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The OP presents us with a simpleton's view of prayer in which God is like a vending machine, dispensing goodies for the minimal effort of inserting a token prayer. If I stayed at this 4-year-old understanding of religion I also would have given it up long ago.
Prayer doesn't "work" the way poetry doesn't "work" in a utilitarian way. Prayer is poetry of the soul. I can't live without poetry. No wonder in our society we've slashed funding for art and music in our schools, and the classics/humanities in universities. People don't value the things that don't produce utilitarian "results." To me that's what hell must look like, a place where everything is reduced to its material value.
Tell me how the Lord's Prayer or the Prayer of St. Francis is supposed to "work"? Prayer is simply a communication from the created to the creator, it need not be so goal-oriented as the OP makes it out to be.
So what exactly is excluded in the "And if you ask for anything in my Name I shall do it" (John 14:14)
Please back up with texts and proof you know better.
Your idea of a method of communication is merely a spin to explain away why prayer does not work.
I am not Christian. I am Muslim our view of Allaah(swt) differs from that of how the Christians see him. We do not pray to a benevolent old man sitting on a cloud. We do not see Allaah(swt) as being comparable to humans. His attributes are beyond our under standing.
We see life as being a test and a learning. All people are subject to the laws of nature and physics. This is a physical world with physical limitations. Our prayers are to Praise Allaah(swt), We pray for forgiveness and mercy. We pray to Give thanks for our opportunity to have this test called life and to ask for comfort in times of sorrow. We also pray for the strength to face our trials and for guidance in following the right choices.
What would be your purpose in typing a statement so obnoxious?
I'm sorry, but you simply cannot be ignorant enough to really believe that Christians see God as a benevelent old man sitting on a cloud. Your last sentence, underlined, is exactly how Christians view God. Yes, I realize you might not always get that impression from reading some C-D posters who seem to have the inside scoop on what God thinks and is gonna do next, but stooping to the same level of idiocy is not the answer.
What would be your purpose in typing a statement so obnoxious?
I'm sorry, but you simply cannot be ignorant enough to really believe that Christians see God as a benevelent old man sitting on a cloud. Your last sentence, underlined, is exactly how Christians view God. Yes, I realize you might not always get that impression from reading some C-D posters who seem to have the inside scoop on what God thinks and is gonna do next, but stooping to the same level of idiocy is not the answer.
I agree. I let my feelings post and not my logic.
I was thinking only in terms of one or 2 members here and really do understand those 1 or 2 do not represent Christianity.
The OP presents us with a simpleton's view of prayer in which God is like a vending machine, dispensing goodies for the minimal effort of inserting a token prayer.
But with a vending machine you usually get a drink or a candy bar in return. Prayers work like a slot machine set to never pay off.
The OP wasn't addressing prayer as a method of "communication from the created to the creator". He was explaining why using "answered prayers" (i.e. prayers that are goal-oriented) as evidence of God is inescapably flawed and, therefore, unconvincing. In his post, he makes no commentary on the type of prayer you describe.
Exactly! I could not have said it better myself.
I was not talking about whatever serenity or peace or connectedness prayer gives you. I was saying as the title of the thread suggests that "answered prayers" will never be convincing evidence.
But with a vending machine you usually get a drink or a candy bar in return. Prayers work like a slot machine set to never pay off.
I see prayers as being exactly like a Vending Machine. There is no random gambling for a pay off. Each and every prayer does deliver. Not only deliver, we get more than what we ask for. But we must remember, what we are buying from that vending machine, may not always be what we want. It will always be what we need.
[SIZE=5]I asked... Allah Ta'ala gave me...[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]I asked for Strength.....[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]And Allah Ta'ala gave me Difficulties to make me strong.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]I asked for Wisdom....[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]And Allah Ta'ala gave me Problems to solve.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]I asked for Prosperity....[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]And Allah Ta'ala gave me the Brain and Brawn to work.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]I asked for Courage....[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]And Allah Ta'ala gave me Danger to overcome.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]I asked for Love....[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]And Allah Ta'ala gave me Troubled people to help.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]I asked for Favours....[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]And Allah Ta'ala gave me Opportunities.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]I received nothing I wanted....[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]But I received everything I needed![/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]"FATABAARAKA ALLAAHO AHSANO-L-KHAALIQEEN"[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]"So blessed be Allah, The Good, The Best to create" (Al Qur'an - 23:14)[/SIZE]
I was not talking about whatever serenity or peace or connectedness prayer gives you. I was saying as the title of the thread suggests that "answered prayers" will never be convincing evidence.
When we are told .."ask and thou will recieve" it is not meant to mean a new car, job, perfect health, healing , good looking babe...ect ect ect..
These represent the material, correct ?............woe
"Recieve" the grace for courage (fortitude) in virtue to live or endure life... as life.. is what it is.
You should really know what your talking about before you wind up with your illogical & uneducated non-sense.. BTW...God & "JESUS" know that courage is what really defines individuality to be progressive.....(oh better list...positive, hope, assistance regardless of danger... stability ...GUTS...
Good luck to those who do not realize courage-fortitude is an attribute and do nothing but whine about it !!!
You should really know what your talking about before you wind up with your illogical & uneducated non-sense.. BTW...God & "JESUS" know that courage is what really defines individuality to be progressive.....(oh better list...positive, hope, assistance regardless of danger... stability ...GUTS...
Good luck to those who do not realize courage-fortitude is an attribute and do nothing but whine about it !!!
Wow...You need to learn some manners. That is uncalled for.
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I could not have said it better myself. 
