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Old 04-10-2010, 10:53 AM
 
1,342 posts, read 2,158,111 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivorytickler View Post
What's done is done. There is no justifying the lie but the child isn't the one who should pay for the lie. The child is the only innocent party in this scenario. He picked the wrong partner to have children with and she cheated. The child, had no choice.
OMFG!!!! Every check it out, Ivorytickler is actually BLAMING MEN FOR THEIR WIVE'S CHEATING! It's THEIR fault for choosing the wrong person to have kids with? Are you seriously that daft?! Hey ladies, when your husbands/boyfriends cheat, it's your fault for thinking they won't or for not having reason to suspect them. Ivorytickler said so!

 
Old 04-10-2010, 10:56 AM
 
Location: Whoville....
25,386 posts, read 35,438,093 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Braunwyn View Post
It's true that they might be stupid on some level. What I am sure of is that it wouldn't dawn on my dh to ask for such a thing. He knows exactly who he's married to and frankly, many here probably won't be so fortunate because the caliber of woman that will spend time with them probably fits a specific scope of character. With that in mind, some of you might be in a catch-22. Either way you go, you're damned.
The caliber of person you date, definitely, influences your chances of being lied to about paternity. While I do think cheaters come in all shapes and sizes, the higher caliber the person you're dating, the more likely they'll be honest with you. I can name several people who have told their spouses about cheating they could have gotten away with because they couldn't live with the lying.

If you hang out with dogs, you get fleas. If you hang out with pure breads, you may still get fleas but the odds are much less than if you hang out with a wild pack of dogs living on the street.
 
Old 04-10-2010, 11:01 AM
 
19,045 posts, read 25,137,989 times
Reputation: 13485
Quote:
Originally Posted by nichirenx View Post
Caliber of woman?
By this you mean that there is a certain general type of woman who will never stray?
Or is it that you and some of the ones on this board can only say that being individuals?

I am wondering how to spot a cheating woman dead on.
Psych class teaches you how to read people, if you get military or police interrogation training it goes more in depth.

Is there a list of traits that can assure a man his woman will not cheat?
To start, psych classes don't really teach that.

Your partner/mate is typically of the same caliber as you. If you are a careless person, odds are you might not know your partner and your partner probably doesn't know you, so there would be little way to tell. But, how to spot an honest person following years of intimacy? How we live our lives and go about our daily routines are typical indicators. Is your partner trustworthy/honest with the little things in life? Does s/he have convictions and live by them? Is compassion an integral part of his/her personality, life choices/decisions, and actions?

There are a lot of traits that make up the foundation of honest people. But, again, it's not as if these people are up for grabs for any tom, dick, or harry. And it's not something that can always be known off the bat. That's why a new relationship requires the STD test and nobody is offended by it or at least they shouldn't be.

I don't think it's as hard to know your partner as some people think. It requires dedication, time, and energy. Those that take the time to cultivate a mutual relationship over the years can surely spot behavioral changes that result from infidelity. Point being, you have to pay attention to your marriage. If you don't know your partner, marriage should wait.
 
Old 04-10-2010, 11:02 AM
 
Location: Whoville....
25,386 posts, read 35,438,093 times
Reputation: 14692
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nutz76 View Post
OMFG!!!! Every check it out, Ivorytickler is actually BLAMING MEN FOR THEIR WIVE'S CHEATING! It's THEIR fault for choosing the wrong person to have kids with? Are you seriously that daft?! Hey ladies, when your husbands/boyfriends cheat, it's your fault for thinking they won't or for not having reason to suspect them. Ivorytickler said so!
Nope. I didn't say the cheating was his fault. The cheating is actually irrelevent. It is her fault but once he's established himself as the father, he's the father just as I have established myself as my children's mother even if it turns out my kids were switched at birth. It's not my fault but I have to live with the consequences. You are confusing blame with living with the natural consequences of our choices. We get the consequences no matter who is to blame. That's just the way life works.

I would suggest that you ditch any partner who cheats on you as soon as you realize they are cheating. I would also suggest we all pick our partners well. There is a lot riding on this decision. While we are not responsible for what our partners do, we will end up dealing with the fallout as a direct consequence of the choice we made. Don't mistake having to live with the natural consequences of our decisions with being responsible for what others do. They're two different things.

If my husband cheats, and I get AIDS, I get to live with that. I chose him and that's what I got. Period. It's just life. Every decision we make has consequences. Doesn't mean it's my fault but I don't get to escape the consequences just because it's not my fault.

To the guy who picked the wrong woman and got child support for a child that isn't his, I say "I'm sorry that happened" which is what I would say to someone who got AIDS or whose spouse bankrupted them with gambling debt, etc, etc, etc.... it's not their fault but they still have to live with the consequences. Once he has established himself as the child's father, he's the child's father. It's the natural conequence of his decision to establish himself as the child's father. Once there is a child, it ceases to be about the adults. It's now about the child.

Personally, if I didn't have the test at birth, I'd never have it at all. I would rather not know I was wrong. Either run the test at birth and get divorced from the woman you think is a lying, cheating, ho or shut up. Take your pick but, whichever you pick, you will have to deal with the natural consequences, whatever they happen to be.

Last edited by Ivorytickler; 04-10-2010 at 11:15 AM..
 
Old 04-10-2010, 11:09 AM
 
19,045 posts, read 25,137,989 times
Reputation: 13485
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivorytickler View Post
The caliber of person you date, definitely, influences your chances of being lied to about paternity. While I do think cheaters come in all shapes and sizes, the higher caliber the person you're dating, the more likely they'll be honest with you. I can name several people who have told their spouses about cheating they could have gotten away with because they couldn't live with the lying.

If you hang out with dogs, you get fleas. If you hang out with pure breads, you may still get fleas but the odds are much less than if you hang out with a wild pack of dogs living on the street.
So true. I've known both types and as I mentioned, these folk don't only lie about cheating. It's a part of their personality and pretty easy to see if you're paying attention. One of my previous bfs was a cheat, or at least an attempted cheat, and I knew it. I knew him. I was very young, and this is a small thing, but he worked at a CD shop (early 90s) and he was the closing mgr. He would stash CDs in the garbage at the end of the shift and go retrieve them in the middle of the night. That right there told me something about his character, tho, we were both very young so he's probably/hopefully changed. I wasn't all that surprised to find out his attempts to win over other women.

As an aside, I'm glad he did! One of those women I became friends with and she's been my best friend for almost 20 years now.
 
Old 04-10-2010, 11:12 AM
 
19,045 posts, read 25,137,989 times
Reputation: 13485
Quote:
Originally Posted by nichirenx View Post
Which means if I tell my wife that I am working late and she comes to my job to see, I would be right to leave her because she is calling me a cheating, lying ho correct?
Or if I say I am visiting the fellas and she calls my friend looking for me, I would be right to leave her because she does nto trust me right?
Or if she asks me where I have been?
She should trust me.. right?
I would say you have an effed up relationship. My dh stays out when he plays his gigs and I do call, but I'm worried his safety; if he drank too much, if the party was busted, whatever. I tell him all the time I'd rather him stay put, and be gone all night, than risk him driving. If your partner is checking up on you due to jealousy or thinking you might be fooling around, you should get marriage counseling pronto.
 
Old 04-10-2010, 11:15 AM
 
19,045 posts, read 25,137,989 times
Reputation: 13485
As far as paternity fraud goes, I don't agree that there should be child support (unless the guy wants to be the kid's father). A person cannot be forced to be a parent, biologically or otherwise. eta: although, to be clear, the bio-father should pay child support. I would also support the idea of retribution, but that's in theory, I don't see how it could work out in reality.

eta: then again, I'm not a parent. So, I have no idea how that kind of bonding goes.
 
Old 04-10-2010, 11:25 AM
 
Location: Whoville....
25,386 posts, read 35,438,093 times
Reputation: 14692
Quote:
Originally Posted by nichirenx View Post
I am not evading your questions.
If a man checked your cellphone, put a keystroke logger on your computer, put mini cams and minicorders in your car and on your clothes, followed you around and then asked for the test, I could see how you have that perspective.

If him requesting a DNA test is that much of an insult to you just because he wants to make sure that he does not dedicate his life to a responsibility that he did not create, then you are correct in leaving him.

Which means if I tell my wife that I am working late and she comes to my job to see, I would be right to leave her because she is calling me a cheating, lying ho correct?
Or if I say I am visiting the fellas and she calls my friend looking for me, I would be right to leave her because she does nto trust me right?
Or if she asks me where I have been?
She should trust me.. right?
Depends on why she showed up where you work. She might not be wearing much under that trench coat

Someone who checks my phone isn't accusing me of 1) cheating on them and 2) lying about the paternity of my child. Maybe he just wants to know if I'm bragging about his bedroom prowress to my friends . As to calling looking for you, there are a million innocent reasons she might. There is no mistaking that a man asking for a DNA test thinks the woman he's with is a lying, cheating, ho. If he didn't, he wouldn't need to ask.

Now, if you find she's hired a PI who has been videotaping your hotel room while you're on business trips, I'd suggest you have a problem, except, maybe she's just a voyeur and likes to watch you get undressed.

There's just nothing like saying "I believe you slept around on me and are lying about this child being mine" that says "I love you" NOT!!!!!
 
Old 04-10-2010, 11:31 AM
 
Location: Whoville....
25,386 posts, read 35,438,093 times
Reputation: 14692
Quote:
Originally Posted by Braunwyn View Post
As far as paternity fraud goes, I don't agree that there should be child support (unless the guy wants to be the kid's father). A person cannot be forced to be a parent, biologically or otherwise. eta: although, to be clear, the bio-father should pay child support. I would also support the idea of retribution, but that's in theory, I don't see how it could work out in reality.

eta: then again, I'm not a parent. So, I have no idea how that kind of bonding goes.
IMO, it depends on whether he has established himself as the father. If we're talking at birth, no problem, walk away. If we're talking a 7 year old and the test is only being done because of a divorce, nope. You've had 7 years of being that child's father and you don't get to stop now. You've set precident. Just as I have set precident as my children's mother. If I found out today that my daughter wasn't mine, I'd still be responsible for her. I have, legally, established myself as her mother and even if DNA says otherwise, I am responsible until she is 18 unless someone else, voluntarily, takes over that responsibitly (but I'd miss her and probably wouldn't let her go anyway).

I am a parent and there is nothing you could say to me to convince me that the two daughter's I've raised are not mine. The only reason a DNA test would matter at all to me right now is that it would mean I have a child out there I don't know. It would not make me quit loving the daughter I raised. I would not stop being her mom. I'd want to meet my biological child and make sure she's ok but I have no tie to her other than DNA and that's not much. In time, I'd get to know her and my daughter would get to know her bio mom (I'd be JEALOUS of that ) but I'd always be mom to the child I raised.
 
Old 04-10-2010, 11:33 AM
 
19,045 posts, read 25,137,989 times
Reputation: 13485
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivorytickler View Post
Depends on why she showed up where you work. She might not be wearing much under that trench coat

Someone who checks my phone isn't accusing me of 1) cheating on them and 2) lying about the paternity of my child. Maybe he just wants to know if I'm bragging about his bedroom prowress to my friends . As to calling looking for you, there are a million innocent reasons she might. There is no mistaking that a man asking for a DNA test thinks the woman he's with is a lying, cheating, ho. If he didn't, he wouldn't need to ask.

Now, if you find she's hired a PI who has been videotaping your hotel room while you're on business trips, I'd suggest you have a problem, except, maybe she's just a voyeur and likes to watch you get undressed.

There's just nothing like saying "I believe you slept around on me and are lying about this child being mine" that says "I love you" NOT!!!!!
I get the impression that, that type of checking up (lack of trust) is condisidered a normal part of relationships for him, when in reality it's indicative of an unhealthy relationship. If that kind of boloney is happening, something is going very wrong.
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