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Old 08-08-2019, 04:39 PM
 
12,843 posts, read 10,070,758 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carly1983 View Post
Yes, totally. I think some of the pain that has come from casual sex has not just been about not being able to form a lasting connection with someone I like; it's the lack of civility and respect that makes me feel a bit worthless when it comes my way.
I totally hear that. Not a fan.
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Old 08-08-2019, 04:44 PM
 
Location: Colorado
12,157 posts, read 7,453,799 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carly1983 View Post
Yes, totally. I think some of the pain that has come from casual sex has not just been about not being able to form a lasting connection with someone I like; it's the lack of civility and respect that makes me feel a bit worthless when it comes my way. I do believe this comes from men seeing women as less worthy of respect if she puts out easily. So they don't feel inclined to give respect out so readily once they've slept with someone. They're more likely to give it out beforehand. I know that sounds gross, but I think that's partly what goes on for men, probably very subconsciously.

I've only been with one poly guy (who had more issues than your average guy and was a bit of a mess emotionally) but I wonder if poly men are less likely to have a madonna/***** complex and be more sex positive, more able to communicate the parameters of what they are looking for, as you mention. Part of me is still drawn to that community for various reasons, I love variety which is why I'm partly both dreading and loving the idea of hopefully finding someone to settle down forever. Also from all these encounters I've had, I've had the message that I am "too much", "too demanding" sexually and just in terms of how much time and attention I want from men. It has occurred to me maybe I need a few of them in my life, however that may just be an illusion based on the behaviour of these men I've encountered. I also have more time on my hands these days than most people do.
Sounds like poly might be a good fit for you, then. Something to consider, anyhow. I'd do a Google search for polyamory groups in your region, and maybe look for Facebook groups along those lines, as well. Oddly (or not?) Colorado Springs has a heck of a big group of poly people. We have discussion groups at the club, most of them draw like 8-12 people tops on a given night (for other subjects) and the last monthly poly talk was about 80 people IIRC. It was a lot. And that is different because it's not necessarily "casual." Emotional ties are encouraged. Different from the swingers where it's all about sex, mainly.

Oh, and read "More Than Two" if you haven't. I'm told that it's full of awesome relationship stuff, even if one is not poly. (I was questioning, when a poly friend of mine recommended it, if I really needed to read it since I'm more monogamish these days, she said that yes, she thinks I still should.)
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Old 08-08-2019, 05:05 PM
 
Location: Santa Monica, Ca
7,053 posts, read 3,930,748 times
Reputation: 16913
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carly1983 View Post
You're not getting it.

He was passing through my area. I knew it was going to go nowhere in terms of a relationship. He moved 9,000 miles away 3 days after he sent his "I'm not coming" text. That was always his plan. We both knew it.

I was "butthurt" because I expect respect from casual sex partners. Civilities, like "hello", "goodbye", "it's been fun". Not being stood up 5 mins beforehand, with no explanation or further contact. When you have casual sex with someone, you still open yourself up in an intimate way. I'd expect a goodbye after that, some kind of acknowledgement. I also don't expect to be stood up on the night I think we'll be saying goodbye and having our last meeting.

To be honest, you sound like one of those people who treats people poorly and then when they don't respond well, tell them to "get over themselves". Having casual sex doesn't give people a licence to be rude.

I demand respect in all my relationships, so sorry, but I am not interested in your brand of "tough love" telling me to settle for something less.
I am not telling you to “settle” for anything, and I get the fact that you were upset because he ghosted you, but you’re putting a lot of emphasis on the casual sex part. That’s the part I don’t get. You slept with him by choice. You didn’t know squat about him other than he was NOT going to be around. You knew he was going home and that you’d probably not see him again, but you went ahead even knowing that you get “attached” after having sex with someone. Why would you do that if you weren’t expecting something in return? All pretty much red flags to a person who knows they get attached by engaging in that sort of thing... wouldn’t you think?
Be PO’ed about his ghosting you, but leave the casual sex part out... you were ALL in.
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Old 08-08-2019, 05:09 PM
 
Location: Continental Europe
722 posts, read 133,994 times
Reputation: 1130
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sydney123 View Post
I am not telling you to “settle” for anything, and I get the fact that you were upset because he ghosted you, but you’re putting a lot of emphasis on the casual sex part. That’s the part I don’t get. You slept with him by choice. You didn’t know squat about him other than he was NOT going to be around. You knew he was going home and that you’d probably not see him again, but you went ahead even knowing that you get “attached” after having sex with someone. Why would you do that if you weren’t expecting something in return? All pretty much red flags to a person who knows they get attached by engaging in that sort of thing... wouldn’t you think?
Be PO’ed about his ghosting you, but leave the casual sex part out... you were ALL in.
Sydney have you read the entire thread? I've said the same thing, over and over, about myself in this thread, that it is insane to know one gets attached through casual sex, and to do it anyway, expecting to be able to manage my emotions around that. I've found it's not possible for me, in those sorts of arrangements.

I'm not sure why you're giving me this feedback when this is an insight I already had way back and have mentioned it repeatedly.

I also am not sure about this idea of giving sex "without getting something in return". I wasn't angling for a commitment or a wedding ring in return for my sexual services or something. I actually really enjoyed the sex. He was gorgeous and I had some experiences I'd never had before. He just was a bit of a d-bag at the same time and I didn't want to see it. I would have been sad when he left, even if he said goodbye. The point was that he was disrespectful and it was up to me not to let that sort of person into my life, and I failed and have failed at that (repeatedly.) This thread is about why, how to change it, and how one can get the respect one wants in these sorts of relationships (and whether it's even possible.)

If you don't like the thread or think it's pointless, no need to comment.
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Old 08-08-2019, 05:21 PM
 
Location: Continental Europe
722 posts, read 133,994 times
Reputation: 1130
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonic_Spork View Post
Sounds like poly might be a good fit for you, then. Something to consider, anyhow. I'd do a Google search for polyamory groups in your region, and maybe look for Facebook groups along those lines, as well. Oddly (or not?) Colorado Springs has a heck of a big group of poly people. We have discussion groups at the club, most of them draw like 8-12 people tops on a given night (for other subjects) and the last monthly poly talk was about 80 people IIRC. It was a lot. And that is different because it's not necessarily "casual." Emotional ties are encouraged. Different from the swingers where it's all about sex, mainly.

Oh, and read "More Than Two" if you haven't. I'm told that it's full of awesome relationship stuff, even if one is not poly. (I was questioning, when a poly friend of mine recommended it, if I really needed to read it since I'm more monogamish these days, she said that yes, she thinks I still should.)
I'll have a look into that book.

I have a sleep disorder which makes me very nocturnal and I think that's another reason I've considered poly in the past, because I have come across people who are larks (i.e. morning people) and they want to be involved with me but don't see me as the person they're going to marry or raise children with (nor do I want to be raising kids.)

That, combined with my independence, makes me feel like I'd be much better off as someone's (maybe lots of peoples') "other woman" in a way, but without the deception and the emotional neglect of my needs that would normally come with being someone's illicit 'bit on the side'.

I'd need to try it to know if I'm way off with this, and whether it's possible to get the intimacy and closeness I want through arrangements like these.
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Old 08-08-2019, 05:39 PM
 
12,843 posts, read 10,070,758 times
Reputation: 16445
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonic_Spork View Post
Sounds like poly might be a good fit for you, then. Something to consider, anyhow. I'd do a Google search for polyamory groups in your region, and maybe look for Facebook groups along those lines, as well. Oddly (or not?) Colorado Springs has a heck of a big group of poly people. We have discussion groups at the club, most of them draw like 8-12 people tops on a given night (for other subjects) and the last monthly poly talk was about 80 people IIRC. It was a lot. And that is different because it's not necessarily "casual." Emotional ties are encouraged. Different from the swingers where it's all about sex, mainly.

Oh, and read "More Than Two" if you haven't. I'm told that it's full of awesome relationship stuff, even if one is not poly. (I was questioning, when a poly friend of mine recommended it, if I really needed to read it since I'm more monogamish these days, she said that yes, she thinks I still should.)
Along these lines, watch for couple's privilege. Not everyone who claims ethical non-monogamy is actually ethical.
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Old 08-08-2019, 05:54 PM
 
Location: Continental Europe
722 posts, read 133,994 times
Reputation: 1130
Quote:
Originally Posted by somebodynew View Post
Along these lines, watch for couple's privilege. Not everyone who claims ethical non-monogamy is actually ethical.
I'm guessing you're referring to couples who want to involve a bisexual woman in their relationship? I'd definitely not want that, I only sleep with men.
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Old 08-08-2019, 06:36 PM
 
5,837 posts, read 2,374,892 times
Reputation: 6096
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carly1983 View Post
Yes, totally. I think some of the pain that has come from casual sex has not just been about not being able to form a lasting connection with someone I like; it's the lack of civility and respect that makes me feel a bit worthless when it comes my way.

There's a general lack of respect across the board in todays society.

Quote:
I do believe this comes from men seeing women as less worthy of respect if she puts out easily. So they don't feel inclined to give respect out so readily once they've slept with someone. They're more likely to give it out beforehand. I know that sounds gross, but I think that's partly what goes on for men, probably very subconscious.
You are correct. Many men, most men have little respect for a woman that would do it. Most men too are seeking a connection just like you are and sleeping with strangers or someone you hardly intimately know does not build on that connection. I call that connection "camaraderie".

I remember when my last wife of 16 years and I would sometimes go for walks or out for coffee or just doing some chores like grocery shopping. I always got a warm feeling being next to her, being with her. There was a sense of camaraderie between us. It was me and her against the world, she had my back and I had hers. We had our girls to care for. Unfortunately for the relationship her attitude changed. The sense of camaraderie disappeared and so did I. My best friend became an enemy, a clear and present danger. Looking back I am glad I filed for divorce as my instincts were correct.

Men need a reason to be around. A purpose. In todays world women marry the state, who needs a man? You have your own means or welfare. This allows lazy males to be lazy and the uncaring not to care. Men who care, good ones tend to shy away from commitment because they are smart enough to look ahead and what they see is not good. It doesn't leave much for anybody.

It is what it is though. Carry on.
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Old 08-08-2019, 06:43 PM
 
Location: Continental Europe
722 posts, read 133,994 times
Reputation: 1130
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scrat335 View Post

Men need a reason to be around. A purpose. In todays world women marry the state, who needs a man? You have your own means or welfare. This allows lazy males to be lazy and the uncaring not to care. Men who care, good ones tend to shy away from commitment because they are smart enough to look ahead and what they see is not good. It doesn't leave much for anybody.

It is what it is though. Carry on.
That's a sad prospect. However, I do see most men in my offline life (men who are acquaintances, friends, family) choosing to commit to their partners, so I don't think it's true that most good men shy away from commitment.
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Old 08-08-2019, 08:21 PM
 
5,837 posts, read 2,374,892 times
Reputation: 6096
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carly1983 View Post
That's a sad prospect. However, I do see most men in my offline life (men who are acquaintances, friends, family) choosing to commit to their partners, so I don't think it's true that most good men shy away from commitment.
I think people just go with the flow. In the end to some it doesn't matter what the end product is.

No time for me to discuss this further
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