts, read 211,282 times
Reputation: 1083
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carly1983 View Post
We've all done or said cringe making things in our youth. I try not to remember some of the things I've done; although as a fellow over-thinker I was dwelling on something of that nature today.
And maybe...all along...it was all in my head. Or mostly in my head. A product of beating myself up...a favorite past-time, until recently. More recent interactions with people show that I seem to be integrating socially pretty well. I have the odd glitch in the Matrix from time to time and freeze in panic not knowing what to do or say next...so usually it's "Uh, gotta run, see you later"...but generally I can hold a conversation with just about anyone. I can start a conversation with just about anyone. That's major improvement. My next task of growth is conquering my fear of talking to people on the phone. (Curiously that fear is even stronger than that of talking to people face-to-face...dunno why). My new job requires it. But so far, I'm doing better.


But...as successful as I've been socially, and that lending credence to the possibility that, all along, I have been too hard on myself for not being socially perfect, and withdrew from people for nothing...I did not get the same validation from trying to date. Leading me to think...maybe my ineptitude and inability with that part of the human social experience wasn't all in my head. Put work into social skills = Better at social skills = Successful in social situations = People would have liked me in social situations all along?. Whereas, Put work into romantic skills = Get better at romantic skills??? != More successful in romantic situations = ...So women really haven't been interested in me all this time.


That's the way my logic-brain is seeing the situation.
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Old Yesterday, 10:18 PM
 
Location: Continental Europe
705 posts, read 123,841 times
Reputation: 1120
Quote:
Originally Posted by At Arms Length View Post
And maybe...all along...it was all in my head. Or mostly in my head. A product of beating myself up...a favorite past-time, until recently. More recent interactions with people show that I seem to be integrating socially pretty well. I have the odd glitch in the Matrix from time to time and freeze in panic not knowing what to do or say next...so usually it's "Uh, gotta run, see you later"...but generally I can hold a conversation with just about anyone. I can start a conversation with just about anyone. That's major improvement. My next task of growth is conquering my fear of talking to people on the phone. (Curiously that fear is even stronger than that of talking to people face-to-face...dunno why). My new job requires it. But so far, I'm doing better.


But...as successful as I've been socially, and that lending credence to the possibility that, all along, I have been too hard on myself for not being socially perfect, and withdrew from people for nothing...I did not get the same validation from trying to date. Leading me to think...maybe my ineptitude and inability with that part of the human social experience wasn't all in my head. Put work into social skills = Better at social skills = Successful in social situations = People would have liked me in social situations all along?. Whereas, Put work into romantic skills = Get better at romantic skills??? != More successful in romantic situations = ...So women really haven't been interested in me all this time.


That's the way my logic-brain is seeing the situation.
Are you an introvert? They tend to not like talking on the phone. I don't like it. I either do email or in person, not long phone conversations.

Well the world has a lot of women in it. I think it's a big sweeping thing to say none of them would be interested in you. The ones you have met & liked so far, perhaps. You only need to meet one person, who likes you.
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Old Yesterday, 10:39 PM
 
843 posts, read 211,282 times
Reputation: 1083
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carly1983 View Post
Are you an introvert? They tend to not like talking on the phone. I don't like it. I either do email or in person, not long phone conversations.

Well the world has a lot of women in it. I think it's a big sweeping thing to say none of them would be interested in you. The ones you have met & liked so far, perhaps. You only need to meet one person, who likes you.
I am very much an introvert. Twos company, threes a crowd to me. More than 6-7 people in a given social situation and I feel overwhelmed and tend to shut down. And theres only so much socializing I can do in a given day before I need some away time. Most situations are very draining for me.

But my boss is very much old school. Hates texting. If I need to communicate with him its going to either be face to face or voice to voice. So, phones are a fear Im fixing.

As to there being plenty of fish...well see. I plan on living a long life. Id hate for it to be a solitary one as well.
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Old Yesterday, 10:47 PM
 
Location: Continental Europe
705 posts, read 123,841 times
Reputation: 1120
Quote:
Originally Posted by At Arms Length View Post
I am very much an introvert. Twos company, threes a crowd to me. More than 6-7 people in a given social situation and I feel overwhelmed and tend to shut down. And theres only so much socializing I can do in a given day before I need some away time. Most situations are very draining for me.

But my boss is very much old school. Hates texting. If I need to communicate with him its going to either be face to face or voice to voice. So, phones are a fear Im fixing.
Me too, it's definitely part of being an introvert, I remember reading that in a book about introverts and how their brains are wired (if I remember rightly, it was 'Quiet' by Susan Cain.) I can talk on the phone but I'm not that comfortable with it. I was once chastised by a guy in the early stages of dating because he kept saying I sounded so uncomfortable on the phone and he found it weird, I stopped taking his calls after that - lol. I prefer texting and messaging and hate it when someone calls me instead of texting back!

Quote:
As to there being plenty of fish...well see. I plan on living a long life. Id hate for it to be a solitary one as well.
Well, it sounds like you're on a good path, and have made positive changes in your life.

Right I'm off to bed, have a good one!
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