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Describe it to our silly human (non-god) brains? Below you say our race is dead... so we can't make heads or tails of it until God wills... but then God doesn't will anyone to life until they understand... I don't know where you think this is in scripture.... but O well.
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The sinner chosen to NOT be a part of the NEW CREATION.
Think parallel universe with a different set of laws, physics, etc.
Have you ever read of the multiple string theory fiasco?
I have read it. I have no problem with parallel universes... I have a problem with finicky gods. Tell me straight out WHO Christ was supposed to save....
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Because our race, is already dead because of Adam.
mmmmhmmmm... so the dead can understand god enough to make a choice NOT to be part of this new creation? Did dead adams make the creation new or God? Doesn't he make ALL THINGS new? or just the ones you think should be new?
Tell me straight out WHO Christ was supposed to save....
On hearing this, Jesus said to them, "It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick. I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners."
Orthodox christianity believes that he came to call the righteous , they will flat out deny it , but their confession proves they do .
They on the one hand tells us there is none that are righteous and in the next breathe they believe they are righteous enough to make a quality decision to believe in Jesus.
The only way a man can come to God is by God regenerateing that man in order that he believe...No one seeks after God, He says that Himself...So, if no one seeks after Him then that means there must be a devine intervention from God...
To the contrary. To say that a person must be born again so that he may bellieve is putting the cart before the horse. One must first believe so that he can be born again or regenerated
Acts 16:30 'and after he brought them out, he said, ''Sirs, what must I do to be saved?'' [31] And they said, ''Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you shall be saved...''
Regeneration is the result of having believed. Not the cause. The call of God is issued through the Gospel. 2 Thess 2:14 ''And it was for this He called you through our Gospel, that you may gain the glory of our Lord.
John 6:44 ''No one can come to Me, unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up on the last day. John 6:44 is then immediately explained by John 6:45. ''It is written in the prophets, 'AND THEY SHALL ALL BE TAUGHT OF GOD.' Everyone who has heard and learned from the Father, comes to Me.
Heard - learned - comes.
God has placed within man an emptyness that can only be fulfilled by Him. God has made Himself known through His creation, and more specifically through the Gospel. Man is spiritually dead and therefore cannot understand spiritual phenomenon. The Gospel is spiritual phenomenon. Therefore, the Holy Spirit in His ministry of common grace makes the Gospel understandable to the spiritually dead unbeliever. The hearer of the Gospel, having understood the issue, must then make a decision to either obey the Gospel by believing in Christ for salvation, or disobeying the Gospel by rejecting Jesus Christ as Savior. If the hearer of the Gospel, upon understanding it, decides to place his faith in Christ for salvation, then the Holy Spirit at that point makes the faith of the hearer efficacious. He carries the faith of the spiritually dead hearer to the point of salvation. The Holy Spirit makes that person's faith effective for salvation.
Jesus told Nicodemous that he must be born again (John 3:1-21). And so that Nicodemous could understand the issue so that he could be born again or regenerated, Jesus gave the Gospel message to him.
The very purpose of the Gospel message is so that the hearer can understand the issue in order that he might be born again or regenerated through faith in Christ.
The Gospel message is first heard. Then the Holy Spirit makes the Gospel message perspicacious to the hearer. The hearer then considers the facts and either says 'yes' or 'no' to the Gospel call. If he says 'yes', then he is born again or regenerated.
Titus 3:5 He saved us, not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness, but according to His mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewing by the Holy Spirit
The Gospel message presents the issue involved in salvation. This allows the hearer to make a choice. If his choice is to receive Jesus Christ as Savior, then the Holy Spirit regenerates that person meaning that he is born again.
The Gospel message reveals what Christ did on behalf of man. It lays out the issue. As a result of a positive response to the Gospel, the Holy Spirit then does His part in salvation which is to carry the faith of the hearer to the point of salvation.
Faith precedes salvation.
(If) The Gospel message prompts a positive faith response, then he is regenerated. He is born again as a result of having believed in Christ for salvation.
Mike tell me this , how does believing make you born again ? . We never made a decision in our natural birth so how can this be possible in regards to spiritual birth ?
I actually think you have the cart before the horse .
Mike tell me this , how does believing make you born again ? . We never made a decision in our natural birth so how can this be possible in regards to spiritual birth ?
I actually think you have the cart before the horse .
If you will not believe passages such as Acts 16:31, or John 3:16, or John 3:36, or John 8:24, then I shall not waste my time trying to explain it to you.
If you will not believe passages such as Acts 16:31, or John 3:16, or John 3:36, or John 8:24, then I shall not waste my time trying to explain it to you.
I actually believe all the above passages just not orthodox christianty's take on them.
Do you really believe that the jailers decision to believe was a spur of the moment decision ? .
When i believed it was because He brought me to it, after doing something inside me throughout my whole life , regarding times , locations and circumstances.
You also seem that you are an intelligent guy , yet you haven't answered my question regarding how if you never had any say in your natural birth how can you with your spiritual birth . All you did was quote scripture at me.
Describe it to our silly human (non-god) brains? Below you say our race is dead... so we can't make heads or tails of it until God wills... but then God doesn't will anyone to life until they understand... I don't know where you think this is in scripture.... but O well.
It is everywhere....God draws, for His good work, whom He chooses.
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I have read it. I have no problem with parallel universes... I have a problem with finicky gods. Tell me straight out WHO Christ was supposed to save....
The man/woman that loves Him and He saved them from the power of death.
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mmmmhmmmm... so the dead can understand god enough to make a choice NOT to be part of this new creation?
The man/woman is chosed to be part of that new creation.
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Did dead adams make the creation new or God?
God ...of course!
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Doesn't he make ALL THINGS new? or just the ones you think should be new?
God says He chooses and draws...so there is your answer.
All of this is in the scriptures...and have been discussed on several occasions here at CD...at least while I have been here.
What other way should I use? Do you think like a god?
The fact is some think Christ only died to save the righteous when clearly the bible states he came to save the sinner. So if the sinner is the only one left out... seems awful fishy.
If no one can please God... why are some punished for not pleasing him?
I cannot explain to you why i know these things and why i look at God in His way instead of my own way...it just is the way it is...you would argue it anyway...so it is pointless...
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