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Old 08-13-2019, 02:18 PM
 
Location: Colorado
12,164 posts, read 7,453,799 times
Reputation: 21851

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carly1983 View Post
I always thought that dating women would be easier because my female friends are so pleasant and easy to get along with.
As to this... My female friends are pleasant and easy to get along with too, at the friend level.

But I've got a really low tolerance for BS in my household. Drama, emotional explosions, flaky behavior and the like. There is one woman, I love her but she runs hot and cold on people and has problems I don't want to take on...another one I am very fond of is bipolar and alcoholic...another that my boyfriend likes and had hoped I might develop something with, is just too damn young and she's busy starting her own business and she doesn't respond to attempts to communicate. Like there is always...something. Something discouraging.

And then there is the flirtation stage of things.

Me with a woman: "So I really enjoyed spending time with you Saturday. And so you know, I would be down for dating, or casual fun, or whatever...though if you want to keep things at a friend place, I am cool with that, too, since that's the most important part of this to me. Just saying though, I'm open to further ideas if you are."
(This, after she told me she had a crush on me, wrote a poem about me, played several sexy songs for me to hear when we drove somewhere together, has insisted on buying me meals and gifts, and so on...)
Her response? A cutesy playful face and a weird mewing noise.

...

Me with a man: "So I really enjoyed spending time with you Saturday. And so you know, I would be down for dating, or casual fun, or whatever...though if you want to keep things at a friend place, I am cool with that, too, since that's the most important part of this to me. Just saying though, I'm open to further ideas if you are."
(Assuming he is interested, going by having done things like what the woman in the above example did.)
Him: *grin* "I was hoping you'd say that. I'm free Tuesday night, want to come over to my place or shall we go to yours?"

Like guys have a way of, when given a green light, being like "HELL YEAH LET'S DO THIS." Women? We could circle each other hinting and repeating, "So you like me, but do you LIKE ME, like me?" some fifty odd times until we get bored and drift in opposite directions, or so it seems. I never seem to get anywhere, trying to get any kind of clear communication about what a woman wants, even if she seems to be giving every sign of wanting...something.

So yeah. I can sympathize with the plight of men who get a little lost and confused in it all.
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Old 08-13-2019, 02:20 PM
 
12,867 posts, read 10,070,758 times
Reputation: 16454
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonic_Spork View Post
As to this... My female friends are pleasant and easy to get along with too, at the friend level.

But I've got a really low tolerance for BS in my household. Drama, emotional explosions, flaky behavior and the like. There is one woman, I love her but she runs hot and cold on people and has problems I don't want to take on...another one I am very fond of is bipolar and alcoholic...another that my boyfriend likes and had hoped I might develop something with, is just too damn young and she's busy starting her own business and she doesn't respond to attempts to communicate. Like there is always...something. Something discouraging.

And then there is the flirtation stage of things.

Me with a woman: "So I really enjoyed spending time with you Saturday. And so you know, I would be down for dating, or casual fun, or whatever...though if you want to keep things at a friend place, I am cool with that, too, since that's the most important part of this to me. Just saying though, I'm open to further ideas if you are."
(This, after she told me she had a crush on me, wrote a poem about me, played several sexy songs for me to hear when we drove somewhere together, has insisted on buying me meals and gifts, and so on...)
Her response? A cutesy playful face and a weird mewing noise.

...

Me with a man: "So I really enjoyed spending time with you Saturday. And so you know, I would be down for dating, or casual fun, or whatever...though if you want to keep things at a friend place, I am cool with that, too, since that's the most important part of this to me. Just saying though, I'm open to further ideas if you are."
(Assuming he is interested, going by having done things like what the woman in the above example did.)
Him: *grin* "I was hoping you'd say that. I'm free Tuesday night, want to come over to my place or shall we go to yours?"

Like guys have a way of, when given a green light, being like "HELL YEAH LET'S DO THIS." Women? We could circle each other hinting and repeating, "So you like me, but do you LIKE ME, like me?" some fifty odd times until we get bored and drift in opposite directions, or so it seems. I never seem to get anywhere, trying to get any kind of clear communication about what a woman wants, even if she seems to be giving every sign of wanting...something.

So yeah. I can sympathize with the plight of men who get a little lost and confused in it all.
You sure you really actually like women?
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Old 08-13-2019, 02:24 PM
 
Location: Colorado
12,164 posts, read 7,453,799 times
Reputation: 21851
Quote:
Originally Posted by somebodynew View Post
You sure you really actually like women?
I do. I just don't like coy game stuff. I want clear statements of consent, y'know, like the ones I'm willing to give to the men and women that I'm interested in. Not a face and a noise. I have no idea what and "mew!" means. And just because I like women, doesn't mean I want to butch up and act like a man. But it sure seems like we're both waiting for SOMEBODY to.

Well then heck there was the time I had a date set with an older, more masculine woman (I'm actually pan, so a genderfluid person is still of interest) and she freaking forgot and stood me up.

You seem to be saying if I really liked women, I'd like coy games and being flaked out on? Really, does anyone actually enjoy that?
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Old 08-13-2019, 02:36 PM
 
5,607 posts, read 2,384,794 times
Reputation: 16713
Quote:
Originally Posted by somebodynew View Post
The cuz matters little. Here's your advice for finding a woman.

- Make your own best life. Not the hit the gym, get buff, make myself more attractive with fat stacks of cash kind. The real you kind. Find what you enjoy. Anything.

- Make friends. GOOD friends.

- BE a positive, grateful and energetic person. Not present a positive, cheerful, charming exterior. BE positive, cheerful and grateful person. Not acting. Not playing. This is the hardest, most beneficial thing you will ever do in your life. But it is beyond true that it is not happy people who are grateful, but grateful people who are happy. By being this person, your self esteem will fall into line without your half realizing it.

- Volunteer. Where you have had challenges in your life, give back. Or really pay forward.

- Find your meaning. Even if your meaning is not saving the world. Curing cancer. Running the Ididerod. Even if you meaning is the peace of a picnic in nature or hoop with your buds. Find it. One of the guys I am seeing loses his mind over his dog. Training his dog. Taking his dog for walks... It is so freaking cute that he takes such an interest in his dog. (Note this does not mean getting a cute Golden Retriever puppy because they are chick magnets.)

Of course there is no guarantee that thousands of ******* will fall at your feet with their legs in the air. But you will waft an energy that is more attractive by far than any amount of muscle will do.

My 2 cents.

Women love men who love their lives, not those who slink around as if they were dogs with a haircut. That means men who are adventurous, men who engage the world around them, and men who are confident in who they are. Most of all, men who don't necessarily need a relationship to be fulfilled.

If you're a guy who has trouble meeting interested women, here's an experiment. Next time you go to a party, talk to women without trying to impress them. Be interested and focused on her, but don't hang on her every syllable and don't treat her like a fertility goddess. Look at her eyes, not at the neckline of her blouse. Be the first to excuse yourself from the conversation. Talk to a lot of people. Be in the moment. Be self-deprecating. Don't talk about yourself. In fact, if someone asks about you, use a little self-deprecating humor and change the subject back to them. You'll be surprised how you suddenly become a very interesting and desirable person when you're not desperately seeking out a romantic partner.
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Old 08-13-2019, 03:55 PM
 
852 posts, read 213,665 times
Reputation: 1094
Quote:
Originally Posted by MinivanDriver View Post
If you're a guy who has trouble meeting interested women, here's an experiment. Next time you go to a party, talk to women without trying to impress them. Be interested and focused on her, but don't hang on her every syllable and don't treat her like a fertility goddess. Look at her eyes, not at the neckline of her blouse. Be the first to excuse yourself from the conversation. Talk to a lot of people. Be in the moment. Be self-deprecating. Don't talk about yourself. In fact, if someone asks about you, use a little self-deprecating humor and change the subject back to them. You'll be surprised how you suddenly become a very interesting and desirable person when you're not desperately seeking out a romantic partner.

"...talk to women without trying to impress them."
Sure, I don't think I've ever talked to a woman to impress her. I've talked to a few hoping I could learn more about her and connect with her, but I've never been out to impress anyone.

"Be interested and focused on her, but don't hang on her every syllable and don't treat her like a fertility goddess."
Done it.

"Look at her eyes, not at the neckline of her blouse."
I think I'm actually pretty good at keeping my eyes away from places they're not welcome. Comes from years of my eyes not being welcome in certain places.

"Be the first to excuse yourself from the conversation."
My preferred way of ending a conversation, to make sure I'm not overstaying my welcome.

"Talk to a lot of people."
Done it.

"Be in the moment."
Not sure what this means.

"Be self-deprecating. Don't talk about yourself. In fact, if someone asks about you, use a little self-deprecating humor and change the subject back to them."
I've actually heard to not use self-depreciating humor if you're struggling with confidence. That said, I've used it many times. For instance, when I was learning to ballroom dance, I met a medical professional..."Oh, you're a doctor? Can you help me surgically remove this second left foot of mine so I can dance right?"

"You'll be surprised how you suddenly become a very interesting and desirable person when you're not desperately seeking out a romantic partner."
Nope.
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Old 08-13-2019, 03:57 PM
 
5,607 posts, read 2,384,794 times
Reputation: 16713
Quote:
Originally Posted by At Arms Length View Post
"...talk to women without trying to impress them."
Sure, I don't think I've ever talked to a woman to impress her. I've talked to a few hoping I could learn more about her and connect with her, but I've never been out to impress anyone.

"Be interested and focused on her, but don't hang on her every syllable and don't treat her like a fertility goddess."
Done it.

"Look at her eyes, not at the neckline of her blouse."
I think I'm actually pretty good at keeping my eyes away from places they're not welcome. Comes from years of my eyes not being welcome in certain places.

"Be the first to excuse yourself from the conversation."
My preferred way of ending a conversation, to make sure I'm not overstaying my welcome.

"Talk to a lot of people."
Done it.

"Be in the moment."
Not sure what this means.

"Be self-deprecating. Don't talk about yourself. In fact, if someone asks about you, use a little self-deprecating humor and change the subject back to them."
I've actually heard to not use self-depreciating humor if you're struggling with confidence. That said, I've used it many times. For instance, when I was learning to ballroom dance, I met a medical professional..."Oh, you're a doctor? Can you help me surgically remove this second left foot of mine so I can dance right?"

"You'll be surprised how you suddenly become a very interesting and desirable person when you're not desperately seeking out a romantic partner."
Nope.

Well, then I don't know what to tell you. You're probably kidding yourself on a few of the responses above.
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Old 08-13-2019, 03:59 PM
 
852 posts, read 213,665 times
Reputation: 1094
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonic_Spork View Post
You answered with, "Because I need to meet lots of women so I'll have a shot of getting one." Which circles right back to "women should do this because I need..." OK but what woman is sitting at home thinking about what some random guy she's never met might need? ...? What is HER motivation to get out to that jazz bar and increase YOUR odds?

She shouldn't get out to increase my odds. She should get out to increase her own odds. Chances are, though, if she's in an area with jazz bars, she's in an area she could find someone to go out with through online dating quicker and easier than she could by going to a bar. Jazz bar? Probably a max of 5 potential matches for her. Online...? Hundreds, from what I hear.
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Old 08-13-2019, 04:04 PM
 
852 posts, read 213,665 times
Reputation: 1094
Quote:
Originally Posted by MinivanDriver View Post
Well, then I don't know what to tell you. You're probably kidding yourself on a few of the responses above.
Why? The things you said aren't magic bullets to becoming a desirable man. They're how to correctly socialize with people, including those I might be interested in. All they'll do is make me less undesirable by preventing me from making certain social faux pas...they won't magically make me more desirable than I am now. I.e., I may be moderately well socially adjusted, well enough to engage in the sorts of conversations you put here, but if I'm not a desirable man to begin with, it won't change my success in a romantic context, just my success in a social context.
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Old 08-13-2019, 04:22 PM
 
Location: Colorado
12,164 posts, read 7,453,799 times
Reputation: 21851
Quote:
Originally Posted by At Arms Length View Post
She shouldn't get out to increase my odds. She should get out to increase her own odds. Chances are, though, if she's in an area with jazz bars, she's in an area she could find someone to go out with through online dating quicker and easier than she could by going to a bar. Jazz bar? Probably a max of 5 potential matches for her. Online...? Hundreds, from what I hear.
Well I wasn't talking to you, but as a woman... If I go out, I'm not thinking, "Will there be enough men there that my odds will be good in the numbers game?" I'm hoping that I'll meet one man, our conversation will be stimulating, and he'll be as available and interested as I am. There might be 30 men at the place where I go, and most of them, I won't even know if they are interested in me since we won't even interact.

But I have never connected with a prospective partner at any kind of a bar, really, not our first contact. Of course...I don't drink and I'm not really into the bar scene anyhow, unless I'm hanging with friends or shooting pool.

And online, sure, there were hundreds of "I'm a man and I want a woman" guys on the OLD apps. But once I cut out the soldiers, stoners, gang-bangers and yee-haw cowboy types and got down to the goths, geeks, and freaks, MY people, the pickings were slim indeed. Less than twenty out of all those hundreds, I think. Filter by the age range I was looking for, and it was even fewer still. And that's before any consideration of appearances or stability in life, if they had kids or a job or any number of things.

In the end, my boyfriend found me online, not on a dating site, but something a bit different, and asked would I mind talking at a social event since he saw I was going, and he was thinking of going as well. We had a great conversation. At the end of it, he asked would I mind spending some more time together at some point, and we continued on the premise of furthering our acquaintance, with no pressure or expectation of romance or sex at all.
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Old 08-13-2019, 04:33 PM
 
12,867 posts, read 10,070,758 times
Reputation: 16454
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonic_Spork View Post
I do. I just don't like coy game stuff. I want clear statements of consent, y'know, like the ones I'm willing to give to the men and women that I'm interested in. Not a face and a noise. I have no idea what and "mew!" means.
Sounds like you did not like HER. It's not a chick thing.

Quote:
And just because I like women, doesn't mean I want to butch up and act like a man. But it sure seems like we're both waiting for SOMEBODY to.

Well then heck there was the time I had a date set with an older, more masculine woman (I'm actually pan, so a genderfluid person is still of interest) and she freaking forgot and stood me up.

You seem to be saying if I really liked women, I'd like coy games and being flaked out on? Really, does anyone actually enjoy that?
lol. No. But not everyone is direct the way you want. And that is ok too.
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