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Obviously you are just choosing to ignore the truth, they are finding links to genetics, if there was no links they wouldn't be finding it. Believe in what you want if it makes you feel better about it. I have gay friends, I will go with their thoughts and feelings long before someone that just denies the connection for whatever reason.
You say it is a CHOICE to be gay or not, when did you CHOOSE to be what you are? Simple question.
A straight person does not BECOME gay, they were always gay, just living a lie to appease the bigots.
Im just choosing to acknowledge the truth that you, I or anyone else can be whatever we want in life...its up to the individual to decide what they want to make of their lives. Im simply saying that that article essentially reiterated what most people have always known: a variety of genes, environmental factors and life experiences shape a person's disposition.
It effectively said so in this statement: "Most researchers now think that there is no single gay gene that controls whether a person is homosexual or not. Rather, it's the influence of multiple genes, combined with environmental influences, which ultimately determine whether a person is gay." - *they forgot to say: "...or straight" - that is, if it is a universal truth that genes are responsible for determining sexuality.
Even skin color, which is concretely determined by an identifiable set of genes isnt a determinant of a person's behavior or inclinations...rather the culture they are born into determine such. And the difference between skin genetics and any implication of sexual genetics, is that skin genetics are adaptive...genes that determine skin color mutate and successfully adapt to suit the climate/environment in which they are located. How would genes that determine sexuality adapt to their environment to advance the species?...would they mutate into straight genes somewhere along the evolutionary process?..
My simple answer to your question is that I choose what I want to do with my life each day I wake up. Life isnt one big life or death decision to commit to one way of being...Thats what religious zealots and others want you to believe it is. Life is a series of choices and decisions that ultimately do or dont lead to contentment. But whatever, like you said, believe what you want to believe to make yourself feel better...whatever it takes to get by. We obviously have different life philosophies so I can respectfully agree to disagree.
Im just choosing to acknowledge the truth that you, I or anyone else can be whatever we want in life...its up to the individual to decide what they want to make of their lives. Im simply saying that that article essentially reiterated what most people have always known: a variety of genes, environmental factors and life experiences shape a person's disposition.
It effectively said so in this statement: "Most researchers now think that there is no single gay gene that controls whether a person is homosexual or not. Rather, it's the influence of multiple genes, combined with environmental influences, which ultimately determine whether a person is gay." - *they forgot to say: "...or straight" - that is, if it is a universal truth that genes are responsible for determining sexuality.
Even skin color, which is concretely determined by an identifiable set of genes isnt a determinant of a person's behavior or inclinations...rather the culture they are born into determine such. And the difference between skin genetics and any implication of sexual genetics, is that skin genetics are adaptive...genes that determine skin color mutate and successfully adapt to suit the climate/environment in which they are located. How do genes that determine sexuality adapt
My simple answer to your question is that I choose what I want to do with my life each day I wake up. Life isnt one big life or death decision to commit to one way of being...Thats what religious zealots and others want you to believe it is. Life is a series of choices and decisions that ultimately do or dont lead to contentment. But whatever, like you said, believe what you want to believe to make yourself feel better...whatever it takes to get by. We obviously have different life philosophies so I can respectfully agree to disagree.
It clearly states above,, GENES meaning genetic, not a choice but born with it. They can choose to ignore or follow through, that is their choice they must make. I am not convinced about environment playing a part in it. I have gay friends who adopted a child, that child is straight, very straight. I have gay friends whose family was so devout the lived in fear of being found out. I know it is a genetic trait , I talk to gay people everyday and when conversations arise they all say the same thing. Religious people don't want to accept that fact, it messes with their beliefs, cant have anything come in the way of that now can we. So glad I am an atheist, I don't have some sick perception ingrained in my brain. I can see people for who they are.
Yes life is a series of choices, where to live, what dog to get, school to attend,crime to commit or not, job to take, milk to buy, shirt to wear. Never had a choice on man or woman or who to love. I dated many I would thought I would love, just didn't happen. Cant choose who you love.
But you are right, we can agree to disagree. And it really shouldn't matter, but it is used against them so it does. I am in the live and let live crowd.
You realize Nea, if solytaire can be attracted to both men and women as is implied, then he/she would have no conception whatsoever of how if feels to be totally monosexual so would only see it as a choice and no big deal.
Bi's are lucky...their opportunities are twice as good
You realize Nea, if solytaire can be attracted to both men and women as is implied, then he/she would have no conception whatsoever of how if feels to be totally monosexual so would only see it as a choice and no big deal.
Bi's are lucky...their opportunities are twice as good
Yea but I dont think he/she even admitted he/she was Bi, just that someone had to buy something to get with them.lol
I just think the whole choice idea is just crap and really nonsense.
While I don't believe that your sexual preference is a choice - I do believe that you can choose to sleep with whoever you want to. For instance, I am a straight woman. However, I could choose to sleep with a woman if I wanted to. I think do think that our genes have a lot to do with it - however - as long as people accept everyone and think they should have the same rights - I don't really care if they think it is a choice or not.
It clearly states above,, GENES meaning genetic, not a choice but born with it. They can choose to ignore or follow through, that is their choice they must make. I am not convinced about environment playing a part in it. I have gay friends who adopted a child, that child is straight, very straight. I have gay friends whose family was so devout the lived in fear of being found out.
In my case I tried to be clear that when I said environment I did not mean just parents. I think people, particularly parents, often overestimate how influential a parent is. I think a child's environment includes many things. Their siblings, their peers, the overall culture, and non-human elements. (Food, plastics, prescription drugs, industrial chemicals, head injuries, maybe even events in the womb)
Also I think it's plausible that multiple things may cause homosexuality. Perhaps some homosexuals are that way purely because of genetics and for others it's multiple factors. Not a great example, but there is a genetic condition that can cause obesity yet most obese probably don't have that condition. Maybe for gays it's reverse in that it's mostly the genetic deal, but sometimes not. I think the mechanism of it all is not fully understood yet.
In my case I tried to be clear that when I said environment I did not mean just parents. I think people, particularly parents, often overestimate how influential a parent is. I think a child's environment includes many things. Their siblings, their peers, the overall culture, and non-human elements. (Food, plastics, prescription drugs, industrial chemicals, head injuries, maybe even events in the womb)
Also I think it's plausible that multiple things may cause homosexuality. Perhaps some homosexuals are that way purely because of genetics and for others it's multiple factors. Not a great example, but there is a genetic condition that can cause obesity yet most obese probably don't have that condition. Maybe for gays it's reverse in that it's mostly the genetic deal, but sometimes not. I think the mechanism of it all is not fully understood yet.
I would agree with you. All of my friends that are gay have been that way for as long as they can remember. However, I have heard of some lesbians who were molested as children and don't know if they were gay or straight before. I think being molested by a man would be enough to turn me off to men forever. And I don't mean to be sexist or offensive - but I feel like (judging from how most of my female friends and I feel) a straight or slightly bisexual woman can feel intamacy with another woman much easier than a straight man could feel with another man. While I could imagine what it would be like with another woman - I know my husband couldn't fathom being with another man.
So - my point is that just because it might be genetic for most - it doesn't rule out other factors coming into play for others. Since it is impossible for us to ever be in someone else's mind and know exactly what is going on - there are many things we many never know the answers to!
25They exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator—who is forever praised. Amen.
they exchanged the truth about god’s love (god is love) for a lie and worshipped powers and principalities
26Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts.
god gave them over to shameful lusts, the things that serve those powers and principalities(the things that jesus said we were to battle against).
26 Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones.
even their women out of lust exchanged relations that bore no fruit of the spirit…………….which is what those things that are natural of god do.
27In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another.
in the same way the me out of lust abandoned those relations that bore the fruit of the spirit for those that did not and were without peace.
27Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion.
by the indecency of these lustful acts they received the due penalty………………self hatred and self loathing…………….the fruits of any acts that come against that spirit thru which they were created. self hatred is the antithesis of the 2nd commandment.
again homosexuals do not bond thru lust but instead thru mutual love, affection, devotion, trust, respect, and attraction for a shared committed life together.
surely anyone who is given over to lust( hold it up as something of primary importance in their lives) would automatically supplant the things that are good in their lives and would be found wanting in sectors of society compared to those that did not. they would be less a father, friend, teacher, counselor, pastor, administrator, neighbor brother etc. homosexuals have never been found wanting compared to heterosexuals.
your turn
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Listen up.....How many gay people do you personally know besides the closeted preacher types like Ted Haggard?????
I've been with my partner 27 plus years now....CASE CLOSED!!!!
In the Gospels marriage is only spoken of in terms of a man and woman. Christ's view of sex is in some respects more austere than Judaism of his time or today. In part this might be to emphasize humility, but in part it is possible there is a real concern that sexual thoughts or fantasies themselves can turn harmful. (If a married person is constantly fantasizing about a specific woman or man, one they are not married to, I think this could become problematic)
In most cases in the New Testament homosexuality is mentioned along with a litany of other sins. As I recall these often include theft and fornication.
The procreation element is certainly a part of it. However in denominations like mine the interdependence and complementary nature of the sexes is also seen as very important. Homosexuality does not bind you to "the other sex" but instead binds you to someone with the same organs and chromosomes as yourself. The weaknesses inherent in male, that are not in female, are therefore not compensated in such a relationship. The same is true of the female to the female.
Now there are some celibate homosexual Catholics, like Eve Tushnet I think, who seem to be leaning toward the idea that it is the complementarity that really matters. If a homosexual is willing to become "the other sex", as in get the operation, than they could have a properly complementary relationship with someone of their own chromosome sex. Therefore what matters, in this view, is the gender rather than the sex. If you are a gay Catholic man you could therefore be non-celibate as a woman because as a woman you can be some man's wife. (As marriage is husband and wife, it's hard to get around that in the NT IMO) Likewise a lesbian could become a man and be some lucky lady's hubby. (I don't know if Eve has consulted with her priest on whether this is kosher, I think she was raised Jewish oddly enough, or if she's subtly saying she is considering becoming a dude) This is similar to the teaching of Shi'ite Islam. It's entered my mind that possibly when Ahmadenijad said "there are no gays in my country" he was thinking of this because in Iran gays are encouraged to get gender-reassigment surgery so they can be "heterosexuals." (Really, there was a documentary on this even) And that's all very interesting, if odd, except that so far as I know Catholic teaching is not like Shi'ite teaching on this so does not allow for sex/gender changes of that kind.
Your post just blows me away...your profile says you are celibate(bi)....good for you. However I as a gay male can assure you I have NO DESIRE to lose my jewels nor my willy.....it does not work that way.....people who feel that way are TRANSGENDERED. HENCE the "T" in LGBT. There are many variations of sexuality/gender depending on chromosome combinations...not just two.
I agree that homosexuality is no a sin greater than any other. No greater sin than unmarried sex or sex with someone married to another or stealing or lying. But it is sin.
So is eating shellfish by your way of "thinking"......we fellow sinners now welcome you to our little group...
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