Not in love, but may be facing last chance for a family (marrying, guy)

[sierraAZ]

Originally Posted by NotARedneck

If she is playing games to keep things going, like always being in the middle of some sort of crisis, this will require that you get up the nerve to call it quits, despite this. Few people are really in a constant crisis and if they are, you hardly want to marry them!

What in the world are you talking about?! Guess your agenda also gets in the way of your reading comprehension.

[karuna95]

Take some time to deliberately get to know her... does she make you laugh? Do YOU make her laugh? What makes her laugh, or cry? Is she generous with her time and her heart? Is she forgiving, or is she a complainer and judgemental? Is she a good listener? Is she thoughtful and kind? These are some of the basic pillars for a long-lasting relationship. Love grows, and flourishes, when it is nourished and cherished.

Your situation reminds me of a Buddhist teaching about the dangers of embedding ourselves in a cocoon, in which we perpetuate habitual patterns and thoughts. The cocoon is the familiar world to which we retreat, and hide. When we are afraid of waking up and afraid of experiencing our fears, we create a cocoon to shield ourselves. When we hide in our cocoon, away from the world, we feel secure. We think we've quieted our fears, but in reality we've allowed ourselves to be numb with fear. We surround ourselves with our familiar thoughts, so that nothing sharp or painful can touch us. We are so afraid of our own fears that we deaden our hearts (from Shambhala, The Sacred Path of the Warrior).

From the person in a bad relationship unable to leave, because she fears being alone, to the single person unable to commit because he fears commitment, to the perfectionist unable to attempt anything for fear of failure... we all weave our cocoons. The key is to wake up, recognize our patterns and thoughts for what they are, and acknowledge our fears. Only then can we try a new way of thinking, and of being.

All my best

[Ivorytickler]

Originally Posted by Raena77

i think you need love...then comes the rest... but im a hopeless romantic.

I think you have that backwards. You need the rest then comes love. Love doesn't last if you don't have common interests and goals. How many divorces happen because the couple just drifted apart? They went different directions with their lives.

[crossing over]

Kiss her.

Everyone knows she won't deliver a baby after having kissed you.

Kiss her, it's so SO so wrong to not do that. The more you don't kiss her, the harder it'll be to connect to her in such a way, and you'll feel like kissing your sister if you ever finally do kiss.

What are you thinking, to have known her for a year, have these thoughts of a potential life together but no idea of how her closeness feels to you? Just kiss her, and you might find some truths out.

[malamute]

Originally Posted by Northman

I'm a 40 year old, single guy with a solid career. I've never even been close to marrying, although I have always wanted a wife and children more than anything.

I am the last remaining single adult in my family tree. I have been holding out for the one great love of my life, but I do not date well, and at my age I'm very worried about being alone for the rest of my life.

I have been dating one woman in particular on & off for about a year now. The relationship has not really progressed that much, as I must be honest and say that I have not developed any feelings for her over the handful of dates we've had. We get along fine, but just don't seem to have much in common. There has been no attempt at anything physical at this point from either side.

That said, the rest of the situation is overwhemingly inviting in correlation with the potential for finally having a family of my own. Her family are good, Christian people. They have welcomed me with open arms, and made it known in no uncertain terms that they want me around. I love being with them, too.....I'm just not sure if I should pursue things because I have yet to feel anything towards the woman in question. I know without a doubt that she's been waiting for me to take things to the next level.

Has anyone else walked in these particular shoes? I'm worried that if I haven't developed any feelings for her over an entire year that I never will. On the other hand, we've never even kissed, and haven't seen nearly as much of eachother as most people who've been dating for a years time. I'm going to keep seeing her, but am just wondering if anyone out there's been through something similar, and how it turned out. I fear I may never be presented with such a potential opportunity to have a family again at my age.

Hard question.

In days past, people married for those same reasons, and their marriages lasted.

Part of the problem today is that everything is about romantic love, passion, and that's why marriages don't last. Maybe in the old days people were smarter about things like love, family, marriage.

Is marriage for the purpose of life long hot sex and passion or is it about having a family?

[malamute]

Originally Posted by Northman

I'm 40. She's 32.

Niether of us have ever been married. No kids on either side.

She's already told me she doesn't condone sex outside of marriage. I freely admit to having lost my virginity at 18. Each knows about the other regarding this, and it hasn't resurfaced since that initial discussion.

Yes, we are both Christians. She is much more involved in church and associated activities than I am, however. My reluctance to participate in worship recently has been due in large part to my single status. I do not feel comfortable being the only single person my age in the midst of a churchful of couples. Not saying that validates anything, just being honest.

Someone mentioned "butterflies" This is a major reason I feel compelled to at least dig a little deeper in correlation with the topic at hand. Every.....EVERY woman I have ever pursued because I had "butterflies" over her turned out to be a complete and utter waste of my time. Although this particular relationship has yet to develop, it seems that it somehow keeps getting put in my path, and this intrigues me to some extent.

I like hearing all these perspectives. I think talking with people you don't actually know can be occasionally beneficial.

A Korean guy I knew was in an arranged marriage. All his life he knew his "fiancee" and he supported arranged marriage because he said marriage is for the purpose of raising a family. He felt his parents chose carefully, they chose a girl from a good family with similar values and he said true love is something that grows over time and he grew to very much love his wife. The important thing he said was to have a compatible background.

He pointed out the high rate of divorce among Americans and the loneliness so many Americans face, broken families, multiple marriages and divorces. He felt it was better in his culture. There is at least some truth in what he said.

There is probably something wrong with instant passion and often it doesn't last however many people would not have the patience or the view of marriage to have a kind of marriage that grows in love over time. That isn't our culture, our way - but there are people who still view it that way and marriages that have endured that were just that.

I think you just have to decide what it is you want out of life and love. If it's passion and constant sparks then don't marry her, drop her and move on. If you really want married life, children, a family and she does also then maybe you can make it work but you have to drop the romantic passion viewpoint of what marriage and family should be about.

[Redisca]

*Sigh*

I really get dismayed by all these comments to the effect that "marriage is hard work and if you foolishly expect to be happy and in love, then you are, well, a fool!" As much as people foam at the mouth about the high rate of divorce (which, truth be told, can only be effectively reduced if we drastically reduce the average life expectancy), they fail to realize that there are also lots and lots of miserable marriages, which, by the way, includes most arranged marriages.

It is sad that most Americans (as far as I can tell) have such a bleak view of what a good marriage should be -- hard work and little else. Hard work is, of course, the opposite of fun, enjoyment, or, godforbid, breathless, effortless love that comes naturally and infuses your whole being. This view is the product of a puritanical* notion that anything that brings instant and natural happiness is illusory and stupid, and that the only things in life that have any value are those attained at the price of a lifetime of miserable drudgery. It is a matter of personal choice, of course, but I could never be happily married to someone who saw our marriage as "hard work", who perceived the ordinary activities of married life -- sex, shared meals, going out on weekends, living together, family vacations, raising children -- as labor assignments that he would rather not be doing. How mortifying and humiliating it must be, to be married to a partner who thinks that way! In fact, I believe that it's precisely this attitude that's responsible for most of the marital misery we hear so much about.

However, as I previously mentioned, my view is contrary to what most Americans have been led to believe, so you, the OP, have to ask yourself what you want to get out of marriage. If it's "hard work", then by all means, marry anybody -- no matter how different, no matter the age, looks, interests or compatibility -- you can just "work hard" on, I don't know, "working hard" with someone you don't love, and then both of you can derive moral satisfaction from hard working. Or something like that. (I think Roger Rueff said it best in his play Hospitality Suite, when he wrote: "When someone who's really principled marries someone else who's really principled, they often find out later on it's their principles that got married, and the two of them just came along for the ride.") If you want a marriage that will truly make you happy -- that will make you glad to come home every night, that will feel like a source of solace and comfort -- don't marry someone you don't love.

Under all circumstances, marital satisfaction only decreases with time --it never increases. "Hard work" does nothing to change this trend -- if you marry this woman, or any woman, you are guaranteed to be less happy with her in the long run than on the day of your wedding. This is why you should really marry someone whose company you intensely enjoy -- because, obviously, the higher up on the satisfaction scale you start your marriage, the higher you will end up when it reaches its lowest point; the lower on the satisfaction scale you start, the more likely you are to hit absolute rock-bottom.

You should also keep in mind that having children causes a precipitous drop in marital satisfaction, across all cultural, economic and religious lines. With the very first child, marital satisfaction plummets, and it only begins to creep back up once all children leave home -- and that's a looooong time. So again -- if you marry someone you are madly in love with, then having children with all the attendant difficulties will leave you with someone you at least like, and who likes you back. But marry someone you have to "work hard" to sort of like being around, and I guarantee you, you will end up hating each other. And working hard on hiding it from your children and neighbors -- without, however, much success.

I notice you mentioned that you are a Christian, so I must make a disclaimer that I am not from a Protestant background, nor am I observant generally. However, I do have to say, if your church is pressuring you about getting married -- why don't they help you find a wife? I come from a Jewish background, and in this situation, Orthodox rabbis would scour nearby communities to produce multiple candidates and facilitate meeting them, until you find someone you really like. If your church won't do this for you, but at the same time, continues to pressure you about being single, then I suggest you find a more tolerant church. Marriage just doesn't happen for some people, and it's very improvident to get married for the sake of getting married. As far as we know, Jesus Christ never married, and never did any of his Apostles. Would they feel welcome in your church? In fact, an unbiased reading of the New Testament suggests that Jesus was very much anti-Establishment, which would also mean he wasn't an avid advocate of marriage. This would be consistent with contemporary Greek ethos, on which the New Testament is based.

I get a sense you want to have children, but you should realize, few things are as psychologically painful as loving your children while resenting or being indifferent to their other parent. It's the sort of thing that can really destroy a person from the inside. There are other options, you know. You can look into adoption or (if you really want to have biological children) surrogate motherhood. I know it sounds crazy, but think about it. Despite all the logistical difficulties, these options are much better than marrying someone you don't care for for the purpose of breeding -- and you'll never have to worry about custody (or infertility, for that matter).

Bottom line, I suspect the major reason you want to get married is because other people (namely, your family and those in your church) are pressuring you and making you feel uncomfortable about your single state. I know these pressures can be overwhelming, and that they can really "squeeze" you out of the only world you know, but as much as you can, RESIST. None of these people will be there when you have marital problems, none of them will help (at least not in the way that's likely to have any impact), and marriage can be really, really miserable and joyless -- and long. Don't cave in. It's okay not to get married. It really is -- it's okay. It's okay not to have children. (Just for the record -- I am married and have a child.) You are still yourself. You life is still meaningful. You can still make a positive difference in the lives of many, many people. Marriage and parenthood aren't the be-all, end-all of human existence. There are other things in life. Do what's right for you.

Best of luck.
----------------------------------------------------
* "puritanical" -- using the word in its bastardized, everyday sense. Real-life Puritans, however, were strong advocates for love matches. John Milton, in his tracts in support of relaxing divorce laws, argued that the purpose of marriage was to provide happiness, comfort, and a refuge from the cruelties of life, rather than to impose duty.

[Redisca]

Originally Posted by malamute

In days past, people married for those same reasons, and their marriages lasted.

Let's outlaw divorce, and all marriages will last too. [/end sarcasm].

Originally Posted by malamute

Maybe in the old days people were smarter about things like love, family, marriage.

Or maybe they just had fewer options for escaping an unhappy marriage and a dysfunctional family.

Originally Posted by malamute

Is marriage for the purpose of life long hot sex and passion or is it about having a family?

Oh please. I can see the adverts right now: "Just say no to life long hot sex and passion! Get married for work! Marriage: because life just isn't hard enough."

[WhyShouldIWorry]

Originally Posted by Northman

I'm a 40 year old, single guy with a solid career. I've never even been close to marrying, although I have always wanted a wife and children more than anything.

You are facing a common problem encountered by guys who had to delay marriage for economic and career development reasons. The years go by quickly while you are working and studying all the time.

You get into your thirties, thinking that you are now a good prospect and look around at what is available. You then realize you have nearly missed the boat. Most women who have kids (married or unmarried) do not mesh well with your background and interests. Women who have never married are usually single for a reason. If they are interested in marriage, it is certainly not for the passion in a relationship but rather its more of just something they should or are expected to do. This is probably because those who exhibit a passion a real passion for men, attracted them while in their twenties and were married years earlier.

Two incidents illustrate what I am talking about. One GF would only show any passion when she was planning to shop and buy something. It was obvious she had it in her, but it was misdirected. A relationship to her appeared only to be a means to an end.

Another was sure that men would just get to a point in their life where they would decide they needed to get married. I gather she believed that if she just was around at that moment, she'd be selected. She was difficult to shake and often in such situations, the women circle the wagons. Years later, people continued to ask me why I didn't marry her, since this is what she wanted.They never consider the man's feelings. Its as if, the woman's desires trump all.

I've have rarely experienced passion in a relationship but usually don't. Having experienced it, while I don't consider it to be settling to marry without it, its just not advisable. Better to stay single. Marriage should not be an economic arrangement or something to keep your relatives happy. And no matter how good a parent YOU might be, bringing children into such a union will not be good for them.

[cpg35223]

DON'T DO IT. Marriage is hard enough without bringing such low expectations into it.