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We would not think anything of the ability to "magically" know the height of a structure without directly measuring it (using the LEARNED discipline of Trigonometry in mathematics). But we routinely pooh-poo "magically" knowing the existence of God through the LEARNED discipline of meditation.
Ah come on,Mystic.
You're even smart enough to write your own rebuttal to that one!
Not new agey at all, it has been around for 40 years of my life.
I snipped this because "New Age" has been around about 40 years. There was even a "New Age Journal" founded in 1974. Granted that's 37 years ago, not 40, but it means this statement isn't contradicting what I said much.
Especially as by "New Agey" I mean both "New Age" itself as well as the similar movements that led to it. Alice Bailey wrote Discipleship in the New Age in 1944. The 1870s Theosophists were kind of the start of the "New Age Movement" in a way and one of the founding members, Madame Blavatsky, used the term "New Age."
I don't want to give the wrong impression though. I'm not one of those Fundamentalists, or any kind of Fundamentalist, obsessed with "New Age conspiracies." At times I think "New Age" has a positive aspect in that it represents a desire, even among the irreligious, for things Metaphysical Naturalism can't really provide. And a groping attempt at a mystical union with something greater than the self. Still I also think it tends to come with a bit of hokum and moral vagueness too.
In short I simply am entirely unaware of any evidence at all supporting the claims of mental powers or fortune telling, but I am more than aware of the tricks and methodologies used by people who claim abilities in those fields.
So... why do you think the US, China and USSR sunk all that money into remote viewing programs?
Why do you think there are still psychics on the police payroll?
Why do you think that kings and rulers from the dawn of time have relied on sooth-sayers and mystics to 'advise' them?
Why do you believe that the Chinese and other cultures have the strange(to you) idea of fortune telling.
Do you honestly think that science of the mind is so far advanced now that you know how the mind works and that there is no connection to the collective intelligence as one of your colleagues from a past era postulated?
Theories of a multidimensional universe are currently popular and if these are correct, then it is likely that we have other senses which may be vestigal, which allow us to operate within these realms and about which your mind science is only taking its baby steps. Alistair Crowley and other secret societies and religions have always maintained that the universe was larger than science believes and they believe the mind is the way to unlock the door to these other places.
I cannot help thinking that our training in logical and analytical thinking is probably a disadvantage to our development towards a more complete multidimensional entity.
I snipped this because "New Age" has been around about 40 years. There was even a "New Age Journal" founded in 1974. Granted that's 37 years ago, not 40, but it means this statement isn't contradicting what I said much.
Especially as by "New Agey" I mean both "New Age" itself as well as the similar movements that led to it. Alice Bailey wrote Discipleship in the New Age in 1944. The 1870s Theosophists were kind of the start of the "New Age Movement" in a way and one of the founding members, Madame Blavatsky, used the term "New Age."
I don't want to give the wrong impression though. I'm not one of those Fundamentalists, or any kind of Fundamentalist, obsessed with "New Age conspiracies." At times I think "New Age" has a positive aspect in that it represents a desire, even among the irreligious, for things Metaphysical Naturalism can't really provide. And a groping attempt at a mystical union with something greater than the self. Still I also think it tends to come with a bit of hokum and moral vagueness too.
I know.
Here even the churches called each other new age when they dared to be different. The one I remember was the "soaking" where folk listened to gentle gospel music to meditate and "hear god's voice" All I heard was the music.
My belief that telepathy may exist is based on many occasions where I have either my wife answer a question I was forming in my mind in period of silence
That would be pretty lame evidence for telepathy if you were to present it in any forum of note whatsoever. At best it is evidence of coincidence. That people we live with sometimes coincidentally have the same thoughts on their mind as we ourselves do is also nothing amazing. It happens all the time.
It also happens to us with things like.... we think about someone intensely and then suddenly that very person just happens to phone us.
The issue is we are a pattern seeking animal and we do not notice the times where such patterns do NOT fit as well as we do when they DO fit. I think about people all the time. They pop into my head for no reason. We all do this. So if 1000 people go through our head a month and 2 of them happen to ring us we only notice the 2. Our minds do not notice the 998 that did not fit the "pattern" we want to see.
You notice when your wife answers a question in your head. We ask ourselves questions all the time. You do not notice the 9999 times she fails to answer a question in your head.
It is a good thing that we are a pattern seeking animal. We would not be the civilization we are today if we were not. That same good thing can become a bad thing when we let it delude ourselves however.
So woo it is. Fascinating it also is however. Evidence for telepathy however it really is not.
So... why do you think the US, China and USSR sunk all that money into remote viewing programs?
Why wouldn't they? Politicians are people too you know. They have not got some magical immunity to woo, lies and charlatans. They can be conned into lending things credence just as much as the man in the street can. Such programs are not evidence that telepathy exists. Such programs are evidence that our people in power are just as liable to fall for woo as everyone else is.
You would do well to denude yourself of any idea that politicians are above such error just because they are politicians. They are people like the rest of us.
The same goes for the police force, or any other people you have listed.
There simply is no evidence on offer, much less by you, that such things exist. Showing that some people have put time and money into them does not constitute evidence they exist either. People put immense amounts of time and money into alchemy too for example. Where did that get them.
That would be pretty lame evidence for telepathy if you were to present it in any forum of note whatsoever.
So woo it is. Fascinating it also is however. Evidence for telepathy however it really is not.
Of course it does not hold as evidence except anecdotal. The fact that it happens randomly suggest that with a controlled environment, one would not be able to repeat anything as the cognitive side of our brains would be in the foreground.
I would say that the fact that it happens randomly suggests it is just random. No more. No less. To suggest that the randomness is suggestive that the cognitive side of the brain is somehow interfering with psychic powers is a non-sequitur, and worse actually assumes the conclusion before the premise... you are assuming based on nothing that there is telepathy and then you are assuming based on nothing that experiments to discover it actually interfere with the conclusion you want to find.
Put in less scientific terms: You are establishing cop out excuses even before engaging in the experiment. You give the impression you want one conclusion, and so you are pre-excusing anything that will fail to support your premise.
By random, I mean I do not willfully do this. I may be watching a TV program or surfing the net when it happens. I multitask so there are too many variables. Thinking something I want to discuss and my wife says what did you say or what do you mean and I then reply I said nothing but was thinking it suggests to me something is happening.
I have quizzed both my wife and son regarding this "connection" and they too have experienced it in their own way sometimes with me and other times with other folk.
This is what I mean random and not cognitive.
Of course you are correct that there are thoughts that do nothing and we forget those as interaction was missing to make it memorable. We are dealing with the subconscious and likely the parts of our brains responsible for dreams which as you know can be vivid to bizarre. I am positive that dreams that seem to last a long time actually are very short and in my case, the ones I remember, happen in the transition of waking up.
I sometimes have recurring dreams, ones I had forgotten of and yet the memories of them are still there somewhere. Then I remember having them before.
Having watched my dad fade away with Alzheimer's, his last days took him full cycle back to his youth as far as memories were concerned. At the end he was calling out out his mother and we his immediate family he no longer knew. In his conscious moments he would sometimes tell us of stuff he and his brothers did as kids as if it had just happened a day or so ago. He had forgotten who my mother was and my wife and I with our kids and we were the ones he had had contact with for the last 10 years of his life the most.
Maybe I am connecting dots where there are none but it is hard for me to simply dismiss these observations as mere coincidence. I do not think that there is any major scientific discovery waiting to happen on my experiences and observations but IMO there is something we do not know fully yet. For me this is a grey area and enjoy my musing on the subject.
The fact that folk can be made to believe something merely by the power of suggestion or hypnosis tells me we have the ability to influence the way folk think, I am sure you cannot deny that.
I am merely taking this and examining the what if this is possible, what else is possible?
How does one explain premonitions? Do we have a sixth sense that is not developed?
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The one I remember was the "soaking" where folk listened to gentle gospel music to meditate and "hear god's voice" All I heard was the music.
