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Of course dismissal. Geeze louise, what do you guys expect? Just because I have female bits does not mean that I, or any of the women on this forum, must take responsibility for the choices the troubled men here have made in their lives or responsibility for the women they engage with. It's completely ridiculous to expect to be mommied by strangers about situations we are all oblivious to.
Thats what always struck me as odd about these forums, blogs, videos...The titles are obviously descriptive of the topic...the topic becomes even more clear as the discussion progresses...yet people who dislike the direction of the topic will frequently continue to engage in its course. True dismissal involves letting the discontent writhe in their own misery without any further acknowledgment. I personally dont expect any women anywhere to take responsibility for mistakes that troubled nor untroubled men make in their lives...I dont see how women could accept responsibility on a forum even if the wanted to. At best they could I suppose chip in and say "You guys are right, we're all dusty, gold digging, malicious whores"...which I dont think that sort of patronizing would solve anything and it certainly wouldnt compare to the maternal capabilities of anyone's mother....
No, instead I think these forums and the rest of the internet are a great place for men to bÃtch to varying degrees. Some bÃtch more than others, and others barely bÃtch..but whats great is that there is an outlet to do so. Women have known of the health benefits of having this outlet for decades. Men are just now realizing that its alright to have concerns..and its alright to express them in like company. Sure, someone will call you gay, someone will call you bitter, someone will call you dysfunctional..but that is why this communication is so important...so that people can determine whether it is just "them" or are these problems more widespread. If they are widespread enough, then things will inevitably change.
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Originally Posted by Braunwyn
Again, I was sexually assaulted, and sure, >90% of sexual assaults are made by men. My issue was with that nasty, hairy, old, freak. It would never dawn on me to get mad at anybody but him. It would never dawn on me to expect the men in this forum to answer for his behavior.
This would be applicable, imo, if you had been repeatedly sexually assaulted, God forbid..BUT, I do commend you for taking a very rational approach to the opposite sex (sometimes..lol)...but, dont forget that for every rape victim who is resilient, many more will never have sex again, or will be sexually dysfunctional in some capacity for the rest of their lives. So being the exception to that phenomena, makes you just that: exceptional. But that doesnt mean that the assailant no longer exists.
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Originally Posted by Braunwyn
You know I cannot grasp this. TV isn't real. It's fake. Again, I cannot answer to the psychological problems achieved by some men because of what they're ingesting via the boob tube. And I have answered this in the past. I've told countless guys to turn off the TV, stay out of the bump&grind of shallow ridden night clubs and engage women that actually enjoy the sun light, life.
I dont know that anyone is asking you in particular to answer the psychological problems that some men have. I doubt anyone online can answer the psychological problems that others have. But communicating, and finding the company of others who experience similar problems, and have similar perspectives is one of the paths to self betterment. Its the reason that people form support groups, whether they are psychologically unstable or not. Support helps...again, women have known this for decades, and are better mentally for it.
And Ill just say this (and hopefully this doesnt scare the begezzus out of anyone) but: for all of these forlorn relationship loser guys you read comments from online, there are, in my personal experience conversing with other younger men --- there are SCORES more in reality..several of the men Ive spoken to in real life, speak the same exact things that we online characters bÃtch about. The guys that Im speaking of in real life, actually DO get women or have relationships and/or families (wife, kids), and they STILL bÃtch about the kind of women that this generation has created.
Not that those men are perfect, but it certainly signals, to me at least, that the problems that these men on this board bÃtch about, arent exclusive to them, NOR are they isolated incidents.
Last edited by solytaire; 02-06-2010 at 03:41 PM..
No, instead I think these forums and the rest of the internet are a great place for men to bÃtch to varying degrees. Some bÃtch more than others, and others barely bÃtch..but whats great is that there is an outlet to do so. Women have known of the health benefits of having this outlet for decades. Men are just now realizing that its alright to have concerns..and its alright to express them in like company. Sure, someone will call you gay, someone will call you bitter, someone will call you dysfunctional..but that is why this communication is so important...so that people can determine whether it is just "them" or are these problems more widespread. If they are widespread enough, then things will inevitably change.
I fully support men expressing themselves and seeking counsel. I don't want to start generalizing women, but it has been my experience with girl friends that we discuss a specific issue/person. For example, as I quickly glance at the titles in this forum, I note a thread about a woman's husband...actually two threads. This is what I tend to see with my friends. They want to discuss the issue/person at hand. They don't call me to say all men are this or that. I really don't believe it's healthy to promote and engage in bigotry as a form of healing.
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This would be applicable, imo, if you had been repeatedly sexually assaulted, God forbid..BUT, I do commend you for taking a very rational approach to the opposite sex (sometimes..lol)...but, dont forget that for every rape victim who is resilient, many more will never have sex again, or will be sexually dysfunctional in some capacity for the rest of their lives. So being the exception to that phenomena, makes you just that: exceptional. But that doesnt mean that the assailant no longer exists.
Well, any woman, any person, has a load of issues to deal with following an assault, and sure, there's probably plenty of dysfunction that surfaces, but hating all men for it or taking a bigoted stance? That's not what I see here. There are many women on this forum that have been abused (I won't name names, but if you read posts, you probably know who I'm speaking of) and they're, by and large, not disservicing themselves by blaming men en masse. The one's that do are only hurting themselves.
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I dont know that anyone is asking you in particular to answer the psychological problems that some men have. I doubt anyone online can answer the psychological problems that others have. But communicating, and finding the company of others who experience similar problems, and have similar perspectives is one of the paths to self betterment. Its the reason that people form support groups, whether they are psychologically unstable or not. Support helps...again, women have known this for decades, and are better mentally for it.
If these guys were not interested in addressing women they would not be addressing women. They'd be on a men's forum. Something else besides seeking support is going on here. Imo, this forum is being utilized as a platform to cultivate negativity.
Quote:
And Ill just say this (and hopefully this doesnt scare the begezzus out of anyone) but: for all of these forlorn relationship loser guys you read comments from online, there are, in my personal experience conversing with other younger men --- there are SCORES more in reality..several of the men Ive spoken to in real life, speak the same exact things that we online characters bÃtch about. The guys that Im speaking of in real life, actually DO get women or have relationships and/or families (wife, kids), and they STILL bÃtch about the kind of women that this generation has created.
Not that those men are perfect, but it certainly signals, to me at least, that the problems that these men on this board bÃtch about, arent exclusive to them, NOR are they isolated incidents.
I can only relate this to the men I know offline who engage in this type of rhetoric, which are members of my family. Terms like personal responsibility are thrown around, but not really grasped. I always bring up my dad because he embodies the MO for much of the stuff I come across here. I've watched him make poor decisions my whole life and he never stops to consider the role he plays except when he's really down and out. That's not the best thing to do either. I don't feel self-deprication is the way go, but rather an honest and detached self-assessment.
As I mentioned in a previous thread, when I was younger I thought about the kind of mate I wanted to have. I then set out to be that person. People are people and we all have multiple flaws, but what we attract in our relationships is based on who we are. The constant outward blame game doesn't have much of a place imo.
If these guys were not interested in addressing women they would not be addressing women. They'd be on a men's forum. Something else besides seeking support is going on here. Imo, this forum is being utilized as a platform to cultivate negativity.
I REALLY do liken this to the culture so prevalent on Television. Women have convened on television shows for decades to discuss their qualms with the male half of the human species. As you know, people in general dont interface with one another as much as they used to..so it should come as no surprise that men are using mass communication methods to share their experiences also. Too, lets not forget that many men DO come here and defend women, name call the men who engage in this negativity and clarify the generalizations made about women. They should not be discounted, as they serve as the exception to the generalizations made about the men on this forum.
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Originally Posted by Braunwyn
I can only relate this to the men I know offline who engage in this type of rhetoric, which are members of my family. Terms like personal responsibility are thrown around, but not really grasped. I always bring up my dad because he embodies the MO for much of the stuff I come across here. I've watched him make poor decisions my whole life and he never stops to consider the role he plays except when he's really down and out. That's not the best thing to do either. I don't feel self-deprication is the way go, but rather an honest and detached self-assessment.
The converse to this would be my mother...she openly admits that she picked the wrong person...she only faulted him so much, before she started to assess how her own poor judgment played into the situation. It is for this reason, that as I stated a couple of pages ago, I personally only impute blame upon the women I have come across, AFTER I have determined which role I played in the demise of the relationship, friendship or otherwise.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Braunwyn
As I mentioned in a previous thread, when I was younger I thought about the kind of mate I wanted to have. I then set out to be that person. People are people and we all have multiple flaws, but what we attract in our relationships is based on who we are. The constant outward blame game doesn't have much of a place imo.
This is true...but also true, I believe, is that we can only control so much. We can only be the best people we can be, and hope everyone else does their part. Much of what you're seeing here on CD are men who have actually done their part in society. They likely sacrificed most of their youth and dating lives so that they could make themselves marketable to GOOD women when they completed their self improvement. Probably abstained from criminal activity. For many men this meant becoming a shut in and studying or working tirelessly, and yes eventually becoming socially disparate.. While this sob story may not resonate with women, who will state they did the same, the difference is that women choose men. Women's choices will exist regardless. While nothing is guaranteed to anyone in life, for men who choose to forfeit much of their social lives due to the understanding that women respect and even seek men who are self sufficient, kind, respectful, thoughtful, etc. this investment is hugely lacking in its reward nowdays.
Basically these men and others in real life that I hear are simply bitter because the social indoctrination they received was a farce. Women enter the scope of their ire simply because women in general were a part of the indoctrination. Again, although tv may not be mentally healthy, in many ways neither is a telephone. Yet it is effective for its purpose of communicating...men began viewing a disparity between what was being communicated to them, and what is actuality. Society's (including women's) message to men = GOOD women want x, y, z and other qualities are negotiable or unacceptable. The reality that men find is that almost all women actually DATE a, b, c with no room for negotiation.
This is why I say that college is useless. I truly believe that this next generation of males wont be duped by indoctrination so easily. They will have matured realizing that educated, honest, faithful, civilized, even-tempered, pensive men simply dont win in this country....its an inconvenient fact of life, but a fact nontheless.
Im convinced that we wont hear the next generation of young men complain at all. Rather they will simply do what works. In many areas of society this is already happening. Young people in general are no longer doing what they were told will benefit them as in years past...very shortly they will do what they see yields results. I think this goes for education, relationships, friendships, career, family etc. I think the real discontent of many men is slightly misplaced. The discontent shouldnt only be aimed at women, it should actually be focused towards society for falsely advertising its values.
I actually dont think its very much different than the way some women feel they have been lied to when they were told that they could "have it all"..while that sentiment may be debatable, the sentiment exists among a fairly wide swathe of career women today.
Last edited by solytaire; 02-06-2010 at 06:45 PM..
I actually dont think its very much different than the way some women feel they have been lied to when they were told that they could "have it all"..while that sentiment may be debatable, the sentiment exists among a fairly wide swathe of career women today.
Every professional woman I know has been told that lie at some point.
Are they bitter about it? No.
They are waaaaaaaay too busy trying to juggle everything in their lives.
Every professional woman I know has been told that lie at some point.
Are they bitter about it? No.
They are waaaaaaaay too busy trying to juggle everything in their lives.
I dont know about that one...I have watched SEVERAL shows whereby women lament over exactly that misconception.
Lately it seems every other thread on here is filled with angry, often mysogynistic rants against women. These posts/threads reek of bitterness and discontentment. Why the need to blame an entire gender for the bad behavior or bad experiences with a few? I've heard that women are notorious for "man-bashing"(which is inexcusable as well) but all I see on here as of late is the opposite with thread topics of exhorting men to "never get married", plus the usual "women are superficial gold-diggers". Geez, don't you think it's getting a little old? I have personally had some very negative and hurtful experiences with men, but I would NEVER blame the male gender for my problems or hold any group or even any individual responsible for the foul acts of a few men. Has anyone else noticed the preponderance of these negative anti-women threads? What do you think?
Its not getting old at all when often times it is sadly true
Wow, isn't it lucky that TV reflects real life so accurately !!
because the people who appear on talk shows dont actually exist in real life...lol...shhh dont tell anyone.
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