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I have to agree with everything MathGuy has said. As usual, his posts are spot on. I would add that it's especially important to have realistic standards. A lot of guys enter their 30s expecting the women they meet to still look like they're 25 and have no kids.
This is why those who are able to, look for actual 25 year olds w/o kids. The rest of men are in a jam.
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Originally Posted by DennyCrane
The worst part is these same guys have put on weight and lost some hair. Sadly, a lot of guys will interpret this as lowering one's standards and settling.
The sad thing is that generally applies to the available single females too.
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Originally Posted by DennyCrane
One argument I reject is the "leftovers" argument, the one that says anyone who hasn't been married by the time they turn 30 was probably rejected by everyone else and should therefore be avoided. Maybe they devoted their 20s to establishing their careers.
This certainly applies to men. Unless a guy in the top 10% of looks, he will not have women lining up to support him. The men I knew, understood this well and worked hard to improve their chances. This often took until they were at least 30, since opportunities for men have been seriously reduced in order to provide opportunities for women. Given the economy in recent decades, the pay in the first few years is only barely better than subsistence. Meanwhile one is expected to spend his money on good clothes, a functional car and more studying.
Women don’t have this problem. If they are a decent catch, men will line up to marry and support them during these early lean career years. Often, they will be supported through advanced education too.
Of course, some make the mistake of marrying for looks and will find themselves suppoerting their husband but that is another issue.
This is generally true. Somewhere in the 30's the balance of power (women have it no question in their 20's) in dating levels out and then starts to favor men. Much of this is driven by the mortality rate, supply\demand.
With regards to sex. Unless the gal is religious, gals 30+ generally are more comfortable with themselves and their needs etc. If you are a good guy working on a relationship with them....you will be *likely* to have sex sooner than later. It will also generally be done well, with less inhibition etc.
Then again, I like fiesty women so without exception I never went on a 2nd date with a gal that showed up withdrawn, nervous etc.
THANK YOU!!!!
You DO agree with what I'm trying to say. Obviously I didn't get the point across as well as you did. Thanks again.
You'll no doubt learn more about 'mutually exclusive' when you grow up, right now I doubt that you experience very much of it. We understand why that is...
Just because you don't understand what I'm trying to say you decide to attack me personally rather than my idea/statement? If someone needs to do some growing up, it is you.
Basically my questions was why is a guy who values sex in a relationship also not considered to be a guy who values other important things in a relationship as well, or be unfairly labeled as a hornball after just one thing.
I feel communication is just as important as sex in a relationship. Ask the same women who withhold sex from their SO's or husbands what it would be like if their husbands only spoke to them once a week for 10 minutes, once a month, a few times a year....never in years.
This is why those who are able to, look for actual 25 year olds w/o kids. The rest of men are in a jam.
And too often, the people who marry in their 20s end up divorced less than 10 years later, probably cause they didn't finish growing up, didn't figure out exactly who they were and what they wanted in a partner, and married the wrong person or discovered that they just weren't ready for marriage. I disagree that "the rest of us" are in a jam. I'm in my 30s. While the dating landscape is a lot different than it was in my 20s, I don't look at as a bad thing. In a lot of ways, I feel like I'm at a disadvantage. I'm a lot wiser, I have a better idea of what I want and don't want, and most of the women I meet in my age group are past the silly games and immaturity that you find among women in their 20s.
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Originally Posted by NotARedneck
The sad thing is that generally applies to the available single females too.
I never said it didn't. The point is that you can't be a hypocrite. That applies equally to men and women and yet a lot of people enter their 30s unable or just unwilling to be flexible. That would be like me going out into today's job market and making the same kinds of demands of employers that I would've made back in 2006.
Quote:
Originally Posted by NotARedneck
This certainly applies to men. Unless a guy in the top 10% of looks, he will not have women lining up to support him. The men I knew, understood this well and worked hard to improve their chances. This often took until they were at least 30, since opportunities for men have been seriously reduced in order to provide opportunities for women. Given the economy in recent decades, the pay in the first few years is only barely better than subsistence. Meanwhile one is expected to spend his money on good clothes, a functional car and more studying.
Women don’t have this problem. If they are a decent catch, men will line up to marry and support them during these early lean career years. Often, they will be supported through advanced education too.
Of course, some make the mistake of marrying for looks and will find themselves suppoerting their husband but that is another issue.
Opportunities for men have been reduced in order to provide opportunities for women? Gee, sounds like you have a chip on your shoulder. Or your just sexist. This might come as a shock to you, but maybe most women would rather be financially independent than have a man marry them and support them during their early lean career years. Most women I know who are successful in their careers worker hard and sacrificed to get there. They went to 4 years of college, worked for a couple of years, went back to some kind of graduate school, then spent even more years paying your dues in jobs with long hours and low pay. They accepted the trade-off, which was less time for a serious relationship. That's why they arrived at their 30s still single.
Opportunities have been made available for Mexicans. Since they can take home their pay and return to Mexico, the cost structure is such that American men in particular can't compete. Some of those jobs are semi-skilled and sometimes skilled labor in blue collar construction. Since American women tend to be in fields that involve information and communication, they don't have Mexican competition. That is really what is uniquely behind the US male emasculation. That its been called a man's recession implies that in many fields men and women don't compete.
Opportunities have been made available for Mexicans. Since they can take home their pay and return to Mexico, the cost structure is such that American men in particular can't compete. Some of those jobs are semi-skilled and sometimes skilled labor in blue collar construction. Since American women tend to be in fields that involve information and communication, they don't have Mexican competition. That is really what is uniquely behind the US male emasculation. That its been called a man's recession implies that in many fields men and women don't compete.
Did you just suggest that Mexicans are ruining dating for 30 something men?
You DO agree with what I'm trying to say. Obviously I didn't get the point across as well as you did. Thanks again.
Don't thank me, lol, what you said in THAT post was correct.
I'm just speaking from a wierdly unique experience. I dated around age 22-23, met a great gal 7-8 years older than me and married her at 25. She died when I was 38 so.....by 39 or so....back on the market. So, I'm acutely aware of how different the dating environments are between those age groups.
If you let yourself get jaded. You LOSE. You might me the perfect man\woman for you and **** it away with your own baggage. If you aren't ready to date then don't. Key is to know who you are, what you want and WHERE to look for it.
Best of luck to you all.
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