abstinence education (contradiction, morality, moral, difference)

[arguy1973]

gee i know i shuddnt even write on here, already feel the flaming going on.. .but..Im not old to forget how being a teenager is, raging hormones, "crazy in love" feelings. The old "just dont do it' doesnt work for the most part, Do i beleive you should wait till marriage, yes do most people? no, no and no. I think parents need to be straight with their kids, tell them all they need to know. Mine were very conservative, told me they had rather me wait, but knew i prob wouldnt, did I think it was wrong at 16, or 17..yes. But its easy to forget wrong and right in that split second if u and ur GF are kissing or whatever. IMO parents need to teach their kids everything they need to know, wrong and right and how to make responsible decisions. Ive worked with teens and kids for a long time, and I make this observation, sometimes the more you try keep kids from doing something the more likely they are gonna be to do it. Imo

[alicenevada]

Originally Posted by arguy1973

gee i know i shuddnt even write on here, already feel the flaming going on.. .but..Im not old to forget how being a teenager is, raging hormones, "crazy in love" feelings. The old "just dont do it' doesnt work for the most part, Do i beleive you should wait till marriage, yes do most people? no, no and no. I think parents need to be straight with their kids, tell them all they need to know. Mine were very conservative, told me they had rather me wait, but knew i prob wouldnt, did I think it was wrong at 16, or 17..yes. But its easy to forget wrong and right in that split second if u and ur GF are kissing or whatever. IMO parents need to teach their kids everything they need to know, wrong and right and how to make responsible decisions. Ive worked with teens and kids for a long time, and I make this observation, sometimes the more you try keep kids from doing something the more likely they are gonna be to do it. Imo

Well, my parents didnt just tell me it was wrong, like I said. They set an example for me with their constant bible study and their love for God. But they also encouraged me to avoid 'dating' until I was old enough for marriage, being alone w/ the opposite sex, viewing entertainment that promoted a lighthearted view of fornication, or pursuing association w/ people who didnt share my values. Those things, coupled w/ my own love for God prevented me from ever considering a sexual relationship with anyone.

[arguy1973]

Originally Posted by alicenavada

Well, my parents didnt just tell me it was wrong, like I said. They set an example for me with their constant bible study and their love for God. But they also encouraged me to avoid 'dating' until I was old enough for marriage, being alone w/ the opposite sex, viewing entertainment that promoted a lighthearted view of fornication, or pursuing association w/ people who didnt share my values. Those things, coupled w/ my own love for God prevented me from ever considering a sexual relationship with anyone.

My parents set an example too, but I forgot alot when I saw the HS cheerleaders-lol. In my area we started dating at 15 or so, and sometimes even used going to church as an excuse to sneak out, I dont condone it now, but kids are gonna be kids.

[alicenevada]

Originally Posted by arguy1973

My parents set an example too, but I forgot alot when I saw the HS cheerleaders-lol. In my area we started dating at 15 or so, and sometimes even used going to church as an excuse to sneak out, I dont condone it now, but kids are gonna be kids.

Define-'kids'. LOL

I was just relating all that to show that it is possible for kids to stand by their convictions, despite all the temptations out there.

[arguy1973]

Originally Posted by alicenavada

Define-'kids'. LOL

I was just relating all that to show that it is possible for kids to stand by their convictions, despite all the temptations out there.

yes it is possible, I knew some that did it, and I respect them for it, even wish I would have done the same thing. Kids 15-65-lol

[alicenevada]

'Kids'= all those 'young at heart', like Frank Sinatra said. I walked down the aisle to that song at my wedding. LOL (Of course, I was 19 so I actually was actually young, not just 'at heart').

[arguy1973]

Originally Posted by alicenavada

'Kids'= all those 'young at heart', like Frank Sinatra said. I walked down the aisle to that song at my wedding. LOL (Of course, I was 19 so I actually was actually young, not just 'at heart').

i was 21 when I got married, so same for me

[brittZ]

Originally Posted by stretch00

Hmm. Go to bed and the thread carries on without you.

Gizmo, thank you for articulately stating my position.

NvXplorer. Absolutely. Biology is a separate thing from the way we run our modern society.

Dawn, no, I do not have a teenage daughter, but that is beside the point. I will even concede that when I do have a teenage daughter, I may find it emotionally distasteful as she heads off on a Friday night with her bf and a pack of condoms. My emotional discomfort with a thing does not necessarily mean that I should oppose it.

For the record, I said:

I think that most people should wait to have sex until their mid to late teens, but should receive support to wait longer if they so choose.

Everybody now seems to think that I am sending 15 year old girls onto the streets in a teddy clutching a condom. Read it again people. Mid to late. That means 16, 17, 18 or 19. Conceivably 15, sure, but on the young end of a spectrum.

And yes, I think that people SHOULD engage in sexual activity, and I think that they SHOULD start as teenagers. At an age appropriate to them. I think that sex is not restricted to marriage, although I personally am unwaveringly monogamous.

Sure, there are risks associated with sex. But there are risks associated with riding motorbikes, playing football, cheerleading and eating fatty foods. It is about being informed, making good decisions, and being supported in that.

Let me ask another question. Lets assume that I do have a 16 year old daughter. And Dawn has a 16 year old daughter. I have been open with my daughter, told her that sex will happen for her when she wants, with the guy she wants, I set up an annual ob-gyn appt with a doctor for her, and she knows that I have put 1000 condoms in a desk drawer and never count them.

Dawn (if I may presume, I am only telling a tale here) has told her daughter that there should be no sex before marriage, it is a sin, she will get an STD and be scarred for life.

Both girls have aggressive boyfriends.

Who is more likely to have protected sex?

If your daughter has a boyfriend that is sexually aggressive you have a responsibility to intervene for the safety of your child. I truly cannot believe what I am hearing from you stretch. We have had disagreements and debates in the past but this viewpoint is pathetic. It speaks of absolute apathy. A 1000 condoms - you're telling her to have sex with as many people as often as she can. Her boyfriend is sexually aggressive - youre telling her to give in and give him what he wants. Physical urges - youre telling her she doesnt have the ability or will power to control herself.

I wonder how the notion of teenage sexual activity, pregnancy, and disease fits into your utilitarian morality. Where is the greater good and the least harm? A teenage daughter who's life is ruined because she has a child or some horrible disease, or a little effort as a parent to do the best you can to make sure your daughter doesn't jump into something she isnt emotionally, physically, or financially ready for.

If you think teens are ready for sex, go spend time in a teen aids house, go spend a few hours with a boy whose genitals are essentially useless because he got sick and was to embarrased to tell anyone that he had a serious infection, go spend time with a pregnant teen and talk to her about the opportunities she has lost in life.

[irishmom]

Originally Posted by weatherologist

OK, this one came from another thread. It was mentioned in this thread that Christians try to force their ideas/views/ideologies (I don't remember the exact quote) on others. One of these views being abstinence education.

I'm sorry, is the idea that we should teach our children to abstain from sexual intercourse until marriage only a Christian view? I'm at a lose with this one and the problem is that my hubby is yelling at me to go to bed. So if there is any discussion on this subject, I'll have to check back in the morning.

Thanks everyone. Have a great evening.

God bless us all...

Weather...

I think all parents of any faith or non faith should teach their children to abstain from sex until marriage. But while doing that they should also teach and prepare them about what to do if they choose to have sex. So yes I think they should be taught to abstain and then handed a box of condoms.

[midnightbirdgirl]

Originally Posted by nvxplorer

Saying that fifteen year olds aren't ready to have sex is denying human biology and ignoring history.

Fifteen year olds are not only "designed" (by the Christian God, to many here) to have sex, but they are designed to bear and raise children.

What fifteen year olds are not ready for is responsibility in an industrialized society, but this has absolutely nothing to do with sex. (Indeed, it is the pressures of modern first world life that have imposed an artificial barrier to teens. No wonder they are so confused.)

A simple gaze into the (not so distant) past or a look-see at present day agricultural societies will show that teens have been raising families since the dawn of man.

Are they responsible enough to have a child or to protect themselves? If not they are not ready, no matter what the biology is.
Teens used to raise families in a completely different world, they actually were considered adults, and worked the fields and hunted, do they do that now? TODAY if a teen has a baby, they go on welfare and expect Grammy to raise their child. That is reality. That is why so many children are born out of wedlock, have very little chance for a future, have brothers and sisters from several different fathers and stay in poverty... what a great idea that is, so why don't we encourage teen sex?
MBG