Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Okay, Hueff, you as atheist is only one thing in you, but for the rest of your cosmic worldview or non-worldview, you are in possession of lots of sufficiencies not deficiencies.
What are then the similarities between if any your cosmic worldview or non-worldview as atheist aside of course from your deficiency in regard to belief in God, gods, goddesses, deities, divinities, etc., and the cosmic worldview from yours truly, see page 1 post #1.
Now, tell me, is not you as a conscious being substantially equivalent to the whole universe, so that if the universe were reduced to you in size, it is still the universe we have now even though the size is only limited to your quantity.
Can you get that?
Okay, you tell me that you are not equivalent to the universe, so that if the universe were reduced to your size in quantity, it is no longer the universe.
Your thinking here is indicative of a most self-delimited way of thinking.
Think more.
What?!? If what I am about to say does not adequately respond to your post it is not because I am avoiding, evading, or copping out; it is because I have no idea what you are talking about.
If the universe were reduced to my size, it would still be the universe; it once was my size a few microseconds after the Big Bang.
I am a not the universe, not because the universe is bigger in size, but because I am only a part of the universe, I am not the whole universe. Think about all of the atoms scattered about the vastness of space, I am just a handful of atoms that are organized for a few trips around the sun. After I die, my atoms will disperse, and I will be no more, but the universe will continue.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryrge
I am going to say something again that will annoy atheists.
That is the trouble with atheists they cannot think in super grand scales, because they are so humble unlike the rest of mankind so arrogant, that as one of them, a thinker of ancient times puts it, man is the measure of all things, and another one of much more recent history tells us to see the universe in a grain of sand.
Just the opposite, atheists do think is super grand scales. Many of us have an interest in astrophysics, and one must think in super grand scales to begin to entertain astrophysics. I am familiar with the quote, "man is the measure of all things", and it might apply to some atheists, you'd have to ask them, but it does not apply to me. For me, nature is the measure of all things; here nature includes everything in the universe, including life, laws of nature, forces of nature, matter/energy, space/time, etc; from a grain of sand to the entire cosmos.
What are then the similarities between if any your cosmic worldview or non-worldview as atheist aside of course from your deficiency in regard to belief in God, gods, goddesses, deities, divinities, etc., and the cosmic worldview from yours truly, see page 1 post #1.
I object that you call my non-belief in god a deficiency. It is an asset. A deficiency conveys the idea that I lack something important that I am not whole, that I have a gaping void in an area that should be filled. You may believe that, but you have got to learn to be nice and respectful, because I will not allow you to abuse me through your language. At one time I thought you were sincere. I gave you a lot of benefit of the doubt that most of my fellow atheists would not give you. But, I am beginning to see that all you do is insult and insult, whether it is purposefully, or you are obvious to how offensive you are I can not yet tell, but I won't stand for it anymore. It would be a shame for you to burn a bridge with me, when I am one of the few people who did not immediately dismiss you as a troll.
The universe transcends me; it surpasses me; it is superior to me; it is greater than me. Most of your post number 1 is about god, of which I have nothing to say, other than I don't believe there is one.
No, but else they don't have a good reason to live or they don't have any reason to live, and therefore they are leading a life without any good or any reason at all to live, even though they want to live to stay alive.
That they still want to live is indicative of their transcendental need to exist and to live.
And that is the first premise in regard to the universe of existence, and in regard to living things, and in regard to conscious intelligent living things like humans.
There is a transcendental need for man to exist and to live, even though he does not know it or he does not admit it, because otherwise why is man still continuing in life and want to continue in life, even though he claims to not have any reason to live?
If he continues in life without any reason for continuing, then he is continuing in a worthless life, according to the dictum, the unexamined life is not worth living.
Now, with non-human living things not equipped with the kind of intelligence and options available to man, that is understandable because they don't have the moral resources of man, namely, moral resources here understood as mind and will.
In regard to my impression that atheists talk past people who want to really sincerely have a conversation with them on issues of millennial concerns to man, forgive me, but what I get is that they engage in cop-outs.
Okay? Not okay?
Ryrge
I think that the urge to live is a reason to live, and because there is no individual incentive to die when one has the urge to live, living is infinitely better than not living.
To me, this does make dying sound depressing, until I realize that the deceased no longer have the will to live so they are not losing anything.
The two paragraphs above though are only a half open window into my thoughts. I have an urge for ultimate truth, and oddly enough, have always found it in my agnosticism. I am entirely certain that I am not sure what happens after death, and anyone who disagrees with this denies that there is even one trillionth of a chance of something other than what one thinks will occur after death happening after death. My knowledge of one ultimate truth, however small it is, makes me content. It's my resting spot, for when seeking truth isn't enough, for when I need to know now.
There are various creation stories which end in telling the reader that they may not be true, including the following Hindu creation story: Spirituality, Hinduism, Hindu Concept of Creation of the Universe
but atheism goes even further than that, simply stating that there is no God and being no more specific. I'm almost as comfortable with that as with agnosticism. Deism is almost as good. A belief in theism would be pleasant too, just so long as it isn't limited to Gods of known religions or who can necessarily hear prayers.
Please don't go into accusations of insult from me, that is no way to get to my ideas.
Now, Hueff, you have gone into the direction that I am insulting you, that is not going to help you get my thoughts.
But one thing I can credit you for is that you are not moving to have this thread dumped, i.e., have it locked up or closed down, so that no one can send his thoughts to the thread anymore to share with other people, specially readers.
We can both each talk and talk and talk without ever coming to a consensus on anything, because we are not concentrated on very keen and deep and transcendental thinking, but we are each insisting on our words being the ones to be open to the public.
I admit that is unavoidable but unconscious from my part, but from your part, do you examine your heart and mind, unavoidable but unconscious or heaven forbid not unconscious but deliberated and premeditated and thus pursued come what may, as long as you achieve your purpose to have only your words in public?
Anyway, we can start again from square one, both trying our best respectively to attend to ideas and to not ever bring up any complaint about one or the other insulting the other.
What do you say, shall we resolve mutually to abstain from any mention of lack of respect or even insult from the part of the other?
Just that if you do have any complaint of insult from anyone here relay your complaint to the authorities.
What do you say, shall we start anew with sincere genuine true concentrated and deep attention to ideas instead of as I said hurling accusation of insult from the other?
What do you say, shall we start anew with sincere genuine true concentrated and deep attention to ideas instead of as I said hurling accusation of insult from the other?
What is the point? You seem unable to engage in any dialogue. Your's is a monologue. For that we have blogs to write to and there you can moderate the comments as you see fit.
You do have a transcendental perspective to life and the universe, but not of God.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clintone
I think that the urge to live is a reason to live, and because there is no individual incentive to die when one has the urge to live, living is infinitely better than not living.
To me, this does make dying sound depressing, until I realize that the deceased no longer have the will to live so they are not losing anything.
The two paragraphs above though are only a half open window into my thoughts. I have an urge for ultimate truth, and oddly enough, have always found it in my agnosticism. I am entirely certain that I am not sure what happens after death, and anyone who disagrees with this denies that there is even one trillionth of a chance of something other than what one thinks will occur after death happening after death. My knowledge of one ultimate truth, however small it is, makes me content. It's my resting spot, for when seeking truth isn't enough, for when I need to know now.
There are various creation stories which end in telling the reader that they may not be true, including the following Hindu creation story: Spirituality, Hinduism, Hindu Concept of Creation of the Universe
but atheism goes even further than that, simply stating that there is no God and being no more specific. I'm almost as comfortable with that as with agnosticism. Deism is almost as good. A belief in theism would be pleasant too, just so long as it isn't limited to Gods of known religions or who can necessarily hear prayers.
But the above are poor reasons for living compared to the one below posted by Ashville Native earlier on this forum.
You do have a transcendental perspective to life and the universe, but not of God.
Not into proselytizing, unless trying to get people to see my thoughts is proselytizing, in which case no one must talk at all in this forum, but just make grunts and display scowls.
Here is my idea of God in His fundamental concept in relation to the universe where we reside in and are part and parcel of:
Maker of everything that is not God Himself.
Now, tell me what part of that concept of God do you find so unpleasant that you are allergic to God as to experience even death suffocation?
I dont think you religious people get how little time us athiests spend worrying about religion, you could probably count the minutes on one hand as to the time spent in a year that we give to religion
You want a world view from this athiest?
Live long and prosper
You do have a transcendental perspective to life and the universe, but not of God.
Not into proselytizing, unless trying to get people to see my thoughts is proselytizing, in which case no one must talk at all in this forum, but just make grunts and display scowls.
Here is my idea of God in His fundamental concept in relation to the universe where we reside in and are part and parcel of:
Maker of everything that is not God Himself.
Now, tell me what part of that concept of God do you find so unpleasant that you are allergic to God as to experience even death suffocation?
Ryrge
Did I not say that theism and deism would be almost as pleasing for me to believe in as atheism? I love the idea of God. I merely despise the idea of believing there's a God who may not exist.
What do you say, shall we start anew with sincere genuine true concentrated and deep attention to ideas instead of as I said hurling accusation of insult from the other?
Although it seems like a reasonable request, do you not see that it is unfair. If I agreed to it, that would give you a license to insult me and everyone else in this thread as much as you want and I could not protest or say one thing about it. I'm sorry, but I will not do that.
How about you be more careful not to insult others?
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Please don't go into accusations of insult from me, that is no way to get to my ideas.
