Intelligent Design? (America, faith, Christian, verse)

[MontanaGuy]

kdbrich wrote:

And God is going to be glorified by you being punished for your choice.

That would be a very sadistic God who felt glorified by tormenting those who didn't believe in him for eternity.

[kdbrich]

Originally Posted by Bluefly

My point is that you do not know and I do not know.

But you know for sure that we don't know? Do you not see the contradiction in that statement?

There are some things we can know. Why would God not want his people to know his truth? To use your line: "Come down off your perch and humble yourself and you might learn."


The post-modernism drives me nuts.

[Bluefly]

Originally Posted by kdbrich

But you know for sure that we don't know? Do you not see the contradiction in that statement?

There are some things we can know. Why would God not want his people to know his truth? Come down off your perch and humble yourself and you might learn.

You can learn his truth - or at least enough of it to get the general idea. Problem is, when you do learn that you will learn that there is no judgment. There is no selecting these people and pushing the rest aside.

That is a pretty insecure petty bronze-age dictator you've concocted for yourself. Certainly not worthy of the name God. What God would demand to be worshiped "or else"? Insecurity.

Anyway, we're awakening to a new conception of God. An awareness that there's nothing above judging, but an awareness of the force of life that permeates all.

From that perspective - when you start to awaken to that reality - you realize just how little any of us really know. But you can only get there if you (say it with me now):

Humble yourself before your Lord. There is much we do not know.

[Lamplight]

Originally Posted by kdbrich

Why would God not want his people to know his truth?

I'd like to know that myself. It seems everyone interprets God's word very differently. Doesn't seem like a good way to let his people know what he wants.

[Fullback32]

So, if there is a man, say Jewish, who lives a virtuous, servers Yahweh with all his heart and dies, he will go to the mythical hell? So much for being Chosen. This makes no sense.

Have you heard about the 11 months of purification (Jewish belief) which predates Christian belief? How did things change?

[rifleman]

So.. what I see here, if I shift gears for a moment and qwell my naturally curious, rational and questioning mind, is: Intelligent Design has produced countless millions of badly done organisms, most now extinct, but also including us (lower back pain, poor pelvic design for continuous upright walking, oh h$ll; too numerous to list for now). Oddly, those same designs are existant in earlier designs, but they perambulate far differently, eat and live quite differently, and those designs fit them so much better. By thd chance evolution of our abstract-capable brains, wse've bypassed the slower evolution of our physical "design", to our endless misery.

But then, we supposedly have a Designer-Creator who can't stop Himself from creating a species whose sole purpose, according to many here, is simply to work to endlessly glorify this God with a universe-sized egotistical need for that glorification. But if you don't pander to Him, He'll happily punish you by tossing you into a burning pit of hell.

All sounds reasonable to me.... if you're writing for Comedy Central.

[ptsum]

Hey guys,how about both you come down off your perch before one of your falls off and somebody gets hurt. I don't think it's designed to hold both of you at the same time and the intelligent thing to do would be to come down here on solid ground with the rest of us....

[kdbrich]

Originally Posted by Bluefly

You can learn his truth - or at least enough of it to get the general idea. Problem is, when you do learn that you will learn that there is no judgment. There is no selecting these people and pushing the rest aside.

That is a pretty insecure petty bronze-age dictator you've concocted for yourself. Certainly not worthy of the name God. What God would demand to be worshiped "or else"? Insecurity.

Anyway, we're awakening to a new conception of God. An awareness that there's nothing above judging, but an awareness of the force of life that permeates all.

From that perspective - when you start to awaken to that reality - you realize just how little any of us really know. But you can only get there if you (say it with me now):

Humble yourself before your Lord. There is much we do not know.

Honestly...your post-modern attitude of no one can know for sure is maddening. Your "new concepts" of God is just rehashed heresy that's been around for thousands of years.

Just read the Bible. It's that simple.

Originally Posted by ptsum

Hey guys,how about both you come down off your perch before one of your falls off and somebody gets hurt. I don't think it's designed to hold both of you at the same time and the intelligent thing to do would be to come down here on solid ground with the rest of us....

I saw your post just after I posted my last one.

Good enough....we're not going to accomplish much more here, I don' think.

[Bluefly]

Originally Posted by kdbrich

Honestly...your post-modern attitude of no one can know for sure is maddening. Your "new concepts" of God is just rehashed heresy that's been around for thousands of years.

Just read the Bible. It's that simple.

I could see how it could be maddening to someone who actually thinks we can know truth from this perspective. I would liken my humbleness in asserting absolute truth to that of a quantum physicist or a string theory researcher.

They are dabbling in concepts that have the potential to unlock VAST realms of reality we cannot even grasp with our logical minds: parallel universes, the lack of cause and effect on a quantum level. It's very humbling when you begin to uncover how the universe really works. That is not in the Bible.

What I speak most certainly is ancient - it's the oldest wisdom humanity has ever known. It's the wisdom that courses through all spiritual and scientific traditions. Just got lost in the mytho-rational structures that emerged when empire marched in lock step with missionaries.

It is the simple fact of all life:


All is One.

[MrBlueSky_]

Originally Posted by kdbrich

Ultimately it brings him glory when he shows mercy by saving us...or it shows his holiness when he casts the rest into the fire.

No, actually it shows what an arrogant prick he is, that he has the gall to say we need to be saved from an absurd situation HE setup in the first place.

You've got a choice which side you wind up on.

There is no choice when you have a gun to your head..