abstinence education (Jehovah's Witnesses, divorce, marriages, Catholic)

[midnightbirdgirl]

Originally Posted by nvxplorer

Using a condom is a trivial chore, so yes, they are capable of protecting themselves.

So, is taking out the trash, but many neglect to do it..

Yes, this is the point. Just because modern society has changed doesn't mean human biology has changed. That is the problem.

So, you can't teach them self control?

That's an economic issue that has nothing to do with the human sex drive.

It has everything to do with it. Society as a whole is effected because some people cannot control their urges. Having an urge, does not make one do an act, people can control their urges.

Perhaps it isn't sex that is sinful but the requirements of modern industrialized nations? Furthermore, only poor teen mothers go on welfare

. That is where the majority of teen pregnancies come from.

Those from wealthy families do not. What does this tell you about sin? Apparently, God prefers those with money.

And I am sarcastic?? Teens from Middle class and wealthy families collect welfare too, because it is available to all...



Your sarcasm misses a very important fact of life: No one needs to encourage teens to have sex.

M

y advice is different: Why don't we wake up and smell the coffee!

Yeah, just realize we have no control over our kids and they should be allowed to do whatever they want? No boundaries no guidance, just a packet of pills and a box of condoms and send them into the world. Okay, with you?
Funny, all Christians here seemed to have no problem with teaching BOTH, but non-Christians hate the idea of even mentioning abstinence.
MBG

[brittZ]

Originally Posted by arguy1973

Im all for waiting and abstinence but the facts are teens are going to have sex. Most of them, the ones that decide to wait are often shunned, made fun of, or made to feel like an outcast, and most, not all, give in. I want my children to be able to tell me anything and everything, Id rather have a child having protected sex than having sex unprotected cause no matter how much I could rant and rave and object if they want to do it, they are gonna do it. Just here in my town a couple got caught in the bathroom at a gas station.

So was Christ. Teens will continue to have sex as long as we continue to say that it is inevitable for them not to. Sure, we may have made mistakes but it is our responsibility to teach kids from our mistakes. I agree with you that kids need to feel like they can come to you for anything and not hide. However, if we continue to take the attitude (not that this is what you would do arguy) of, "well your gonna do it anyway, so heres a condom." then we can only expect our kids to do it.

People want to know why Christians want their values placed in society, this subject is no better example. Here we have a very clear command on sex from God, we know what it is for, who it is for, what it is not, and who it is not meant for. Popular society and people like stretch say the exact opposite and tell kids go have sex, have fun, do it, enjoy yourselves. This is a horrible secular moral that is being pushed into society to the point where many Christians take a defeatist attitude and hand out condoms. Christians have a responsibility to push back and say, "No, this is not right and I wont allow it."

[Virote]

I think the trouble is that they're not teaching other things. Try to get them to abstain, but at least educate them for the highly likely chance that most are going to disobey societies wishes. Abstinence education is a joke at my school.

[arguy1973]

Originally Posted by brittZ

So was Christ. Teens will continue to have sex as long as we continue to say that it is inevitable for them not to. Sure, we may have made mistakes but it is our responsibility to teach kids from our mistakes. I agree with you that kids need to feel like they can come to you for anything and not hide. However, if we continue to take the attitude (not that this is what you would do arguy) of, "well your gonna do it anyway, so heres a condom." then we can only expect our kids to do it.

People want to know why Christians want their values placed in society, this subject is no better example. Here we have a very clear command on sex from God, we know what it is for, who it is for, what it is not, and who it is not meant for. Popular society and people like stretch say the exact opposite and tell kids go have sex, have fun, do it, enjoy yourselves. This is a horrible secular moral that is being pushed into society to the point where many Christians take a defeatist attitude and hand out condoms. Christians have a responsibility to push back and say, "No, this is not right and I wont allow it."

I think the point I was trying to make is that, Yes I believe its wrong, yes there is a clear command from God that I believe to be true, no I dont want my kids to have sex before marriage, but if they want to do it, theres nothing I can do to stop if, so instead of teaching abstinence only, they should know what going on and be informed on protection etc, cause if I dont teach them about it, they are gonna hear about it from someone else and since I dont know that someone else, Id rather it be me.

[midnightbirdgirl]

Originally Posted by irishmom

Hmmm, I've never been called a liberal before, interesting. Well then I suggest you move or lock your kids up until they are adults, because that would be the only way to "protect" them from society and the real world. Not a very realistic plan. So I think I'll stick with my plan of educating them on all options and hope they make the right choices but if they don't I'll be there to help them figure out what to do next also.

You can control and protect your children without locking them up... and advice for you is something I will not heed, thanks just the same
Never said we should not educate, I just believe we need to give them guidance, and boundaries, something some posters here are against. And after all your posts, I am surprised you don't identify yourself as being a liberal
My child will live in this world by not be of it as Christians we are to me set apart.
No one is too weak to learn to follow God. And be expected to live for Him. Christ gives strength to all who call on Him. I expect more from my kid than to be like those without God. Christians need to act differently than those who are not. Fornicating is sin, and I teach it as such. If you don't like that, argue with God, who authored the Book.


MBG

[irishmom]

Originally Posted by midnightbirdgirl

You can control you children without locking them up... and advice for you is something I will not heed, thanks just the same
Never said we should not educate, I just believe we need to give them guidance, and boundaries, something some posters here are against. And after all your posts, I am surprised you don't identify yourself as being a liberal

MBG

I never said not to set boundaries, but to expect that they will follow them when they are out there on their own is just foolish. I think it's more important to equip them with tools and knowledge along with what you expect them to do.
I guess I identify Liberal as way extreme left wing, which I'm not so no I have never thought I was. You are really the first person to say that to me...I thought I was just being reasonable not liberal...LOL

[Cattknap]

I have 3 sons - two were virgins when they were married - they were taught by parents and church to abstain from sex until marriage - two of them listened - the other one had one slip and has abstained since then. I feel truly sorry for those here who feel that humans are nothing more than animals ruled by animal instincts and have no control over themselves. I think this lack of fortitude probably is reflected on other aspects of their lives as well.

[brittZ]

Originally Posted by arguy1973

I think the point I was trying to make is that, Yes I believe its wrong, yes there is a clear command from God that I believe to be true, no I dont want my kids to have sex before marriage, but if they want to do it, theres nothing I can do to stop if, so instead of teaching abstinence only, they should know what going on and be informed on protection etc, cause if I dont teach them about it, they are gonna hear about it from someone else and since I dont know that someone else, Id rather it be me.

I think the only thing we really differ on is that there is nothing that can be done to stop it and that difference causes a change in how it is approached.

[irishmom]

Originally Posted by midnightbirdgirl

Really??? Sad you think that. Values are not easily dismissed.
MBG

Oh but you are wrong here. Values can be taught, but they can not become one with someone until they experience life for themselves. Through their own experiences one develops their own morals and values, sometimes they line up with the ones taught by their parents and sometimes they just don't. Irregardless of what the parents want them to do, teens will eventually need to go out on their own and make their own decisions. Developmentally it is the teen years when they are drawn to distance themselves from their parents and align with peers and seek out their own identities. So hopefully what you taught them will become part of their thoughts, but there is no guarentee that experimenting with the opposite of what you taught them will happen. This is the reality of the situation. To think otherwise is just impractical and foolish.

[arguy1973]

Originally Posted by brittZ

I think the only thing we really differ on is that there is nothing that can be done to stop it and that difference causes a change in how it is approached.

I think you are right, I have two daughters and Im trying my best to post (write) how I will handle/ address things in the future if I do indeed find out anything is happning with a bf....trying my best not to think shovel and a 6 foot hole j/k so dont delete me, The thing I guess that it scary as a parent is that by 5th grade, they already know almost as much as I do, just from older kids, school, and tv, mags etc.