how do i respond to this? wican/magic related topic (dates, ladies)

[funymann]

Originally Posted by FredNotBob

That's it?

Seriously....that's all you can muster up in response?

You're really disappointing me, Funnymann.

While we're on the topic of 'fading away' -- church attendance is at an all-time low. In Europe, 49 percent of those questioned never attend church at all, while a meager 7 percent do so more than once a month.

Similar numbers were reported in North America: The Wall Street Journal reported on a study that revealed an interesting fact: secularism (those that claim no religion) has almost doubled since 1990.*

An organization called Christian Research (itself a branch of the Bible Society) reported in 2008 that in just over a generation, the number of people attending services in the Church of England will fall to almost a tenth of its current numbers. That's a fall of 90 percent.**

It took an economic crisis to bring people back to the pews, and what do you think is going to happen when we work our way out of this recession?

And you say we're going to fade away?

* TheLife.com » Blog Archive » Why the Decline in Church Attendance?

** Church attendance 'to fall by 90%' | World news | The Observer

You are right. Church attendance has declined.

Why? Hypocrisy. Plain and simple.

Church teachings are contrary to the Bible. They teach tradition over truth. (Mark 7:13)

Many completely honest hearted individuals in the world today see that the priests of many religions are operating the church like a business. Taking money from the people to support their lifestyle.

Can you really blame people for not wanting to go to church? When you hear the same old mass Sunday after Sunday?

People cannot take the attitude, "I will just be spiritual and worship at home." They should search out God. Find out what is going on by heartfelt prayer.

"What does God think about all of these different religions?" "Why are there so many religions in the world?"

See, there are answers. Satan will keep everyone so busy with technology and work and pleasure that it will be a thought that never surfaces till a tragedy strikes. We all need to search NOW!! No, not when something bad happens in our lives. No, not when we are trapped in a cave with no way out and we cry out to him. We need to do it NOW!!!

No one likes a friend we only hear from when they need something. God doesn't like that either. We need to build a relationship with him NOW!!! While things are going good in our lives.

2. "Before the statue gives birth to anything, before the day has passed by just like chaff, before there comes upon you people the burning anger of God, before there comes upon you people God's anger..."
3."Seek God, all you meek ones of the earth, who have practiced His own judicial decisions. Seek righteousness, seek meekness. Probably you may be concealed in the day of God's anger. " (Zephaniah 2:2,3)

Yes. We have to seek out God before he brings judgement upon the wicked people who plague this world. It's a command to do so.

To allow the distractions of this old world and all it offers to sidetrack you from searching for God could cost your your life. You may be swept away just like everyone else.

[FredNotBob]

Originally Posted by funymann

Yes. We have to seek out God before he brings judgement upon the wicked people who plague this world. It's a command to do so.

To allow the distractions of this old world and all it offers to sidetrack you from searching for God could cost your your life. You may be swept away just like everyone else.

You have to seek out God. I have already found a path that suits me; the belief that I'll be 'swept away' is solely yours, and is based on another kind of hypocrisy -- the kind where 'love thy neighbor' meets with Deuteronomy XXI, verses 19-21, which establish that if your son is drunkard or a glutton, or refuses to obey his parents, the proper method of dealing with him (rather than find a way to help him with his gluttony or his drunkenness) is for those self-same 'loving' parents to drag him before the city elders and stone him to death.*

I find it quite interesting how your post suggests that people should pray to find the answer to a question like "What does God think about all of these different religions?", when the response is a foregone conclusion: if you're Christian, of course God doesn't approve of other religions.

Of course, then I read your next paragraph and find another obvious, foregone conclusion: Satan is tempting people....again.

Honestly, Satan has become such a crutch for the faithful. We were supposedly given 'free will', but the first answer we get in church is 'pray for guidance' or 'ask God for assistance'. I mean, why did God give us free will if we're just going to run back to Him for the answers all the time? Shouldn't we be using our free will to deal with our own problems?

Oh, right, there's that pesky Satan again. And again, we're given free will, made in God's image, and the first thing we do when we encounter anything that even remotely hints at Satan's involvement (temptation, sin, etc) is to run to God to solve our problems for us.

Isn't that something we're capable of? We're 'made in God's image', after all, and while I don't feel particularly deital at the moment, I like to think that I'm capable of protecting myself from temptation.

God gave us free will, and then made us codependents in his battle with Satan and his minions, giving us a convenient excuse for our mistakes.

Very loving of Him, isn't it?

*The Holy Bible according to the Authorized Version, vol 1 (with notes), courtesy of Google Books.

[funymann]

Originally Posted by FredNotBob

You have to seek out God. I have already found a path that suits me; the belief that I'll be 'swept away' is solely yours, and is based on another kind of hypocrisy -- the kind where 'love thy neighbor' meets with Deuteronomy XXI, verses 19-21, which establish that if your son is drunkard or a glutton, or refuses to obey his parents, the proper method of dealing with him (rather than find a way to help him with his gluttony or his drunkenness) is for those self-same 'loving' parents to drag him before the city elders and stone him to death.*

I find it quite interesting how your post suggests that people should pray to find the answer to a question like "What does God think about all of these different religions?", when the response is a foregone conclusion: if you're Christian, of course God doesn't approve of other religions.

Of course, then I read your next paragraph and find another obvious, foregone conclusion: Satan is tempting people....again.

Honestly, Satan has become such a crutch for the faithful. We were supposedly given 'free will', but the first answer we get in church is 'pray for guidance' or 'ask God for assistance'. I mean, why did God give us free will if we're just going to run back to Him for the answers all the time? Shouldn't we be using our free will to deal with our own problems?

Oh, right, there's that pesky Satan again. And again, we're given free will, made in God's image, and the first thing we do when we encounter anything that even remotely hints at Satan's involvement (temptation, sin, etc) is to run to God to solve our problems for us.

Isn't that something we're capable of? We're 'made in God's image', after all, and while I don't feel particularly deital at the moment, I like to think that I'm capable of protecting myself from temptation.

God gave us free will, and then made us codependents in his battle with Satan and his minions, giving us a convenient excuse for our mistakes.

Very loving of Him, isn't it?

*The Holy Bible according to the Authorized Version, vol 1 (with notes), courtesy of Google Books.

So Bob,

You would support a drunkard and glutton son, you do not feel a need to pray to God for answers cause you were givin free will, made in God's image and you are strong enough to battle Satan alone through temptations? Is that correct?

I like talking with you but I am not here to defend myself to your philosophy on religion.

I believe there is only 1 road leading to life and every other road leads off to destruction. (Matthew 7:14) That's what I believe. It's your "Free will" choice to find that road or not. Not just "a path that suits me."

I brought up Satan only because he doesn't want you to find that 1 road that leads off to life. He is on the road that is going to finish him off so he is on a mission to take everyone else down too. So he is trying to get you to not find that right road. If you are comfortable with a road that is not the right one than his job is done. If you get close to the right one you will meet with opposition and ridicule. If you are going the wrong way he will leave you alone. You start getting on the right road and you will be an object of hatred by the world and him. (John 15:19)(James 4:4)(1 John 5:19)(John 17:14)(John 7:7)(Matthew 24:9)(2 Corinthians 4:4)(1 Peter 5:8,9)

Just think about this...

If there is a "true religion" that you could not stop or destroy...what way would you mislead people away from that "true religion?

Sure. Create 100's of other religions that are false. Mix them all up to mislead people to think that ALL are bad and wrong.

Once you get them away from being envolved with any sort of religion you can keep them busy by making the world a fun place. One of parties and sin. Keep them busy with selfish goals and pursuits.

Kind of like being on a sinking ship. Just keep the passengers busy and they won't even know the boat is going down. This world is the same way. We are living on a sinking ship and Satan knows that. He is keeping everyone busy so they don't see the world is on a straight course for destruction from God. Oh, God is warning you about it but are you listening?

It's been nice talking with you Bob. I just hope you are not a sheep that has strayed away from the right road.

[FredNotBob]

Originally Posted by funymann

So Bob,

You would support a drunkard and glutton son, you do not feel a need to pray to God for answers cause you were givin free will, made in God's image and you are strong enough to battle Satan alone through temptations? Is that correct?

I like talking with you but I am not here to defend myself to your philosophy on religion.

I believe there is only 1 road leading to life and every other road leads off to destruction. (Matthew 7:14) That's what I believe. It's your "Free will" choice to find that road or not. Not just "a path that suits me."

I brought up Satan only because he doesn't want you to find that 1 road that leads off to life. He is on the road that is going to finish him off so he is on a mission to take everyone else down too. So he is trying to get you to not find that right road. If you are comfortable with a road that is not the right one than his job is done. If you get close to the right one you will meet with opposition and ridicule. If you are going the wrong way he will leave you alone. You start getting on the right road and you will be an object of hatred by the world and him. (John 15:19)(James 4:4)(1 John 5:19)(John 17:14)(John 7:7)(Matthew 24:9)(2 Corinthians 4:4)(1 Peter 5:8,9)

Just think about this...

If there is a "true religion" that you could not stop or destroy...what way would you mislead people away from that "true religion?

Sure. Create 100's of other religions that are false. Mix them all up to mislead people to think that ALL are bad and wrong.

Once you get them away from being envolved with any sort of religion you can keep them busy by making the world a fun place. One of parties and sin. Keep them busy with selfish goals and pursuits.

Kind of like being on a sinking ship. Just keep the passengers busy and they won't even know the boat is going down. This world is the same way. We are living on a sinking ship and Satan knows that. He is keeping everyone busy so they don't see the world is on a straight course for destruction from God. Oh, God is warning you about it but are you listening?

It's been nice talking with you Bob. I just hope you are not a sheep that has strayed away from the right road.

I'll support anyone who shows a willingness to accept the help I offer -- I would do that same for anyone. It's part of human nature to make mistakes, and (as I've said) I've made some big ones myself, so I know how hard it is to live with yourself afterward (and besides, stoning someone to death is just a teensy bit extreme for over-indulgence).

I just don't blame my mistakes on the temptations of a 'Satan'-like entity. I'm responsible for my actions, and I'm strong enough to deal with my temptations and mistakes by myself. Foisting them off on some unseen 'bogeyman' is just a cop-out -- a way of saying, 'hey, it's not my fault, I was tempted by Satan!' and blithely dismissing the consequinces of our actions.

You seem to be under the impression that I'm an athiest (or else I've mistakenly given that impression) -- but nothing is farther from the truth. I'm a very religious person (though still not Christian), and I know from experience that this is the path that is right for me.

Whether your religion declares it to be 'true' or not is none of my affair (after all, it's your religion), but I have found more hapiness, peace and stability along this path than I ever expected to find in any religion.

I feel a need to ask for guidance, yes -- and I do pray, albiet in a (slightly) different manner than you do. What my religious path has taught me is that if you always run to the Gods for answers, They're eventually going to get tired of hearing your voice.

Both my religious beliefs and my upbringing tell me that before I run for help, divine or otherwise, I first need to make every effort to clean up the mess myself. If I screw up, my Gods are going to tell me -- and then they're going to sit back and let me find my own way out of the mess I've made.

That's right -- no 'Satan', no 'hellfire', no fears of 'damnation'. Just little old me with my concience and the courage to admit that, when I screw up, I have nobody to blame but myself for the sorry state I end up in.

As for being a sheep that's strayed from the 'right road' -- all things considered, I'd prefer to stray from the road. The way you describe it, Judgement Day involves most of the flock getting hit by a bus.

[funymann]

As for being a sheep that's strayed from the 'right road' -- all things considered, I'd prefer to stray from the road. The way you describe it, Judgement Day involves most of the flock getting hit by a bus. [/quote]


Consider me the one on the sidewalk saying, "WATCH OUT!!!"

The ship (WORLD) is sinking. You can either find a life boat or you can sit comfortably in the chair on the boat and drown.

I for my part am on the life boat encouraging you to get on too. There is no time for debate. You need to act NOW!

Hurricane evacuations are common but that doesn't mean they will never hit the coast and kill you. You have to heed the warning and get out of there!!! The authorities only come around so many times to warn you. After a while it is too late to leave.

Open up your eyes my friend. There is a Judgement Day coming and you are not heeding the warnings. You are scoffing at them as if to say it will never occur.

What is more disturbing is you do not believe in Satan. The one that is misleading the world. Some of the most discusting crimes committed where an individual kills and eats a person or cuts them up and shoves them in a suitcase can only be influenced by a higher power. Something more evil than ourselves. Satan and demons do exist. Yes, they are not to be blamed for every mishap that happens in our lives. Yet, they do influence the world in a spiritistical way...in movies and music etc.

I hope you find the loving God that I found. The one who made all things. You will be amazed at the peace of knowing the truth.

Nice talking with you Bob.

[FredNotBob]

Originally Posted by funymann

Consider me the one on the sidewalk saying, "WATCH OUT!!!"

The ship (WORLD) is sinking. You can either find a life boat or you can sit comfortably in the chair on the boat and drown.

I for my part am on the life boat encouraging you to get on too. There is no time for debate. You need to act NOW!

Hurricane evacuations are common but that doesn't mean they will never hit the coast and kill you. You have to heed the warning and get out of there!!! The authorities only come around so many times to warn you. After a while it is too late to leave.

Open up your eyes my friend. There is a Judgement Day coming and you are not heeding the warnings. You are scoffing at them as if to say it will never occur.

What is more disturbing is you do not believe in Satan. The one that is misleading the world. Some of the most discusting crimes committed where an individual kills and eats a person or cuts them up and shoves them in a suitcase can only be influenced by a higher power. Something more evil than ourselves. Satan and demons do exist. Yes, they are not to be blamed for every mishap that happens in our lives. Yet, they do influence the world in a spiritistical way...in movies and music etc.

I hope you find the loving God that I found. The one who made all things. You will be amazed at the peace of knowing the truth.

Nice talking with you Bob.

What's really disturbing to me is that you're hoping that someone will lose their faith. Is that really the image you want to project of your religious beliefs?

Of course I don't believe in Satan -- he's a Christian construct, designed to keep the believers in line. I appreciate your concern for my spiritual well-being (quiet sincerely, I do -- concern for another is a very heartwarming thing to see in our fragmented world), but it's time for you to step back and realize that you're not the only flock on the block, anymore -- we've found a path, and I'm only slightly sorry to say, it's not yours.

That being said.....

I'm growing tired of this constant battle for acceptance. You (Christians*) treat us like children, for crying out loud. You pretend we don't know our own minds and religious choices, pat us on the head and tell us 'we'll understand when we're older', and smile like polite 'parents' that are watching a kid pretend he's a stegosaurus.

It's not the religion itself that drives us away -- most of us couldn't give a raven's tail feathers what you believe, as long as you stay true to your convictions. It's your attitude about your faith: you're always 'the best', the 'most worthy', the 'most important', and believe me, constantly hearing you toot your own horn is really getting annoying.

If you want to win converts, back off. Quit just blindly assuming that we're children that need some kind of 'parental guidance'. Most of us were Christian -- we just aren't anymore.

Yet another Star Trek quote, this time from outside the Federation:

'I know you. I was like you once, but then I opened my eyes. Open your eyes, Captain. Why is the Federation so obsessed with the Maquis? We've never harmed you. And yet we're constantly arrested and charged with terrorism. Starships chase us through the Badlands and our supporters are harassed and ridiculed. Why? Because we've left the Federation, and that's the one thing you can't accept. Nobody leaves paradise. Everyone should want to be in the Federation. Hell, you even want the Cardassians to join. You're only sending them replicators because one day they can take their "rightful place" on the Federation Council. You know In some ways you're even worse than the Borg. At least they tell you about their plans for assimilation. You're more insidious. You assimilate people and they don't even know it.'

-- Michael Eddington, to Captain Sisko, in Star Trek: Deep Space Nine episode 'For the Cause'

*I've met some wonderful Christians, and some really really pushy hard-to-like ones. For the record, all of those that I've met here are counted among the wonderful ones: very devoted, passionate people that defend their points with great dignity and poise.

[funymann]

Listen Fred,

I never made that sort of comment that I would like you to lose your faith. You have to have all the facts to get a firm hold on faith.

All I am saying is that history shows there is a God who is there for us. There is also a Satan whether you believe it or not. Satan was there as one of God's angels that rebelled. In the beginning this earth had a great flood at one time. In the Bible which you probably don't believe in talks about a flood that wiped out all of mankind from the face of the earth except for the 8 people who entered into and of course the animals.

Whether you believe in that flood is up to your faith. In the Bible it is stated that God destroyed a world of ungodly men. Along with those men who were Angels that materialized into human form. ( Genesis 6:1,2 ) The children of these angels were called Nephilim. ( Genesis 6:4 ) God saw that the badness of man was abundant in the earth and every inclination of the thoughts of his heart was only bad all the time. ( Genesis 6:5 ) So God said to Noah "The end of all flesh has come before me, because the earth has become filled with violence as a result of them, and here I am bringing them to ruin together with the earth. ( Genesis 6:13 )

In our day we live in a world filled with violence in an extreme degree. Just look at the news on a daily basis. How do you think God feels about the world we live in today?

Read: ( Matthew 24:37 ) "For just as the days of Noah were, so the presence of the Son of man will be. 38. For as they were in those days before the flood, eating and drinking, men marrying and women being given in marriage, until the day that Noah entered into the ark; 39. and they took no note until the flood came and swept them all away, so the presence of the Son of man will be.

God will do what he did back in the days of Noah. Destroy a world of ungodly men. However, a God of love will always give a warning to the people just as Noah preached to the people telling them why he was building this great big ark. No one cared to listen until the day the waters came down. Then I bet they were wishing they had listened to him.

Today you are being warned constantly. God has sent out the warning to all people on this earth. There is no excuse. You must seek out God before it is too late. Seriously. I only warn you that taking a course that is good for you is not assuring you a secure future. Sometimes we must exert ourselves to find the right way.

I hope you hear what I am saying and at least take a look at the few scriptures I quoted.

God is not that far off from each one of us and he will hear us if we reach out to him in prayer. Quoting from a Star Trek movie is a real disappointment on your end.

Originally Posted by FredNotBob

What's really disturbing to me is that you're hoping that someone will lose their faith. Is that really the image you want to project of your religious beliefs?

Of course I don't believe in Satan -- he's a Christian construct, designed to keep the believers in line. I appreciate your concern for my spiritual well-being (quiet sincerely, I do -- concern for another is a very heartwarming thing to see in our fragmented world), but it's time for you to step back and realize that you're not the only flock on the block, anymore -- we've found a path, and I'm only slightly sorry to say, it's not yours.

That being said.....

I'm growing tired of this constant battle for acceptance. You (Christians*) treat us like children, for crying out loud. You pretend we don't know our own minds and religious choices, pat us on the head and tell us 'we'll understand when we're older', and smile like polite 'parents' that are watching a kid pretend he's a stegosaurus.

It's not the religion itself that drives us away -- most of us couldn't give a raven's tail feathers what you believe, as long as you stay true to your convictions. It's your attitude about your faith: you're always 'the best', the 'most worthy', the 'most important', and believe me, constantly hearing you toot your own horn is really getting annoying.

If you want to win converts, back off. Quit just blindly assuming that we're children that need some kind of 'parental guidance'. Most of us were Christian -- we just aren't anymore.

Yet another Star Trek quote, this time from outside the Federation:



*I've met some wonderful Christians, and some really really pushy hard-to-like ones. For the record, all of those that I've met here are counted among the wonderful ones: very devoted, passionate people that defend their points with great dignity and poise.

[Andrew83]

enough of this nonsense. You have completely taken things off topic from what i opened the thread about. Anyways this girl turned out to be a self absorbed,waste of time and we slowly lost contact.

[Coldjensens]

Enough of this babble. Set yourself on fire, sacrifice a cat on the table and you are golden. Trust me on this one. There is nothing like a Wican fora girlfriend. However you may need to share her with a tree or something one in a while.

[Hawk J]

Originally Posted by Andrew83

i saw her again last night. In between the first time and the next time i met her, i did some research on vampires so that i would be more prepared this time. So when the subject came up again i said that i also believe that vampires existed and that it is supported by real people in history like Elizabeth Bathory and King George the III.....so she just responded by nodding her head. Then i asked her what has she been reading to suggest that vampires exist and she just shrugged her shoulders. Then i asked her what magic spells she has done so far and she shrugged her shoulders again. So i came to find out that she actually does not seem to know anything abour mystical creatures and magic and that it was more of a subtle ploy to scare me away. We didnt really connect much last night which was dissapointing, so i just left early and went home. ugghh, i wasted my whole day off researching something i have absolutely zero interest in.

Talk to Alyssa Milano. She knows about vampires.