are UFOs and extraterestrials real? (agnostic, famous, secrets, casket)

[grumm0x]

Originally Posted by Campbell34

And until you can show me an alien that proclaims Jesus Christ as Lord, I will continue to believe that. And the Bible has instructed us that all people are evil, and we only rise above that evil when we accept Christ as our Lord and Saviour.

I'm not much worried.
If God is all-powerful, all-loving, seems like he would give those aliens a chance, same as everybody else.
So, while I don't happen to know any aliens (well, space aliens, anyway) personally, I figure there must be some who believe.
If there aren't, then what does that tell you about God?

[Campbell34]

Originally Posted by grumm0x

I'm not much worried.
If God is all-powerful, all-loving, seems like he would give those aliens a chance, same as everybody else.
So, while I don't happen to know any aliens (well, space aliens, anyway) personally, I figure there must be some who believe.
If there aren't, then what does that tell you about God?

God had already gave them a chance and they tried to over rule Him long ago. The only way they can hurt God now is by attacking His creation.

[gsoboi]

Originally Posted by Campbell34

God had already gave them a chance and they tried to over rule Him long ago. The only way they can hurt God now is by attacking His creation.

agreed. Because I do believe that fallen angels and aliens are the same beings. That is clear based on descriptions. Fallen Angels in the book of Noah were described as having skin as white as snow and white hair. Native American tribes a world away describe "star gods" coming from the skies with with very white skin and white hair and then we hear modern day extraterrestrial reports of "tall whites" with very white skin and white hair. Its no coincidence. Some extraterrestrials are described as looking reptilian almost like a snake. That sounds very similar to the "serpent" story in the Garden of Eden. So there could be something very sinister about the ETs which is why they may be hiding their presence from the general public and hiding thier agenda. Their agenda in the end times seems to be to deceive the world into thinking they created us and our religions so that many will lose their faith and not believe in God. We do know that the Bible talks of a "great deception" in the end times and that it will be a "strong illusion" that will deceive the very elect.

Bottom line according to the Bible, the fallen angels in the days of Noah were physical beings because in order to have offspring (Nephilim) with human women, these beings have to be physical in nature and not invisible spirits. The Bible says these fallen angels decended to earth. So if they were physical being and they decended to the earth, they didnt just fly down to earth without some sort of "aircraft". So in fact that shows clear evidence of extraterrestrials in the Bible. I think the church and many Christians are afraid to discuss the topic of the Nephilim in the Book of Genesis which is why you'll never hear a church sermon on the Nephilim. I told a friend, who is a religous christian about the Nephilim and she wasnt even aware of that in the book of Genesis.

Nephilim (mixed offspring of fallen angels and humans)

[northsider]

Originally Posted by Campbell34

Well all faiths counterdict each other, which should tell you that someone is not telling us the truth.

But surely none are actually lieing if they believe theirs is the truth?

So if you believe that all faiths can lie, and all faiths lead to the truth at the same time. Who is being deceived here? And are you saying that all liars are good?

I'm not saying anything.... I'm asking.

But so far have not received an answer from anyone who professes to know something of these 'aliens'.

[gsoboi]

Book of Genesis

6:1 And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them,

6:2 That the sons of God (angels) saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose.

6:3 And the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.

6:4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God (angels) came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.

6:5 And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

6:6 And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.

6:7 And the LORD said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.

6:8 But Noah found grace in the eyes of the LORD.

6:9 These are the generations of Noah: Noah was a just man and perfect in his generations, and Noah walked with God

"perfect in his generation" meaning he was perfect genetically because the only person that was perfect in not committing sin was Jesus. Noah's bloodline was not corrupt with the unholy union of the fallen angels and humans.


Book of Noah

65.1 And in those days, Noah saw the Earth had tilted and that its destruction was near.

65.2 And he set off from there and went to the ends of the Earth and cried out to his great-grandfather Enoch; and Noah said three times in a bitter voice: "Hear me, hear me, hear me!"

65.3 And he said to him: "Tell me, what is it that is being done on the Earth, that the Earth is so afflicted and shaken, lest I be destroyed with it!"

65.4 And immediately there was a great disturbance on the Earth and a voice was heard from Heaven and I fell upon my face.

65.5 And my great-grandfather Enoch came, stood by me, and said to me: "Why did you cry out to me, with such bitter crying and weeping?

65.6 And a command has gone out from the Lord against those who dwell upon the dry ground that this must be their end. For they have learnt all the secrets of the Angels, and all the wrongdoings of the satans, and all their secret power, and all the power of those who practice magic arts, and the power of enchantments, and the power of those who cast molten images for all the Earth.

65.7 And further, how silver is produced from the dust of the earth and how soft metal occurs on the earth.

65.8 For lead and tin are not produced from the earth, like the former; there is a spring which produces them, and an Angel who stands in it, and that Angel distributes them."

65.9 And after this, my great-grandfather Enoch took hold of me with his hand, and raised me, and said to me: "Go, for I have asked the Lord of Spirits about this disturbance on the earth."

65.10 And he said to me: "Because of their iniquity, their judgment has been completed, and they will no longer be counted before me; because of the sorceries they have searched out and learnt, the Earth and those who dwell upon it will be destroyed.

65.11 And for these, there will be no place of refuge, for ever, for they showed to them what is secret, and they have been condemned; but not so for you, my son; the Lord of Spirits knows that you are pure and innocent of this reproach concerning the secrets.
----------------------------------
More from the Book of Noah

1. And other forms I saw hidden in that place.

2. I heard the voice of the angel saying: 'These are the angels who descended to the earth, and revealed what was hidden to the children of men and seduced the children of men into committing sin.

And I, Enoch, answered and said unto him: 'The Lord will do a new thing on the earth, and this I have already seen in a vision, and make known to thee that in the generation of my father Jared some of the angels of heaven transgressed the word of the Lord. And behold they commit sin and transgress the law, and have united themselves with women and commit sin with them, and have married some of them, and have begot children by them. And they shall produce on the earth giants not according to the spirit, but according to the flesh, and there shall be a great punishment on the earth, and the earth shall be cleansed from all impurity. Yea, there shall come a great destruction over the whole earth, and there shall be a deluge and 16 a great destruction for one year. And this son who has been born unto you shall be left on the earth

[goldengrain]

People reportedly have seen human looking aliens, greys, guys like greys but green, reptilian things, insect looking things. All supposedly alien.

But the 'fallen' guys are only the ones who look the most like us?

I am not arguing that people ages ago saw things, interpreted them in their own way, and wrote that down. It does not mean that we should follow the values of old, agrarian, tribal societies. It does not mean that whatever they worshiped as god was really god. Even if they communicated with an unseen force that called itself 'god', they are not the only ones to do so. It does not make their observations accurate or true.
It does not make the thing that they call 'god' actually god.

We observe these books as we would any ancient tome written by earlier peoples, with an interest in observing the sort of life they led, the ideas that they had.

[Rathagos]

I'm going to try to put my opinion to the original question asked here since UFO's and Extraterrestrials can't be confirmed at all. The belief in this is as speculative as the belief in any religion (since there is no "firm" evidence sitting in a library, religious institute, or museum anywhere). And since this isn't about religion, I will leave all connotations towards that out.

And, first, let me say that I believe in the possibility for UFOs and possibly extraterrestrials to exist. Have I ever seen one? No, not me myself. Have I ever met one? No. But that doesn't change the prospect that we could have (or are) being visited. All allusions to anal probing, cattle mutilations and such are not what I'll be opining about.

My first thoughts regarding this all revolve around the Drake Equation formulated by Frank Drake in 1960. You can plug in whatever numbers you come up with... but if you come up with any number greater than zero, the possibility exists. As long as the possibility exists, we can't fully discount it.

Next, there are too many sightings from too many eras and civilizations to completely discount them. Many have been brought out here in this thread, so I'm not going to recount them all here. Suffice it to say it has happened that many references have been cited throughout recorded history. The thing I think we need to look at here is understanding. When looking at the quatrains from Michel De Nostradamus, there are many things in his writing that he saw that have been explained in current times that didn't even exist in his lifetime. That's not to say I agree with any or all his writings, but go on a leap of logic that if you were given sight to something possibly hundreds of years in the future, things we haven't even been able to conceptualize today, how would you describe it? So, hundreds of years ago when people saw "lights (or candles, or whatever) in the sky" they could have been more than comets or meteors.

People (even skeptics) admit (as a whole, not everyone) that if people are not from this world, they would have to be technologically advanced. If we took a car, plane, or other vehicle back to the Roman chariots, we would be technologically advanced. Not better, or worse, but advanced. The wide theory is that the more advanced a society (technologically) than they are, than more-than-likely they would be more advanced as a society. When Europeans first came over to the new lands, what killed the native Americans the most? I may be wrong about this, but I have read it was the diseases, viruses, and bacteria that the Europeans brought and were carried in the trade goods that were being traded to them.

Additionally, I hope we've learned as a human society that we just don't walk in on civilizations we aren't familiarized with. The Spanish did that with the Mayans (or was it Aztecs?), and essentially have been reported the cause for the loss of that civilization. If we can learn the lesson of observing from a distance, can't others (if there are others)?

There have been hints, allusions, etc. for far too long... from far too many.. for anyone to bury their head in the sand and say there's no possibility for intelligent, technologically-capable, space-faring extraterrestrial life out there. And to believe if there is, that our evolution over the last 1000 or more years wouldn't be of interest to them.

[gsoboi]

Originally Posted by Rathagos

I'm going to try to put my opinion to the original question asked here since UFO's and Extraterrestrials can't be confirmed at all. The belief in this is as speculative as the belief in any religion (since there is no "firm" evidence sitting in a library, religious institute, or museum anywhere). And since this isn't about religion, I will leave all connotations towards that out.

And, first, let me say that I believe in the possibility for UFOs and possibly extraterrestrials to exist. Have I ever seen one? No, not me myself. Have I ever met one? No. But that doesn't change the prospect that we could have (or are) being visited. All allusions to anal probing, cattle mutilations and such are not what I'll be opining about.

My first thoughts regarding this all revolve around the Drake Equation formulated by Frank Drake in 1960. You can plug in whatever numbers you come up with... but if you come up with any number greater than zero, the possibility exists. As long as the possibility exists, we can't fully discount it.

Next, there are too many sightings from too many eras and civilizations to completely discount them. Many have been brought out here in this thread, so I'm not going to recount them all here. Suffice it to say it has happened that many references have been cited throughout recorded history. The thing I think we need to look at here is understanding. When looking at the quatrains from Michel De Nostradamus, there are many things in his writing that he saw that have been explained in current times that didn't even exist in his lifetime. That's not to say I agree with any or all his writings, but go on a leap of logic that if you were given sight to something possibly hundreds of years in the future, things we haven't even been able to conceptualize today, how would you describe it? So, hundreds of years ago when people saw "lights (or candles, or whatever) in the sky" they could have been more than comets or meteors.

People (even skeptics) admit (as a whole, not everyone) that if people are not from this world, they would have to be technologically advanced. If we took a car, plane, or other vehicle back to the Roman chariots, we would be technologically advanced. Not better, or worse, but advanced. The wide theory is that the more advanced a society (technologically) than they are, than more-than-likely they would be more advanced as a society. When Europeans first came over to the new lands, what killed the native Americans the most? I may be wrong about this, but I have read it was the diseases, viruses, and bacteria that the Europeans brought and were carried in the trade goods that were being traded to them.

Additionally, I hope we've learned as a human society that we just don't walk in on civilizations we aren't familiarized with. The Spanish did that with the Mayans (or was it Aztecs?), and essentially have been reported the cause for the loss of that civilization. If we can learn the lesson of observing from a distance, can't others (if there are others)?

There have been hints, allusions, etc. for far too long... from far too many.. for anyone to bury their head in the sand and say there's no possibility for intelligent, technologically-capable, space-faring extraterrestrial life out there. And to believe if there is, that our evolution over the last 1000 or more years wouldn't be of interest to them.

The problem is that people seperate the UFO phenomina from religion when it fact the two are married together. When you read the ancient text, you can begin to solve some of these big UFO mysteries. But in the science world, the Bible is not proof even though the Bible tells of things that actualy happened. Now either the ancients mistook aliens for fallen angels are we are mistaken fallen angels for aliens. Truth of the matter, they are the same.

In the Book of Noah it says this:

65.6 And a command has gone out from the Lord against those who dwell upon the dry ground that this must be their end. For they have learnt all the secrets of the Angels, and all the wrongdoings of the satans, and all their secret power, and all the power of those who practice magic arts, and the power of enchantments, and the power of those who cast molten images for all the Earth

Could it be that today we are learning the fallen angels (aliens) secret powers and enchantments through technology? The kind of Technology thats being tested at facilities like Area 51 and are being used for war purposes? We are learning the secret power of gravity and energy from them. The Book of Enoch says the fallen angels taught man how to make weapons before the time of Noah. It seems they are still teaching us how to make weapons. The aliens that are helping man with todays technology are described as being "tall white humanoids" with "white" hair (the little greys are the helpers). The Book of Noah describes the fallen angels and being "white as snow" and having "white hair". I dont think its a coincidence.

[gsoboi]

Ancient deity Baal (Satan) was lord of war and of the sky. Many titles were given to Baal by adding endings to his name. Some examples found in scripture are Baalhazor "Lord of the Fortresses", Baalbamoth = Lord of the high places, Baalzebub = Lord of those who fly, or, flit. Flit means: A fluttering or darting movement or to move quickly from one location to another. Sounds like the description of a UFO! Zebub is a Hebrew verb which means to flit from place to place , having been popularly translated as "Lord of the Flies" it is more properly rendered "Lord of Those Things that Fly". Baal is identified as Satan by Jesus himself, Matt.10:25 Mark. 3:22 Luke 11:15. Paul says we wrestle not with flesh and blood, but with principalities and powers, with spirits in high places, literally, "in the heavens" "in the aerial regions" Eph.6:12. Hence Satan is called "the prince of the Power of the Air" "the prince of the aerial host" Eph.2:2. Imagine the confederation of rebellious angels seated in the atmospheric heaven in the spaces above and around our planet. This fundamental of scripture contradicts many traditional concepts of "hell" as the domain of the devil and his minions... the popular notion of "satan ruling the underworld" is not found in the Bible. King David realized the "sons of the mighty" inhabited the sky:

For who in the sky (the atmosphere),
shall be ranked with Jehovah,
who among the sons of the mighty
is like Jehovah? Psalm 89:6

So you see most of these aliens are nothing more than Satan's rebellious angels. Its not a coincidence that Satan appeared as a serpant to Eve and that many extraterrestrials seem to be "reptilian" in nature. Aliens and the "fallen ones" are both the same. The ancient Summerian gods were called the Anunaki which means "those who from heaven came to earth". The Anunaki are the same as the fallen angels which are the same as the aliens.

There is also talk of "The Watchers" in the Bible. Certainly the modern day ETs seem to be watchers because they watch what we are doing but dont interfer or let mankind known of their existance.

"Behold a watcher and a holy one came down from heaven." -- Daniel 4:13

[gsoboi]

The case was blown off of Roswell, NM for a short time when the army put out a press release that it captured a flying saucer. But something happened. The governement found out what these "flying saucers" were and who occupied them. They quickly found out some "startling things" that would panic the world and upset the social, economic and religious institutions so they quickly changed the story to a weather balloon. Today the government admits that Roswell was a cover-up but they said they were covering up the top secret weather balloon project called "Project Mogul" Project Mogul was indeed a real project that took place in the vicinity but thats not what crashed in Roswell. Here is my question. If what crashed in Roswell was a HIGHLY top secret Project Mogul, why attract attention to it saying it was a flying saucer? further more why change the story to a weather balloon which exactly what Project Mogul was? It was documented on record that it took several planes to transport the debris to Texas. Why did it takes several planes to transport a top secret weather balloon?

Also keep in mind, the project Mogul weather balloon itself was not top secret, it was the operation that was secret. So why then did the army treat the debre with such a top secret nature threatening the lives of Roswell citizens if they said anything? Today's government explanation doesnt add up which prooves they are still hiding Roswell. Witness claimed they saw bodies. The governments explainations was that they dropped dummies from weather balloons. Then it was brought to the attention of the government that they didnt drop dummies until 1953. The Roswell event happened in 1947. The government thens said that people had fading memories and that they were confusing mutilple events over a period of years. What a rediculous explaination. Another thing. Since the government said it was Project Mogul, why did it take till the late 1990s for the government to say the Roswell event was Project Mogul? Project Mogul had been declassified more than 20 years earlier.

The governments explainations are so lame and unbelievable and it proves they are STILL lying about what happened in Roswell. There are just too many holes in the latest governements explainations.