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Old 04-14-2009, 10:40 AM
 
24,053 posts, read 24,321,098 times
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Well, it all boils down to this: Self-Help Psychology books. And the satellite industry of television talk shows such as Oprah.

Because, somewhere along the line, the ultimate good in life no longer was being a good parent/spouse/employer/employee/citizen/whatever. Instead, the ultimate good in life is now all about one's own fulfillment.

As a result, we have a bunch of narcissists running around who feel the need to do whatever they want to feel good. Or we have the subculture of the permanently affronted who take offense at the most trivial and petty things.
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Old 04-14-2009, 12:59 PM
 
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People don't slow things down to appreciate and value what they have. People first, then materialistic items.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CESpeed View Post
People are messed up in this society because the priorities of society are screwed up. The moment we decide that we don't have to have the biggest, brightest, latest and greatest, a new car every year, etc., etc. we will no longer have to work two jobs to keep the family financially afloat and we can concentrate on and pay attention to our children. Maybe then we can raise a society not filled with neurotic, damaged people.
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Old 04-14-2009, 01:04 PM
 
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I completely disagree. Every other Oprah episode is about being a good parent, spouse, citizen, employee etc. She has Dr. Oz on all the time talking about better health and she celebrates same sex couples too. Suze Orman was on the other day screeching at people that they cannot "do whatever they want" and they need to "live below their means".

That isn't narcissistic personality disorder. It is the opposite. I'm not sure why you even assume that Oprah and self help encourage NPD.

If you use common sense you will realize that NPD starts where everything else begins and that is with parents, families, relatives, elementary schools, day-cares, etc. It starts with those standards of "perfection" which are different for each individual since we are all not excellent and talented at the same things that are forced onto children, when the children do not meet the standards of perfection, then the parents and relatives start shaming and guilt tripping, well "why aren't you as good as Bobby?" , "why is it always a problem with you", then physical abuse like spankings and other shame tactics like shunning and cold shoulder begin all because they don't meet mom and dad's standards of perfection.
The kids real individuality goes ignored and evaporates ,which is extremely painful as they try more and more to please selfish parents and controlling teachers just to get the "pat on the back". That is the start of all our society's problems. On top of that they learn to sacrifice anything in the name of pleasing somebody else which can include you. Then when that child becomes an adult he is the same way, controlling, selfish, empty, has no sense of self, Machiavellian, and holds everybody to the same perfect standards and refuses to see people as individuals. If you see successful narcissistic people it is because they are trained at an early age to be Machiavellian and to sacrifice whatever it takes to meet the standards of perfection, this is all encouraged by schools, churches, families, and parents not by Oprah which comes on only once a day.

No need to scapegoat Oprah and self help books.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cpg35223 View Post
Well, it all boils down to this: Self-Help Psychology books. And the satellite industry of television talk shows such as Oprah.

Because, somewhere along the line, the ultimate good in life no longer was being a good parent/spouse/employer/employee/citizen/whatever. Instead, the ultimate good in life is now all about one's own fulfillment.

As a result, we have a bunch of narcissists running around who feel the need to do whatever they want to feel good. Or we have the subculture of the permanently affronted who take offense at the most trivial and petty things.

Last edited by artsyguy; 04-14-2009 at 01:40 PM..
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Old 04-14-2009, 01:09 PM
 
24,053 posts, read 24,321,098 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by artsyguy View Post
I completely disagree. Every other Oprah episode is about being a good parent, spouse, citizen, employee etc. She has Dr. Oz on all the time talking about better health and she celebrates same sex couples too. Suze Orman was on the other day screeching at people that they cannot "do whatever they want" and they need to "live below their means".

That isn't narcissistic personality disorder. It is the opposite. I'm not sure why you even assume that Oprah and self help encourage NPD.

If you use common sense you will realize that NPD starts where everything else begins and that is with parents, families, relatives, elementary schools, day-cares, etc.

No need to scapegoat Oprah and self help books.
Oh, I'll scapegoat SH books and not apologize for it, for they provide the language of rationalization. Basically, you can find a SH book on the shelves that will excuse you for anything.

However, you're right about my picking on Oprah. She was a convenient handle for the cottage industry of programs where people get on and talk about their problems all day--many with very sympathetic hosts. So my apologies to Oprah.
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Old 04-14-2009, 01:14 PM
YBF
 
Location: Atlanta, Ga
1,260 posts, read 1,976,050 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cpg35223 View Post
Oh, I'll scapegoat SH books and not apologize for it, for they provide the language of rationalization. Basically, you can find a SH book on the shelves that will excuse you for anything. .
I will agree with you on this part because those ppl dont care about helping folks they are just trying to sell books....none of those books actually helps you any....unless you are a complete idiot and needs a complete stranger to tell you that for you to get it. They give you a bunch of phsycology 101 mumbo jumbo and common sense in a way you can understand.
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Old 04-14-2009, 01:15 PM
 
25,170 posts, read 32,104,144 times
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Rationalization for what?


Self help books that don't offer suggestions for solutions are a bunch of BS. So there are good and bad self help books. The one's that rationalize away everything I find are irritating. If I was to read a self help book I would look for one that had solutions.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cpg35223 View Post
Oh, I'll scapegoat SH books and not apologize for it, for they provide the language of rationalization. Basically, you can find a SH book on the shelves that will excuse you for anything.

However, you're right about my picking on Oprah. She was a convenient handle for the cottage industry of programs where people get on and talk about their problems all day--many with very sympathetic hosts. So my apologies to Oprah.
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Old 04-14-2009, 01:17 PM
 
25,170 posts, read 32,104,144 times
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That is bad because why??

So you are saying I should spend $100 at some snide counselor's office instead of going to a book store or library and flipping through some self help books to get an idea of what I can do to help myself for free.

You don't always have to buy books, that is why there are chairs and couches at bookstores, so you can sit and read them and gather ideas first.

Quote:
Originally Posted by YBF View Post
They give you a bunch of phsycology 101 mumbo jumbo and common sense in a way you can understand.
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Old 04-14-2009, 02:05 PM
YBF
 
Location: Atlanta, Ga
1,260 posts, read 1,976,050 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by artsyguy View Post
That is bad because why??

So you are saying I should spend $100 at some snide counselor's office instead of going to a book store or library and flipping through some self help books to get an idea of what I can do to help myself for free.

You don't always have to buy books, that is why there are chairs and couches at bookstores, so you can sit and read them and gather ideas first.
Most times if you have a problem then you know how to fix it but are afraid to...but in the cass that you dont know how to fix it..I think its far better to talk it out with someone rather than read a generalization on how to help yourself....whether that person be a confidant therapist etc etc.....I feel those self help books only help those who already knew how to help themselves. The counselor doesnt have to be snide...you need to find the right counselor for you
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Old 04-14-2009, 02:10 PM
 
Location: Texas
27,223 posts, read 20,790,420 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Repubocrat View Post
I am not sure if this is exclusively an American thing but how come there are so many ****ed up people in this society? I feel fortunate to have parents who were for the most part, normal and taught me values, morals and good things. .
This is so funny. My wife asked me the same question the other day. She was all like, "How come so many people are f'd up?"

I think part of this recent 'baggage explosion' comes from the fact that we've become more of a touchy-feely-you're-the-victim-so-blame-everything-on-your-past society.

I think it's awful that bad things have happened to people, but I think we need to all learn to buck up and soldier on without making it everyone else's problem so much.
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Old 04-14-2009, 02:10 PM
Status: "Humming "Suicide is painless"" (set 1 day ago)
 
Location: Whoville....
21,158 posts, read 14,887,906 times
Reputation: 10690
We've raised an entire generation on praise. They think they're the best and the greatest and life comes as a rude awakening for many of them. I think most make the transition after a shock period but some just don't. They want what they were promised. A world that treats them special because they are special. Only problem is, they're no more special than the next person.

The fall off of a pedestal can be hard to take.
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