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Old 04-10-2010, 09:39 AM
 
Location: Whoville....
22,304 posts, read 17,053,510 times
Reputation: 11752

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nutz76 View Post
This is the most vile excuse for cuckolding and infidelity I've ever seen. Imagine the shoe on the other foot:

"Oh, so sorry we switched your baby up in the hospital 5 years ago and now your child is sick and will die in a few weeks/months because the genetic disorder runs in the family and you had no idea. :shrugs shoulders: Oh well, sorry you were stupid enough to trust us. So sad, too bad."

You going to tolerate that? Yeah, didn't think so.
Just as there are common law marriages, there is common sense paternity. If you've been a child's father for 5 years, you can't just quit. It's not fair to the child. There comes a point, where you owe something ot the child regardless where that single sperm that started the process came from.

If I found out my child was switched at birth, I would not stop being her mother. DNA is a very small part of what makes a parent. Life is not perfect. Mistakes happen. It's not pretty when they are but ADULTS do the right thing by the child. I'm not abandoning my child because someone screwed up in the hospital years ago. You'd have to be heartless to do that to a child.

Am I going to tolerate it, yes because there is no other choice. There is a flesh and blood child involved here. I'm going to take care of the child first. In a case where the child dies, as you've brought up, there'd be a lawsuit AFTER THE FACT to deal with making sure the mistake doesn't happen again to another family. If both children lived, the hospital would get the travel bills so that the two families could meet, frequently, and know that their biological child was ok (I would not move the children. Once established in a household, that's where they would need to stay unless there was due cause). I really don't get not being emotionally attached to a child after years. Being able to just up and walk away because of a DNA test. After 5 years, you couldn't convince me I'm not my child's mother. I don't care whose egg she came from. These are my kids. I'd be upset if they were switched at birth because I'd want to know what kind of life my biological child had, however, the children I've raised would still be more my children than the child who went with the other family. My tie to her would only be biological. The only thing missing would be a biological tie to the child sent home with me. Those years count for more than a strand of DNA.

No one is taking your child away from you. You're throwing the child away because you are declaring the child trash. That is totally different.

 
Old 04-10-2010, 09:46 AM
 
1,325 posts, read 1,191,273 times
Reputation: 952
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivorytickler View Post
Just as there are common law marriages, there is common sense paternity. If you've been a child's father for 5 years, you can't just quit. It's not fair to the child. There comes a point, where you owe something ot the child regardless where that single sperm that started the process came from.

If I found out my child was switched at birth, I would not stop being her mother. DNA is a very small part of what makes a parent. Life is not perfect. Mistakes happen. It's not pretty when they are but ADULTS do the right thing by the child. I'm not abandoning my child because someone screwed up in the hospital years ago. You'd have to be heartless to do that to a child.

Am I going to tolerate it, yes because there is no other choice. There is a flesh and blood child involved here. I'm going to take care of the child first. In a case where the child dies, as you've brought up, there'd be a lawsuit AFTER THE FACT to deal with making sure the mistake doesn't happen again to another family. If both children lived, the hospital would get the travel bills so that the two families could meet, frequently, and know that their biological child was ok (I would not move the children. Once established in a household, that's where they would need to stay unless there was due cause). I really don't get not being emotionally attached to a child after years. Being able to just up and walk away because of a DNA test. After 5 years, you couldn't convince me I'm not my child's mother. I don't care whose egg she came from. These are my kids. I'd be upset if they were switched at birth because I'd want to know what kind of life my biological child had, however, the children I've raised would still be more my children than the child who went with the other family. My tie to her would only be biological. The only thing missing would be a biological tie to the child sent home with me. Those years count for more than a strand of DNA.

No one is taking your child away from you. You're throwing the child away because you are declaring the child trash. That is totally different.
Oh you want to think of best interests of the child? How about you not base their lives up on a lie in the first place and test at birth automatically? Hmmm...? Problem solved.
 
Old 04-10-2010, 09:50 AM
 
12,660 posts, read 8,433,610 times
Reputation: 4743
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivorytickler View Post
Just as there are common law marriages, there is common sense paternity. If you've been a child's father for 5 years, you can't just quit. It's not fair to the child. There comes a point, where you owe something ot the child regardless where that single sperm that started the process came from.
Hi Ivorytickler

This is a classic example of a strawman. He made no statement about the proper course of action after 5 years. He made the statement about the possible consequnces of not testing at birth.
 
Old 04-10-2010, 09:54 AM
 
Location: Whoville....
22,304 posts, read 17,053,510 times
Reputation: 11752
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nutz76 View Post
Oh you want to think of best interests of the child? How about you not base their lives up on a lie in the first place and test at birth automatically? Hmmm...? Problem solved.
What's done is done. There is no justifying the lie but the child isn't the one who should pay for the lie. The child is the only innocent party in this scenario. He picked the wrong partner to have children with and she cheated. The child, had no choice.

I think that the courts are correct to hold men who have established themselves as a child's father responsible. I would expect the court to do the same with me if it turned out one of my children were switched at birth. Is it fair I pay for a child that isn't mine? Nope but once established as mine, I am the responsible party. If it turned out the other family was poor, I'd pay child support to make sure my biological child was also take care of. Fair? Nope but it's the right thing to do.

It would break my heart to know I missed raising my own child but I would not stop loving the child I raised. To be honest, I'd rather not know because it would be painful which is why I don't get men having paternity tests years later. If you're going to do that, the time to do it is at birth. Of course the cost is your relationship with the child's mother but if it turns out she was someone you shouldn't have trusted, you win. If it turns out you should have trusted her, she wins because she gets out of a relationship with a man who never trusted her. No one wins when you test 5 years later and the child loses.
 
Old 04-10-2010, 10:00 AM
 
12,660 posts, read 8,433,610 times
Reputation: 4743
Quote:
Originally Posted by Braunwyn View Post
That's what it comes down to and it looks like some are having a difficult time grasping the point. That, and they don't realize threats and/or mandates fall on deaf ears for some. I would never put on with such boloney from any person. There wouldn't be any reason to.

Hi Braunwyn,

You just proved the argument. That is exactly what women will do. The test will not be done, some women will lie, and some men will believe them. Everyone in prison is innocent. Not everyone is you. So you have just destroyed the argument that some men can insist on the test.
 
Old 04-10-2010, 10:01 AM
 
Location: Whoville....
22,304 posts, read 17,053,510 times
Reputation: 11752
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwynedd1 View Post
Hi Ivorytickler

This is a classic example of a strawman. He made no statement about the proper course of action after 5 years. He made the statement about the possible consequnces of not testing at birth.
If he wants to test at birth then he tests at birth. It's his choice. Whatever he chooses, the consequences are his to live with.

My step son's girlfriend got pregnant and he expressed concern that the child might not be his because they did break up around the time of conception. I told him to have a test before he married her. She said she wouldn't marry him if he didn't trust her. He made his choice and married her. I'll kick his ever loving nuts to kingdom come if he were to try and have a DNA test now. He made his choice. Now he has to live with it, right or wrong because he has established himself as the child's father whether he is or not. All men have a choice to make. It's probably between the mother in your life and knowing becuase I don't know too many women who would stay with a man who has openly declared her a cheating lying ho, however, it's his choice to make and once made, he need to man up and live with the consequences if there are any.

15 years ago, I brought a baby home from the hospital. I trusted that the hospital did not mix up babies. If it turns out I was wrong, I will deal with the consequences. I could have asked for verification. I could have asked a finger print expert to examine her foot prints (the one taken in the delivery room and one taken when we left). I could hve had a DNA test. I chose to trust. If I was wrong, I was wrong. However, my daughter is my daughter either way. I do not have the right to walk away from her because the hospital made a mistake any more than a man who has established himself as the father has the right to walk away from his child.

When you choose to trust, you take a risk. Which risk you want to take is your choice. My husband chose the one that kept me in his life. Trusting me was more important to him than knowing with 99.99% accuracy and I question that accuracy as humans make mistakes. The test may be that accurate but are the humans running it?
 
Old 04-10-2010, 10:08 AM
 
19,081 posts, read 12,574,093 times
Reputation: 13237
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwynedd1 View Post
Hi Braunwyn,

You just proved the argument. That is exactly what women will do. The test will not be done, some women will lie, and some men will believe them. Everyone in prison is innocent. Not everyone is you. So you have just destroyed the argument that some men can insist on the test.
I don't think it's exactly what all women will do. Some people will lie without a doubt, but that doesn't set a rubric for how I live my life or how others live theirs. My husband, for example, is a dj and spins gigs where lots of beautiful women/girls show case their stuff. Some men would and do cheat in those situations and some women would be well in their rights to be suspicious and act accordingly (demand HIV/STD testing ect). That does not play a role in the expectations and trust I have in my husband, tho. We're all different. Our relationships are different- to state the obvious.
 
Old 04-10-2010, 10:10 AM
 
Location: Whoville....
22,304 posts, read 17,053,510 times
Reputation: 11752
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwynedd1 View Post
Hi Braunwyn,

You just proved the argument. That is exactly what women will do. The test will not be done, some women will lie, and some men will believe them. Everyone in prison is innocent. Not everyone is you. So you have just destroyed the argument that some men can insist on the test.
A woman who is lying will object because she's lying. A woman who is not lying will object because she is not trusted. Refusing to test proves nothing but it's stupid. IMO, your relationship was over the second he thought he had to ask.

Personally, I would not refuse to test. I would simply hand dh divorce papers along with the DNA results as we would be done as a couple. We would each have made our choices. He would have chosen 99.99% accuracy and I would choose to find a partner who doesn't think I'm a cheating, lying, ho. IMO, our relationship was done the minute he had to ask. There's no sense in not testing once you know the marriage is over. I would never allow the man to doubt he was the father of my child but I would not stay with a man who does not trust me. Fortunately, if my husband has any doubts, he's kept them to himself. Dd#1 looks so much like him she's either his kid or his son's kid (female version of her half brother), dd#2, we haven't quite figured out. We know she's mine but that's about it. Someday we'll figure it out. Those genes had to come from somewhere....(she has my mother in law's mouth/chin structure so we're pretty sure she's dh's).
 
Old 04-10-2010, 10:36 AM
 
12,660 posts, read 8,433,610 times
Reputation: 4743
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivorytickler View Post
If he wants to test at birth then he tests at birth. It's his choice. Whatever he chooses, the consequences are his to live with.

Hi Ivorytickler,

You just said you would take it personally. So in your case, they can't. All the "honest" women will be offended.So what will a woman do if she cheats? She will act like an honest woman.

Quote:
My step son's girlfriend got pregnant and he expressed concern that the child might not be his because they did break up around the time of conception.
Just because someone breaks up for awhile does not make them a liar does it ?Why not just ask her?

Quote:
I told him to have a test before he married her. She said she wouldn't marry him if he didn't trust her. He made his choice and married her. I'll kick his ever loving nuts to kingdom come if he were to try and have a DNA test now.
That's the game. With all this trust going on, how is it this is happening? What is the difference if she insisted she did not sleep around?Of course you told him to get the test. The reason is the test became your self interest by family relation. That is the consistent theme in this thread, self interest.

Quote:
He made his choice. Now he has to live with it, right or wrong because he has established himself as the child's father whether he is or not. All men have a choice to make. It's probably between the mother in your life and knowing becuase I don't know too many women who would stay with a man who has openly declared her a cheating lying ho, however, it's his choice to make and once made, he need to man up and live with the consequences if there are any.
If I found out she lied, I would make another choice.

Quote:
15 years ago, I brought a baby home from the hospital. I trusted that the hospital did not mix up babies. If it turns out I was wrong, I will deal with the consequences. I could have asked for verification. I could have asked a finger print expert to examine her foot prints (the one taken in the delivery room and one taken when we left). I could hve had a DNA test. I chose to trust. If I was wrong, I was wrong. However, my daughter is my daughter either way. I do not have the right to walk away from her because the hospital made a mistake any more than a man who has established himself as the father has the right to walk away from his child.
In that case I would not change a thing. I would be angry, but I it would not be the result of cuckoldry. I would not look at the child, and see my neighbor and her banging away. I just don't see how I would be a good father.

Quote:
When you choose to trust, you take a risk. Which risk you want to take is your choice. My husband chose the one that kept me in his life. Trusting me was more important to him than knowing with 99.99% accuracy and I question that accuracy as humans make mistakes. The test may be that accurate but are the humans running it?
That is the typical answer. Everyone thinks everyone is like them. You just prove the point that unless its routine, it will always be viewed as an accusation.
 
Old 04-10-2010, 10:59 AM
 
12,660 posts, read 8,433,610 times
Reputation: 4743
Quote:
Originally Posted by Braunwyn View Post
I don't think it's exactly what all women will do. Some people will lie without a doubt, but that doesn't set a rubric for how I live my life or how others live theirs. My husband, for example, is a dj and spins gigs where lots of beautiful women/girls show case their stuff. Some men would and do cheat in those situations and some women would be well in their rights to be suspicious and act accordingly (demand HIV/STD testing ect). That does not play a role in the expectations and trust I have in my husband, tho. We're all different. Our relationships are different- to state the obvious.

Hi Braunwyn,

The point of mandatory testing is so that it is not an accusation. There are lots of honest women, but unfortunately some of them lie. I would also demand that one can explicitly opt out if they choose, and that the DNA profiles be discarded after the test. There is no need for a database or any need to force people to take the test. It simply changes the default procedure. Since its such a simple test, and hospitals have made mistakes, upon exiting both parents should be tested. Wristbands are nice and all but are in the stone age. A child needs to know its parentage to prevent any tragedies down the road and to have a possible health resource. Some men will take it very badly if they find out later. Sooner is better than later.

Newborns Switched at Birth in Illinois Hospital
It happened in Illinois, with two moms each leaving the hospital with the wrong baby boy.
Two newborn baby boys were born hours apart on March 28.
But one of their first experiences in this world went wrong.
The only reason why we would not use the best technology to prevent this is because of the agenda.
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