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Old 04-10-2010, 12:13 PM
 
19,045 posts, read 25,137,989 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gwynedd1 View Post
Hi Braunwyn,

I am not looking for good analogies. I am looking to establish paternity as soon as possible because some women lie. Also, though much rarer, hospitals also screw it up. Finding out later is a complete disaster.
Paternity tests are available. It's a non-issue. The fact that some what them to be mandatory for the entire population so their own deciet won't surface in their marriages is absurd.

 
Old 04-10-2010, 12:14 PM
 
2,951 posts, read 2,888,030 times
Reputation: 5029
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivorytickler View Post
So you treat all women as liars because some lie??? So, how often are you taking lie detector tests to prove you're not sleeping around? After all, some men do and lie about it.
If taking such a test would put her mind at ease, I would have no problem taking such a test. Screw it...it is just a stupid test, take it, then I'm back to fishing or whatever. I'm smart enough to realize to not blow this pebble into a full out war.
 
Old 04-10-2010, 12:14 PM
 
Location: Whoville....
25,386 posts, read 35,438,093 times
Reputation: 14692
Quote:
Originally Posted by HansProof View Post
The saying rings true, it is easy to gamble when you have nothing in the game. The woman has nothing, the man everything. Take or leave that argument.

Grant it, in most cases, the woman may win the battle by keeping the children...initially, but who wins the war? Children aren't stupid...they can see the truth between their spiteful mother who bashes their father every chance she gets and their father who takes life as it comes, accepts the hand he's been dealt, and truly values the time he has with his children.

All I know is if I grew up knowing I could only see my father twice a month simply because he requested a DNA, I'd cut my mother out of my life mighty quick.
Why would you be limited to seeing your father twice a month because of a DNA test? If he's the father, he has the right to go for joint custody.

Honestly, would you expect your mother to stay with a man who just declared her a lying, cheating, ho? I'd be upset with my mother if she stayed. What an awful example to set for a daughter.

If a man doesn't trust his wife, he shouldn't be married to her. The divorce, should, take place before kids are born. Just be honest. Tell her you don't trust her. Let her decide if she wants to live a life where she has to prove herself innocent or be assumed guilty.

And, surprisingly, no you wouldn't cut your mother out of your life. Dh's ex lied to everyone to keep dh from seeing one of his sons. He waw LIVID when he found out his mother had lied and, for about 6 weeks, had a relationship with his father then went back to mom. She was the parent he knew growing up. He now blames his father for not trying harder to see him more. You'd side with the parent who raised you. That's where your loyalties would be. (long story, she left the state, filed for divorce in another state, unbeknownst to dh, and got sole custody of the son she took because dh didn't show up to court (didn't know about it) then lied to her son and her new husband telling them both that the two kids dh had custody of were not hers but his from different relationships. Her lies were so deep, there's no telling the lenght she would have gone to to protect them. We couldn't afford to fight across state lines anyway so dh hoped when he was an adult he'd see his mother for the liar she was but he doesn't . She's his mom.

Last edited by Ivorytickler; 04-10-2010 at 12:31 PM..
 
Old 04-10-2010, 12:15 PM
 
20,599 posts, read 19,259,253 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivorytickler View Post
I get the same feeling. People who are themselves untrustworthy tend to not trust others.
Hi Ivorytickler,

That is a sound principle to watch. Plumbers will walk into a house and judge it by the pluming.

Again, you are defeating rather soundly the argument not to test by default. The most vulnerable men will be the ones who do not suspect cheating because they are loyal. They will not test. They do not see the world that way. That is how I saw the world. What changed it was when an early LTR girlfriend cheated because the person she did it with told me. I thought she could be trusted too. Who would do such a thing? But I was naive`.
 
Old 04-10-2010, 12:16 PM
 
Location: Whoville....
25,386 posts, read 35,438,093 times
Reputation: 14692
Quote:
Originally Posted by HansProof View Post
If taking such a test would put her mind at ease, I would have no problem taking such a test. Screw it...it is just a stupid test, take it, then I'm back to fishing or whatever. I'm smart enough to realize to not blow this pebble into a full out war.
I would get the test. I would also file for divorce. I, simply, have no reason or desire to stay with someone who thinks I'm a cheating, lying, ho. I would not let my child's paternity go challenged though. My children deserve better than that. I would move on to a relationship with someone who actually cared about me and trusted me.

He gets to be the father either way. He's just not in my life one way.
 
Old 04-10-2010, 12:19 PM
 
Location: Whoville....
25,386 posts, read 35,438,093 times
Reputation: 14692
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwynedd1 View Post
Hi Ivorytickler,

That is a sound principle to watch. Plumbers will walk into a house and judge it by the pluming.

Again, you are defeating rather soundly the argument not to test by default. The most vulnerable men will be the ones who do not suspect cheating because they are loyal. They will not test. They do not see the world that way. That is how I saw the world. What changed it was when an early LTR girlfriend cheated because the person she did it with told me. I thought she could be trusted too. Who would do such a thing? But I was naive`.
You can drop that one. Did you miss the part about my ex fiance cheating on me and passing me an STD that killed our baby and nearly killed me? Even though that happened, I do not assume all men are cheats nor would I demand any man in my life prove he isn't. My ex was a jerk. I try to stay away from jerks.

You are ASSuming that becuase one woman cheated, they all will and you've decided to treat them all like lying, cheating, ho's. That is illogical and will result in you ending up alone and lonely.
 
Old 04-10-2010, 12:19 PM
 
19,045 posts, read 25,137,989 times
Reputation: 13485
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivorytickler View Post
Well, according to my doctor, I couldn't have gotten pregnant with either of my kids when I did but I did. Every woman is different. If we all ovulated on the same day of our cycle, getting pregnant would be a lot easier than it is for some. I'm one of those women you look at crosseyed and they get pregnant. It doens't matter what day of my cycle it is. If I went by ovulation mid cycle, dh can't be either of my children's father , now if I'd had sex with someone else mid cycle, I would have sworn he was the father not dh and there'd be lots of medical literature to support that. Fortunately, I didn't so I was just surprised to turn up pregnant when I thought we'd done the deed too early, in one case, and too late in the other. According to the rhythm method, my kids should not exist.
If a woman has sex with two or more men within a six month period and gets pregnant that's enough to cause wonder from where I sit. There's no excuse. The ignorance card doesn't play, especially if it's within the same month or two.

Quote:
We'll have to agree to disagree, IMO, the child trumps everything. Once the child is grown, feel free to sue mom for whatever you'd like to but the child must be taken care of and the child should not lose their father because mom lied or didn't know who dad was...or maybe you thank her for giving you a child you never would have had...I guess it depends on whether or not you bonded with the child.

Having been raised by my step father, I know biology doesn't matter. Parenting is in the heart. If you stop loving a child because of a DNA test, you're a poor excuse for a human being. Even if it turned out my dd's were switched at birth, I can't say I'd regret that. I wouldn't know them if it hadn't happened. I'd just want to meet the child I didn't get to raise.
My dad isn't my bio-dad either. I get it. I just don't expect everyone to have the same level of compassion, character, etc. We're all different.

A nice story to share...a friend of my from years ago met a woman while she was pregnant and started dating her. She gave birth to a son and they were together for another year. My friend bonded with this baby and he was his father in every meaningful way. He was so worried when the relationship ended since he had no rights to the kid. Luckily, this woman realized that her child shouldn't suffer. They had joint custody and now 15 years later this kid is grown and still has his dad. What a great man.
 
Old 04-10-2010, 12:23 PM
 
19,045 posts, read 25,137,989 times
Reputation: 13485
Quote:
Originally Posted by HansProof View Post
If taking such a test would put her mind at ease, I would have no problem taking such a test. Screw it...it is just a stupid test, take it, then I'm back to fishing or whatever. I'm smart enough to realize to not blow this pebble into a full out war.
The differences here is that not everybody has or wants that kind of relationship or to be with those kinds of people. Relationships aren't one size fits all.
 
Old 04-10-2010, 12:24 PM
 
Location: Whoville....
25,386 posts, read 35,438,093 times
Reputation: 14692
Quote:
Originally Posted by Braunwyn View Post
If a woman has sex with two or more men within a six month period and gets pregnant that's enough to cause wonder from where I sit. There's no excuse. The ignorance card doesn't play, especially if it's within the same month or two.


My dad isn't my bio-dad either. I get it. I just don't expect everyone to have the same level of compassion, character, etc. We're all different.

A nice story to share...a friend of my from years ago met a woman while she was pregnant and started dating her. She gave birth to a son and they were together for another year. My friend bonded with this baby and he was his father in every meaningful way. He was so worried when the relationship ended since he had no rights to the kid. Luckily, this woman realized that her child shouldn't suffer. They had joint custody and now 15 years later this kid is grown and still has his dad. What a great man.
What I"m saying is that she may have, truely, believed he was the father. She may not have realized there was a possibility of the other guy being the father. I think any woman who has sex with two men in a month should have a DNA test but I'm sure some think they know their cycles well enough that they think they know who the baby daddy is.

That's a great story. The guys I really feel sorry for aren't the ones who get burned on child support payments (I'm sorry but if you're bonded to a child, why wouldn't you want to take care of it?) but the ones who, truely, love children that are ripped away from them because they aren't the bio dad. The flip side of him being able to get a DNA test and walk away is she can get a DNA test and take the child away.
 
Old 04-10-2010, 12:28 PM
 
19,045 posts, read 25,137,989 times
Reputation: 13485
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivorytickler View Post
What I"m saying is that she may have, truely, believed he was the father. She may not have realized there was a possibility of the other guy being the father. I think any woman who has sex with two men in a month should have a DNA test but I'm sure some think they know their cycles well enough that they think they know who the baby daddy is.

That's a great story. The guys I really feel sorry for aren't the ones who get burned on child support payments (I'm sorry but if you're bonded to a child, why wouldn't you want to take care of it?) but the ones who, truely, love children that are ripped away from them because they aren't the bio dad. The flip side of him being able to get a DNA test and walk away is she can get a DNA test and take the child away.
That's a very good point and one I didn't consider. Hmm, that changes the game.
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