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Old 08-07-2019, 04:37 AM
 
12,745 posts, read 10,046,106 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by At Arms Length View Post
Undoubtedly, you're right, I don't know how to pick up a woman. I mean, in theory I understand the possible processes, but in practice it's not something I've succeeded at. But your pick-up scenarios include the proviso of "she's interested in you." And that's the kicker...women aren't, and at pushing 35 I feel like if someone was going to be interested I would have seen that by now.



The approach and the asking and the attraction are complicated to me because I have no natural knack for the sort of thing. I've gotten pretty decent at simply engaging in conversation with any type of person (as long as I haven't gotten sloppy and already developed a crush on them), but that skill was a long time in developing...it didn't come naturally. But once there...I don't have anything that makes women want more than that. And, I'm absolutely wretched at attempting to navigate a dating scenario. I used to think I'd just missed my shots in my past with different women that I never asked out, but after major reevaluation of those encounters...I don't see that the women in question that I "missed my shot" with were actually interested in more than conversation or friendship with me. That matches my experiences in actually trying to be proactive in similar situations. It also aligns with input by two friends who have known me for half my life or more.



And sure, women want to be caught...by guys they want chasing them in the first place. I mean, I suppose being asked out could be an ego boost to them (I've been told "Flattered, but no"), but in the end, if she's not interested in me, I need to proceed no further than friendly.
First. Good on you for taking steps to learn social interactions. I *hope* that is a win for you regardless.

I think the gap is in between a conversation and a "she's interested". I am sorry if you covered this before. What kind of things do you do for fun? Are there people you come across more frequently than just out and about like stores and such where there is an opportunity to get to know each other first?
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Old 08-07-2019, 07:27 AM
 
796 posts, read 206,098 times
Reputation: 1062
Quote:
Originally Posted by somebodynew View Post
First. Good on you for taking steps to learn social interactions. I *hope* that is a win for you regardless.

I think the gap is in between a conversation and a "she's interested". I am sorry if you covered this before. What kind of things do you do for fun? Are there people you come across more frequently than just out and about like stores and such where there is an opportunity to get to know each other first?

Oh, absolutely a win. Life's a lot more fun now that I'm not scared to talk to people. There are always some people out there who don't want to talk, but I'm learning to read initial signs that someone's not interested in friendly chatter and avoid trying to start anything with them. I've gotten to the point where when I start a conversation with someone they're usually receptive and we usually can carry on a decent banter for at least 2-3 minutes. For instance, I recently noticed a tattoo a cashier had in the shape of a state I didn't recognize off the top of my head. My asking her about it turned into a nice chat about where she was from, why she moved, why she liked the area she's in now, and why she disliked the area she came from. Nice pleasant conversation. Another was a guy in a grocery store who noticed my college gear, and we had a conversation about the school's sports teams. It's things like that that have really been very difficult for me to engage in in the past. (Grammar nerd...that sentence had two properly used redundant words. Still looks like I stuttered.)



I try to do that at least once a day. I am still cognizant of failing to gracefully exit a conversation at the right time and dragging it out too long...overstaying my welcome. I'm now usually the one who ends the conversation with a "Well, nice chatting with you!", and I think I'm getting a grasp on when conversations naturally peter out in interest to the other party, but I don't want to be That Guy who You Can't Get Away From anymore. That's a social aspect that I've struggled with in the past.


For fun...they tend to be in flux. I'm a natural introvert, and my interests naturally run to the introverted. Things I've always liked have been movies, books, TV shows (good, smart ones...I'm a snob, if it's not well-written and well-acted, I'm out), games both video and board. I enjoy watching my teams play. I'm a beer and cider snob. I love roller coasters...this year I rewarded myself with a stint of going to seven theme parks in 14 days. I like history and art, and love going to museums. I enjoy astronomy. I have done a lot of volunteer work for different local organizations



Over the last year and a half I've tried to train myself in more extroverted pursuits. I stepped way outside of my comfort zone and learned to dance. I've tried to pick up outdoorsy things like hiking and kayaking. Skydiving is a goal for me at some point. I've been to the gym but I've really done as much there as I'm willing to do for myself. If I want to go further than that I'll be back.


Doing a lot of the latter things have let me come into contact with more people, yeah. As I've said before, if I'm interested in a woman it's because I've had several encounters with her already and know something about her other than what she looks like. As far as how I've met the women that I've asked out...I've met some through the pursuits above, through mutual friends, through work (as in, same field, different locations...not asking women out who I actually work with), by just meeting them around town, by seeing them at church, through dabbling at dating online. Some have been old acquaintances that I've reconnected with through social media.


I've stepped away from trying to date as a life focus now. I wasn't having success with it despite the effort, time, and money I was putting into it. Women frankly haven't been interested in me like I thought they might be, even after the changes I've worked on in my life. I don't get the signs of attraction that mean she's open to more than a conversation or a friendship. That fact was causing me a lot of pain. I've reshuffled my life's priorities as a result. Right now I'm focused on my career...I've recently moved for a new position, and that's my focus for now. I want to spend my time and effort doing things I know I can achieve...no one likes feeling like a failure, and it was messing with my head in a big way. I'm open to opportunities should they arise, but I'm no longer going out and actively trying to create them. But, women aren't more attracted to me now than they have been in the past...more willing to talk and be friendly, sure, but that's it.
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Old 08-07-2019, 09:10 AM
 
Location: Colorado
12,092 posts, read 7,433,264 times
Reputation: 21748
Dude.

You sound really fun. This is not the first time I've thought, "If I were single I'd be wanting to get to know you." As it stands, I wish I could actively help you, At Arms Length. Get into your head, coach you, give advice on how to attract interest, or match you up with someone great. My ability to do anything like that is pretty damn limited, unfortunately, as I only know you from like...here...but I just want you to know that for whatever it is worth, I'm in your cheering section.

I mean board games and roller coasters? Museums and volunteerism? Seriously wow. I have a weird wish to know what in the hell is going on that you are not getting female attention. I think you should be.

I feel like all this amounts to about as much as "thoughts and prayers" from a stranger on the internet, but the sentiment is sincere. One of these days somebody is gonna buy a ticket for that ride.
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Old 08-07-2019, 09:44 AM
 
7,532 posts, read 11,654,985 times
Reputation: 8384
Quote:
Originally Posted by At Arms Length View Post
Oh, absolutely a win. Life's a lot more fun now that I'm not scared to talk to people. There are always some people out there who don't want to talk, but I'm learning to read initial signs that someone's not interested in friendly chatter and avoid trying to start anything with them. I've gotten to the point where when I start a conversation with someone they're usually receptive and we usually can carry on a decent banter for at least 2-3 minutes. For instance, I recently noticed a tattoo a cashier had in the shape of a state I didn't recognize off the top of my head. My asking her about it turned into a nice chat about where she was from, why she moved, why she liked the area she's in now, and why she disliked the area she came from. Nice pleasant conversation. Another was a guy in a grocery store who noticed my college gear, and we had a conversation about the school's sports teams. It's things like that that have really been very difficult for me to engage in in the past. (Grammar nerd...that sentence had two properly used redundant words. Still looks like I stuttered.)



I try to do that at least once a day. I am still cognizant of failing to gracefully exit a conversation at the right time and dragging it out too long...overstaying my welcome. I'm now usually the one who ends the conversation with a "Well, nice chatting with you!", and I think I'm getting a grasp on when conversations naturally peter out in interest to the other party, but I don't want to be That Guy who You Can't Get Away From anymore. That's a social aspect that I've struggled with in the past.


For fun...they tend to be in flux. I'm a natural introvert, and my interests naturally run to the introverted. Things I've always liked have been movies, books, TV shows (good, smart ones...I'm a snob, if it's not well-written and well-acted, I'm out), games both video and board. I enjoy watching my teams play. I'm a beer and cider snob. I love roller coasters...this year I rewarded myself with a stint of going to seven theme parks in 14 days. I like history and art, and love going to museums. I enjoy astronomy. I have done a lot of volunteer work for different local organizations



Over the last year and a half I've tried to train myself in more extroverted pursuits. I stepped way outside of my comfort zone and learned to dance. I've tried to pick up outdoorsy things like hiking and kayaking. Skydiving is a goal for me at some point. I've been to the gym but I've really done as much there as I'm willing to do for myself. If I want to go further than that I'll be back.


Doing a lot of the latter things have let me come into contact with more people, yeah. As I've said before, if I'm interested in a woman it's because I've had several encounters with her already and know something about her other than what she looks like. As far as how I've met the women that I've asked out...I've met some through the pursuits above, through mutual friends, through work (as in, same field, different locations...not asking women out who I actually work with), by just meeting them around town, by seeing them at church, through dabbling at dating online. Some have been old acquaintances that I've reconnected with through social media.


I've stepped away from trying to date as a life focus now. I wasn't having success with it despite the effort, time, and money I was putting into it. Women frankly haven't been interested in me like I thought they might be, even after the changes I've worked on in my life. I don't get the signs of attraction that mean she's open to more than a conversation or a friendship. That fact was causing me a lot of pain. I've reshuffled my life's priorities as a result. Right now I'm focused on my career...I've recently moved for a new position, and that's my focus for now. I want to spend my time and effort doing things I know I can achieve...no one likes feeling like a failure, and it was messing with my head in a big way. I'm open to opportunities should they arise, but I'm no longer going out and actively trying to create them. But, women aren't more attracted to me now than they have been in the past...more willing to talk and be friendly, sure, but that's it.
You sound like a catch to me.

Eloquent writer, and introspective.

The first thing that comes to mind is I'm not sure of your race, but certain guys of certain races who don't fit the 'mold', have a lot of options cut off to them, lowering their pool essentially, and that doesn't help.
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Old 08-07-2019, 10:04 AM
 
3,865 posts, read 1,790,356 times
Reputation: 7636
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonic_Spork View Post
Dude.

You sound really fun. ........

I feel like all this amounts to about as much as "thoughts and prayers" from a stranger on the internet, but the sentiment is sincere. One of these days somebody is gonna buy a ticket for that ride.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jobaba View Post
You sound like a catch to me.

Eloquent writer, and introspective.

The first thing that comes to mind is I'm not sure of your race, but certain guys of certain races who don't fit the 'mold', have a lot of options cut off to them, lowering their pool essentially, and that doesn't help.
Gotta add my name to the At Arms Length fan club of folks who root for him. When I read the 7 theme parks in 14 days in particular I thought that's not for everyone, but that's such a cool idea and a potential bridge to like minded women, who definitely exist. Not for everyone, but exactly for the right person. My oldest daughter and several of her friends, for example.

Anyway At Arms Length, you seem to be an appealing mix of traits and interests and you have a good story going. Keep writing it.
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Old 08-07-2019, 10:07 AM
 
Location: Pittsburgh
22,699 posts, read 24,312,376 times
Reputation: 49395
Quote:
Originally Posted by At Arms Length View Post
Oh, absolutely a win. Life's a lot more fun now that I'm not scared to talk to people. There are always some people out there who don't want to talk, but I'm learning to read initial signs that someone's not interested in friendly chatter and avoid trying to start anything with them. I've gotten to the point where when I start a conversation with someone they're usually receptive and we usually can carry on a decent banter for at least 2-3 minutes. For instance, I recently noticed a tattoo a cashier had in the shape of a state I didn't recognize off the top of my head. My asking her about it turned into a nice chat about where she was from, why she moved, why she liked the area she's in now, and why she disliked the area she came from. Nice pleasant conversation. Another was a guy in a grocery store who noticed my college gear, and we had a conversation about the school's sports teams. It's things like that that have really been very difficult for me to engage in in the past. (Grammar nerd...that sentence had two properly used redundant words. Still looks like I stuttered.)



I try to do that at least once a day. I am still cognizant of failing to gracefully exit a conversation at the right time and dragging it out too long...overstaying my welcome. I'm now usually the one who ends the conversation with a "Well, nice chatting with you!", and I think I'm getting a grasp on when conversations naturally peter out in interest to the other party, but I don't want to be That Guy who You Can't Get Away From anymore. That's a social aspect that I've struggled with in the past.


For fun...they tend to be in flux. I'm a natural introvert, and my interests naturally run to the introverted. Things I've always liked have been movies, books, TV shows (good, smart ones...I'm a snob, if it's not well-written and well-acted, I'm out), games both video and board. I enjoy watching my teams play. I'm a beer and cider snob. I love roller coasters...this year I rewarded myself with a stint of going to seven theme parks in 14 days. I like history and art, and love going to museums. I enjoy astronomy. I have done a lot of volunteer work for different local organizations



Over the last year and a half I've tried to train myself in more extroverted pursuits. I stepped way outside of my comfort zone and learned to dance. I've tried to pick up outdoorsy things like hiking and kayaking. Skydiving is a goal for me at some point. I've been to the gym but I've really done as much there as I'm willing to do for myself. If I want to go further than that I'll be back.


Doing a lot of the latter things have let me come into contact with more people, yeah. As I've said before, if I'm interested in a woman it's because I've had several encounters with her already and know something about her other than what she looks like. As far as how I've met the women that I've asked out...I've met some through the pursuits above, through mutual friends, through work (as in, same field, different locations...not asking women out who I actually work with), by just meeting them around town, by seeing them at church, through dabbling at dating online. Some have been old acquaintances that I've reconnected with through social media.


I've stepped away from trying to date as a life focus now. I wasn't having success with it despite the effort, time, and money I was putting into it. Women frankly haven't been interested in me like I thought they might be, even after the changes I've worked on in my life. I don't get the signs of attraction that mean she's open to more than a conversation or a friendship. That fact was causing me a lot of pain. I've reshuffled my life's priorities as a result. Right now I'm focused on my career...I've recently moved for a new position, and that's my focus for now. I want to spend my time and effort doing things I know I can achieve...no one likes feeling like a failure, and it was messing with my head in a big way. I'm open to opportunities should they arise, but I'm no longer going out and actively trying to create them. But, women aren't more attracted to me now than they have been in the past...more willing to talk and be friendly, sure, but that's it.
Even if you're not successful in your dating endeavors, you can be really proud of yourself for being self-aware and proactively changing your life and your outlook.
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Old 08-07-2019, 10:19 AM
 
12,745 posts, read 10,046,106 times
Reputation: 16390
Add me to the Arms Length cheering squad.
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Old 08-07-2019, 10:28 AM
 
8,276 posts, read 6,090,529 times
Reputation: 5886
Add me to the fan club as well.
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Old 08-07-2019, 10:31 AM
 
Location: Continental Europe
615 posts, read 111,621 times
Reputation: 1041
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonic_Spork View Post
Dude.

You sound really fun. This is not the first time I've thought, "If I were single I'd be wanting to get to know you." As it stands, I wish I could actively help you, At Arms Length. Get into your head, coach you, give advice on how to attract interest, or match you up with someone great. My ability to do anything like that is pretty damn limited, unfortunately, as I only know you from like...here...but I just want you to know that for whatever it is worth, I'm in your cheering section.

I mean board games and roller coasters? Museums and volunteerism? Seriously wow. I have a weird wish to know what in the hell is going on that you are not getting female attention. I think you should be.

I feel like all this amounts to about as much as "thoughts and prayers" from a stranger on the internet, but the sentiment is sincere. One of these days somebody is gonna buy a ticket for that ride.
I feel the same.

At Arms Length, I would go on a date, if you were in my area/country (not that I'm assuming you'd want to go on a date with me )
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Old 08-07-2019, 11:18 AM
 
7,532 posts, read 11,654,985 times
Reputation: 8384
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobspez View Post
I did say it could fail 90% of the time. But it's worth it. I guess you just don't know how to pick up women. Naturally there's got to be a recognition that she is interested in you, but that's easy to spot. The opposite sexes have a biological imperative to seek out a mate. It's in our dna. You sound like you are conducting a job interview. It's not that complicated. Maybe education and theories get in the way. If you find a girl attractive and you sense some interest in you it's always OK to ask for a number, even if you have only known her for 15 minutes. If you snooze, you lose. I always cultivated women as relationship objects, and when they did too, that's what we got. I would have considered anything else a waste of both of our times. I've never had a girl buddy except after the relationship was over. Naturally that excludes relatives and my wife's friends, after I got married.
How could it be so easy to spot if women are interested in you, but ... you're going to fail 90% of the time?

One consequence of hitting on a lot of women is they will crop up later on in your life.

I haven't hit on a LOT, but I did ask a girl out at a class I was taking over 15 years ago. And she ended up being at a place where I got a new job. She's here today. I saw her in the hallway before.
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