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Old 08-04-2011, 07:21 PM
 
Location: Sierra Nevada Land, CA
7,961 posts, read 8,540,449 times
Reputation: 11751

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...but call themselves Christians or followers of Jesus.

What is/are the source(s) that you go by? Trust? Get your information?

Urantia? Stuff by Spiritualists? Other?

Just curious as I've noted in various threads that some folk who claim to be Christian or followers of Jesus don't seem to trust the Bible. As for me I do. I have read most of the Major Translations and found they basically all agree on everything important, but use differing words to state the same concept. To be sure, nitpickers will point out the minor nuances-true that. But really.....

Me: if a point of theology is not supported by what is written in the Bible I have to question whether it is Truth. (and for the doubters-I do think for myself. My position is a result of years of study. Studying other religions and various cults. Using critical thinking. Putting the Bible to the test. Listening to atheists.)

Discuss!
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Old 08-04-2011, 09:23 PM
 
1,531 posts, read 977,596 times
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...people that read and believe the truth is in only 'one book', whether it be the bible, the koran the torah....etc. scare the livin' daylights out of me...!!
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Old 08-04-2011, 10:02 PM
 
Location: Salt Lake City
21,299 posts, read 20,979,546 times
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My belief is that we should be willing to accept truth wherever we may find it. That definitely doesn't mean that I don't trust the Bible, though.
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Old 08-04-2011, 10:03 PM
 
Location: SC Foothills
8,830 posts, read 9,770,263 times
Reputation: 58199
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr5150 View Post
...but call themselves Christians or followers of Jesus.

What is/are the source(s) that you go by? Trust? Get your information?

Urantia? Stuff by Spiritualists? Other?

Just curious as I've noted in various threads that some folk who claim to be Christian or followers of Jesus don't seem to trust the Bible. As for me I do. I have read most of the Major Translations and found they basically all agree on everything important, but use differing words to state the same concept. To be sure, nitpickers will point out the minor nuances-true that. But really.....

Me: if a point of theology is not supported by what is written in the Bible I have to question whether it is Truth. (and for the doubters-I do think for myself. My position is a result of years of study. Studying other religions and various cults. Using critical thinking. Putting the Bible to the test. Listening to atheists.)

Discuss!
It's in me, it's in all of us already. We just have to tap into it, it's living waters, it's divine love. No, I'm not a spiritualist and I don't "channel", it's what is written in our hearts from the beginning. Says so in the Bible dude.
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Old 08-04-2011, 10:14 PM
 
77 posts, read 46,943 times
Reputation: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr5150 View Post
...but call themselves Christians or followers of Jesus.

What is/are the source(s) that you go by? Trust? Get your information?

Urantia? Stuff by Spiritualists? Other?

Just curious as I've noted in various threads that some folk who claim to be Christian or followers of Jesus don't seem to trust the Bible. As for me I do. I have read most of the Major Translations and found they basically all agree on everything important, but use differing words to state the same concept. To be sure, nitpickers will point out the minor nuances-true that. But really.....

Me: if a point of theology is not supported by what is written in the Bible I have to question whether it is Truth. (and for the doubters-I do think for myself. My position is a result of years of study. Studying other religions and various cults. Using critical thinking. Putting the Bible to the test. Listening to atheists.)

Discuss!
It depends on what part of the bible your talking about. New Testament I don't find too much fault with. Old testament, too many contradictions and too much nonsense to have much faith in it.
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Old 08-05-2011, 03:24 AM
 
Location: Indianapolis
4,325 posts, read 5,142,693 times
Reputation: 666
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr5150 View Post
...but call themselves Christians or followers of Jesus.

What is/are the source(s) that you go by? Trust? Get your information?

Urantia? Stuff by Spiritualists? Other?

Just curious as I've noted in various threads that some folk who claim to be Christian or followers of Jesus don't seem to trust the Bible. As for me I do. I have read most of the Major Translations and found they basically all agree on everything important, but use differing words to state the same concept. To be sure, nitpickers will point out the minor nuances-true that. But really.....

Me: if a point of theology is not supported by what is written in the Bible I have to question whether it is Truth. (and for the doubters-I do think for myself. My position is a result of years of study. Studying other religions and various cults. Using critical thinking. Putting the Bible to the test. Listening to atheists.)

Discuss!
Our paths are our own. It really doesn't matter how we return to Love. The important thing is that we do because Love is who we are. The bible is just one of many paths. It's just that most christians have been conditioned to believe that the bible is the only truth.
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Old 08-05-2011, 04:09 AM
 
Location: Florida
18,371 posts, read 18,655,446 times
Reputation: 21099
[quote=Ilene Wright;20323021]It's in me, it's in all of us already. We just have to tap into it, it's living waters, it's divine love. No, I'm not a spiritualist and I don't "channel", it's what is written in our hearts from the beginning. Says so in the Bible dude.[/quote]

This points out the absurdity of the whole thing.
Almost everyone (with the exception of channelers and the like)of those in the lengthy thread on the other board refers to what is written in the Bible to prove it isnt needed.
Whether they read it themselves or listened to someone else that had read it, that is where they learned what they know to decide to become, or to remain, a Christian.....a follower of Jesus Christ as found in the NT.
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Old 08-05-2011, 04:39 AM
 
Location: South Africa
5,563 posts, read 6,164,033 times
Reputation: 1785
Default How can you trust what is false?

Mr 1550, simply cross referencing the bible in multiple translations is nothing but seeing that certain sects use different words to appease certain agendas.

Let us break down some milestones in the bible using simple reasoning skills.

Creation of man.

We have the creation event and certain things like Abel getting his skull bashed in. We have hordes of fossils yet we have no fossil of a guy with a bashed in skull (as the legend goes) coming from a garden of Eden. Taking that the bible is based off texts no older than 4500 years old, It happened in the ME, where the A&E fossils?

The Flood

Based on the bible, there was a ww flood and suggests all animals made it onto the boat for a period of a year. That is physically impossible. Plus the pyramids were under construction when it was alleged to have happened.

The rainbow was not a covenant from god as we all now know what causes light refraction. Light refraction has always been. Possibly no one questioned it as they may not be as frequent in the ME as other places where thunderstorms are more prevalent (rainbows in Cairo)



The Exodus

It never happened. No records of Hebrew slaves by the Egyptians or a drowned Pharaoh.

Now if exodus never happened, then where did Moses and all the commandments come from?

There does not seem to be any evidence of any 40 year trek through the desert from Egypt to Israel. The map shows a 600km as the crow flies distance between Cairo and Jerusalem and that is not a big problem to determine a favorable route via oasis and watering holes yet there is nothing to suggest what the bible does of millions of folk moving out to the East. It is also very plausible that there was anyway normal human traffic in those days.

These three key factors that cannot be backed up by any archeological digs or finds suggest that they never happened.

The entire xian doctrine is based on and includes this as paramount milestones. Now if they never happened as claimed, how do you even take a leap of faith that they did? To do that you have to ignore the lack of evidence.

We have a questionable shroud of Turin and nothing of the other key events.

The Ark of the covenant just disappeared never to be seen again when the bible claims it had supernatural powers and would kill those that dared touch it if they were not Levite Priests. How ever did they get it out of the Temple when it was destroyed?

It then becomes self evident that the OT of the bible is embellished folklore at best.

With those out of the way, you are left with the claims of the NT and those have been thoroughly discounted as man-made, fiddled and in some cases outright lies.

The Jesus story parallels many earlier pagan man-god concepts and seeing the folk responsible for your canon were the custodians of the ancient pagan gods, it is hard not to put two and two together to see how this man-made religion came about.

You are not going to find any clues to this in your pastor's office or in the bible. You have to explore outside your comfort zone.

You were taught the bible is inerrant yet it is not.

Is it reasonable to expect;

  1. 6000 yo fossils representing humans that lived to 900 years of age?
  2. Any physical evidence of a ww flood contrary to what we really know?
  3. Archeological evidence of a mass exodus as claimed?
  4. The ark of the covenant and specifically the two stone tablets.
Us "heathen" scientists would love to examine these artifacts to determine with our "evil" scientific instruments and methods to;
  1. Date the fossils and see wear and tear signs like arthritis osteoporosis etc.
  2. Doubt there will be any flood evidence
  3. Same as for 1
  4. Determine the age of etchings in stone as we already know the 2nd set Moses carved out himself. But then again, Mount Sinai is not that big and we should find the fragments of the smashed 1.0 edition?
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Old 08-05-2011, 04:54 AM
 
Location: 30-40N 90-100W
13,856 posts, read 22,309,564 times
Reputation: 6657
I wouldn't say I don't trust the Bible, but I'm not Sola Scriptura. I think I tend to feel that what flows from the Bible is Christianity. That the Church Fathers, Doctors of the Church, and the Councils do matter. So, from my perspective, Protestantism did something a bit like what Wahabbi or Salafi Islam did. It threw away centuries of wisdom, smashed shrines to saints, and focused solely on the sacred book.

Comparing elements of the Reformation to Wahabbism or Salafism is, I grant, kind of insulting. However two things having parallels doesn't mean the results or even ideology is that similar. Also the original Salafism of the nineteenth century was fairly moderate and humane. Many of them, like Muhammad Abduh, focused on a religion solely based on those interpretations of the Qur'an that would do the most good for the most people. Modern equivalents of that would be Muslims who want to "sweep away" customs like female circumcision or honor-killing as non-Qur'anic and immoral.
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Old 08-05-2011, 08:30 AM
Status: "Even better than okay" (set 27 days ago)
 
Location: Coastal New Jersey
51,644 posts, read 50,894,234 times
Reputation: 60688
It's not a matter of not "trusting" the bible--not sure what you mean by that. If you mean it's somehow the infalilble word of God himself, no, I do not believe that at all.

You have to use your judgment and knowledge as to whether certain things are applicable, or, for example, were these rules written by a nomadic patriarchal society for their own benefit, or a prophet making a statement that fit into a certain time and place in history. Even so, sometimes you "get" some inspiration out of one of the stories that can apply to your life right here and now, but that is not taking the bible literally, either.

@Reverend1111: Our paths are our own. It really doesn't matter how we return to Love. The important thing is that we do because Love is who we are. The bible is just one of many paths.

There you go. God is found within us, not in the dimly understood version of God in words written by humans, valuable as they may sometimes be.
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