Religion will eventually become obsolete (abortion, protestant, Wicca, passages)

[Rodney12]

Religion will never be gone. Believing that we're all connected beyond both time and the material world are beliefs many people have. Science, by it's dictionary definition, only deals with the natural and what we can sense, not the supernatural like God. Science and religion are very different.

[MontanaGuy]

I think the main reason that religion could become obsolete is because we've had countless predictions of events that have never happened such as the second coming of Christ. Many people have talked about the fact that Israel became a nation over 50 years ago and this was a major prediction in the Bible that was supposed to have started a countdown to the end times. The problem with this scenario is that Israel became a nation in 1948 after the Second World War and so far Jesus hasn't returned. If everyone who was alive in 1948 finally dies off and Jesus still hasn't showed up isn't this going to be a problem for those who talk about the return of Jesus in this generation? I suspect that after the typical lifespans of human beings have passed since 1948 and Jesus still hasn't returned that we'll start to hear about new theories which will try to explain it.

[accelerator]

Originally Posted by ainulinale

Revelation is written in the apocalyptic genre which means the entire book is most likely very symbolic. Perhaps stars are representative of angels.

Having slept on it.. I finally figured out the meaning of the falling stars.. Eureka!

They symbolize.. false prophets.

I'm always happy when I can crack a puzzling saying.. :-)

Sorry.. I was exhausted last night.. so failed to notice the connection between.. the passage I pasted.. and the stars falling..

Which is this..

"So down the great dragon was hurled, the original serpent, the one called Devil and Satan, who is misleading the entire inhabited earth; he was hurled down to the earth, and his angels were hurled down with him."

Then it continues..

“..and its tail drags a third of the stars of heaven, and it hurled them down to the earth. And the dragon kept standing before the woman who was about to give birth, that, when she did give birth, it might devour her child.” - Revelation 12:1 - 4
----

Ok.. so.. angels are used to symbolize the prophets in general.. but the angels that were hurled down to earth were the false prophets who were deceiving the people.. so.. it would seem.. the stars do represent angels.. which.. in turn.. symbolize.. prophets.

Both.. those prophets who were respected.. and who were guiding the people wisely.. and those prophets (or leaders).. who by giving false teachings.. were leading the people astray.. these are the stars in the sky.. that guide us.. just as the "star" guided the wise men.

Anyway.. Isaiah explains this idea in Revelation.. concerning the destruction of the beast.. much more clearly.. than I can.

----
“The aged and highly respected one is the head, and the prophet giving false instruction is the tail. And those who are leading this people on prove to be the ones causing them to wander; and those of them who are being led on, the ones who are being confused.” - Isaiah 9:15
---

Which is still true.. down to this day..

False leaders are still causing us to be confused..

And we can detect this.. so it is science..:-)

Men like.. Gordon and George.. for example.

Yet.. doesn’t the scripture say:

“Neither be called 'leaders,' for your Leader is one, the Christ. But the greatest one among you must be your minister. Whoever exalts himself will be humbled, and whoever humbles himself will be exalted.” - Matthew 23:10

Which is the reason such “stars”.. (or false prophets),, need to be “trodden down”.

They promise us a material heaven..

While they.. themselves.. are creating hell on earth.

Jesus came to set us free from such slavery.. (slavery to their ideas).

And taught us to be slaves to love and righteousness instead.

Revelation is concerned with.. sedition.. and blasphemy..

Which is a dangerous game.. therefore.. it had to be encoded in symbolism.
-

[ainulinale]

Originally Posted by accelerator

Having slept on it.. I finally figured out the meaning of the falling stars.. Eureka!

They symbolize.. false prophets.

I'm always happy when I can crack a puzzling saying.. :-)

That's interesting, but what makes you think they're false prophets?

[ainulinale]

Originally Posted by MontanaGuy

I think the main reason that religion could become obsolete is because we've had countless predictions of events that have never happened such as the second coming of Christ. Many people have talked about the fact that Israel became a nation over 50 years ago and this was a major prediction in the Bible that was supposed to have started a countdown to the end times. The problem with this scenario is that Israel became a nation in 1948 after the Second World War and so far Jesus hasn't returned. If everyone who was alive in 1948 finally dies off and Jesus still hasn't showed up isn't this going to be a problem for those who talk about the return of Jesus in this generation? I suspect that after the typical lifespans of human beings have passed since 1948 and Jesus still hasn't returned that we'll start to hear about new theories which will try to explain it.

You know, not all Christian denominations believe the nation of Israel has anything to do with Christ's return. For instance, the Reformed (Presbyterian) churches could care less about Israel in relation to biblical prophecy.

[Marodi]

Originally Posted by MontanaGuy

I think the main reason that religion could become obsolete is because we've had countless predictions of events that have never happened such as the second coming of Christ. Many people have talked about the fact that Israel became a nation over 50 years ago and this was a major prediction in the Bible that was supposed to have started a countdown to the end times. The problem with this scenario is that Israel became a nation in 1948 after the Second World War and so far Jesus hasn't returned. If everyone who was alive in 1948 finally dies off and Jesus still hasn't showed up isn't this going to be a problem for those who talk about the return of Jesus in this generation? I suspect that after the typical lifespans of human beings have passed since 1948 and Jesus still hasn't returned that we'll start to hear about new theories which will try to explain it.

There have always been prophecies, since the death of jesus, that he was coming soon...


2000 years later nada.

[Alpha8207]

Originally Posted by MontanaGuy

If everyone who was alive in 1948 finally dies off and Jesus still hasn't showed up isn't this going to be a problem for those who talk about the return of Jesus in this generation?

Ya know, I'm not a real big 'end times' guy...there's too much to think about today with matters I can make a difference in than to concern myself with matters I have nothing to do with.

Having said that though, I'm pretty sure the generational quote your thinking of doesn't have anything to do with Israel.

Actually, I should qualify that and say that in the circles I've been in it doesn't have anything to do with Israel. I'm sure somewhere with someone it is tied to it. We have so many opinions on End Time matters there must be someone somewhere who actually does agree with your statement. Heck the JWs believe Jesus already returned!

[SixFive175]

When I was about 7 or 8, I noticed that a lot of neighbors had their radios on to a football game while they washed their cars. About then I also heard about people who just watched football all day on a Saturday.

I told myself, "This is just a fad. They'll tire of it in a year or two and football will become history". In later years, I noticed that just the same 5 or 6 teams always get to the championship.

Football wouldn't last. That was in 1955. I figured everyone would tire of football, say, by 1957 or 1958.

If I were 7 or 8 today, I'd be saying the same thing about March Madness. I've noticed that just the same 5 or 6 teams always make it to the top. Hmmm, let's see here: North Carolina, Duke, UCLA, Kansas, sometimes Connecticut or Indiana. One or two might change each year, but generally those teams are the ones you hear about.

Year after year. After year. After year.

So will religion last? Now that I'm older I understand. Something that's been around a few thousand years isn't likely to go away, at least in your lifetime, or the lifetime of your 7th or 77th lineage hence.

You may see no need for religion or have no interest. Fine. I could say the same thing about March Madness or Pro/College Football.

They're here to stay.

A personal aside: I don't go to church nor attend/watch TV sports, and for the same reason. I get bored at things that are fairly predictable.

[Tesaje]

Originally Posted by MontanaGuy

I think the main reason that religion could become obsolete is because we've had countless predictions of events that have never happened such as the second coming of Christ. Many people have talked about the fact that Israel became a nation over 50 years ago and this was a major prediction in the Bible that was supposed to have started a countdown to the end times. The problem with this scenario is that Israel became a nation in 1948 after the Second World War and so far Jesus hasn't returned. If everyone who was alive in 1948 finally dies off and Jesus still hasn't showed up isn't this going to be a problem for those who talk about the return of Jesus in this generation? I suspect that after the typical lifespans of human beings have passed since 1948 and Jesus still hasn't returned that we'll start to hear about new theories which will try to explain it.

But that presupposes that the super religious can think logically about their religion. Scam artists use this human trait to their benefit all the time.
It doesn't matter to some people how much evidence and logic you throw at them (as we see on this board all the time). I can only attribute it to it filling an emotional need, not a rational one.

The ones who decide to interpret it all as symbolic or occurring in some undetectable dimension can rectify it in a sort of logical manner because they get to believe in the writings (that somehow become actual just because they are old and authorities say they are) but sidestep the whole body of disproving evidence and logic.

[Alpha8207]

Originally Posted by Tesaje

But that presupposes that the super religious can think logically about their religion. Scam artists use this human trait to their benefit all the time.
It doesn't matter to some people how much evidence and logic you throw at them (as we see on this board all the time). I can only attribute it to it filling an emotional need, not a rational one.

The ones who decide to interpret it all as symbolic or occurring in some undetectable dimension can rectify it in a sort of logical manner because they get to believe in the writings (that somehow become actual just because they are old and authorities say they are) but sidestep the whole body of disproving evidence and logic.

And you guys say Christians are rude and condescending...LOL (I love that song by Cindi Lauper/Phil Collins etc.... 'True Colors')

I tend to think that the very fact so many people who are so adamantly against religion and can't stand even the thought of a God and/or being around that God's believers and are so willing to spend vast amounts of time trying to prove His non-existence by spending time with His believers tells me religion ain't going anywhere.

I love the glaring irony of this forum.