U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 09-05-2011, 01:19 PM
 
691 posts, read 396,089 times
Reputation: 96

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
Evil to many theists, including myself, is the deliberate disobedience of God(swt).
i agree, but most believers equate that with non-believers. sorry, this ALSO apllies to to many believers who either doesn't know the truth, (Rom.10:2 -For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge). or doesn't WANT to know the truth, (Pro.1:28-31 ,Then shall they call upon me, but I will not answer; they shall seek me early, but they shall not find me: For that they hated knowledge, and did not choose the fear of the LORD: They would none of my counsel: they despised all my reproof. Therefore shall they eat of the fruit of their own way, and be filled with their own devices).

God already knows where the non-believers stand,because they're NOT hiding theirs. it's many believes who either hides their sins from mankind. or live in sin,trying to justify why they do so. it's false ministers that change God's words,in order to suit themselves,(Rom.1:24,25 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves: Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen). and...

Mal.2:8,9- But ye are departed out of the way; ye have caused many to stumble at the law; ye have corrupted the covenant of Levi, saith the LORD of hosts. Therefore have I also made you contemptible and base before all the people, according as ye have not kept my ways, but have been partial in the law.

because many,believer as well as non-believer believing what they choose to believe,which isn't true. God will help them on that road,which will lead to destruction,(2Thess.2:10-12, And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness).

it's NOT only the non-believers who are called the wicked. it also refers to believers who refuse to follow ALL Jesus teachings that applies to our time. every believer on earth, KNOWS if they're really doing something wrong in Jehovah God and Jesus eyes. many are fornicating commiting adultery, living a homosexual lifestyle,etc. even if one refuse to believe it, because one thinks he's got a Heavenly calling. he's considered wicked in God's eyes. IF any of us choose to live a lifestyle NOT pleasing to God,though we call ourselves christians,we will still be seen as wicked.

it's Jesus who said we're NOT seen as his spiritual family. if we're NOT doing his Fathers will,(Matt.12:50-For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother).
peace

Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 09-05-2011, 01:46 PM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
15,511 posts, read 12,534,058 times
Reputation: 7377
Quote:
Originally Posted by jojo-50 View Post
i agree, but most believers equate that with non-believers. sorry, this ALSO apllies to to many believers who either doesn't know the truth, (Rom.10:2 -For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge). or doesn't WANT to know the truth, (Pro.1:28-31 ,Then shall they call upon me, but I will not answer; they shall seek me early, but they shall not find me: For that they hated knowledge, and did not choose the fear of the LORD: They would none of my counsel: they despised all my reproof. Therefore shall they eat of the fruit of their own way, and be filled with their own devices).

God already knows where the non-believers stand,because they're NOT hiding theirs. it's many believes who either hides their sins from mankind. or live in sin,trying to justify why they do so. it's false ministers that change God's words,in order to suit themselves,(Rom.1:24,25 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves: Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen). and...

Mal.2:8,9- But ye are departed out of the way; ye have caused many to stumble at the law; ye have corrupted the covenant of Levi, saith the LORD of hosts. Therefore have I also made you contemptible and base before all the people, according as ye have not kept my ways, but have been partial in the law.

because many,believer as well as non-believer believing what they choose to believe,which isn't true. God will help them on that road,which will lead to destruction,(2Thess.2:10-12, And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness).

it's NOT only the non-believers who are called the wicked. it also refers to believers who refuse to follow ALL Jesus teachings that applies to our time. every believer on earth, KNOWS if they're really doing something wrong in Jehovah God and Jesus eyes. many are fornicating commiting adultery, living a homosexual lifestyle,etc. even if one refuse to believe it, because one thinks he's got a Heavenly calling. he's considered wicked in God's eyes. IF any of us choose to live a lifestyle NOT pleasing to God,though we call ourselves christians,we will still be seen as wicked.

it's Jesus who said we're NOT seen as his spiritual family. if we're NOT doing his Fathers will,(Matt.12:50-For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother).
peace

I do appreciate your love of the bible and your belief in it. However, myself and others here are not adherents of the Bible. For myself I find comfort in the Qur'an.

The Qur'an and Ahadith give similar warnings to Believers and does tell us that even among us will be those who do not do the will of Allaah(swt) Not all Muslims are of the Ahl as-Sunnah Wa'l Jama'ah (saved ones)

"Awf ibn Malik reported that the Prophet (Peace be upon him) said, 'The Jews split into 71 sects: one will enter Paradise and 70 will enter Hell. The Christians split into 72 sects: 71 will enter Hell and one will enter Paradise. By Him in Whose hand is my soul, my Ummah will split into 73 sects: one will enter Paradise and 72 will enter Hell.' Someone asked, 'O Messenger of Allah (Peace be upon him), who will they be?' He replied, 'The main body of the Muslims (al-Jama'ah).' Awf ibn Malik is the only one who reported this Hadith, and its isnad is acceptable." And in another version of this Hadith the Prophet (Peace be upon him) goes onto say that the saved sect, "...Are those who follow me and my Sahaba's path" (Tirmidhi, vol. 2, pg. 89)
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-05-2011, 03:23 PM
 
2,981 posts, read 2,258,880 times
Reputation: 469
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
Evil to many theists, including myself, is the deliberate disobedience of God(swt).


That is a very limited answer and I am certain others will have a more specific answer. I am also certain others will define evil as being related to the times and circumstances.

Is there a clear concept of what determines evil, that we all agree upon?

What to you is considered to be evil?
Deception is what I consider evil; however, there are some instances where deception could be quite handy so evil is I think is in the eyes and hands of the beholders. Knowledge is not evil it is the possesser(s) that holds the emotions.

In real life I tend to go by the old rule of thumb....first do no harm etc. to avoid 'evil' doings to others.

Last edited by gabfest; 09-05-2011 at 03:43 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-05-2011, 03:30 PM
 
2,447 posts, read 2,577,151 times
Reputation: 2202
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
Evil to many theists, including myself, is the deliberate disobedience of God(swt).


That is a very limited answer and I am certain others will have a more specific answer. I am also certain others will define evil as being related to the times and circumstances.

Is there a clear concept of what determines evil, that we all agree upon?

What to you is considered to be evil?
Refusing to acknowledge civil rights for gay people, and proselytizing kids to be intolerant of diversity, culture, other religions, and people that aren't religious.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-05-2011, 03:58 PM
 
2,981 posts, read 2,258,880 times
Reputation: 469
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aganusn View Post
Refusing to acknowledge civil rights for gay people, and proselytizing kids to be intolerant of diversity, culture, other religions, and people that aren't religious.
Who's not legally acknowledging the gay's civil rights? I do not know anyone who wants that legal battle on their hands. Again who's doing this?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-05-2011, 06:50 PM
 
Location: 30-40N 90-100W
13,856 posts, read 22,260,404 times
Reputation: 6657
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aganusn View Post
Refusing to acknowledge civil rights for gay people, and proselytizing kids to be intolerant of diversity, culture, other religions, and people that aren't religious.
I understand you feel that, but surely that's just a "laundry list" (like one I did earlier) rather than getting at the nature of evil.

More directly the initial question is "how do you determine what is evil?" The list does not tell us how you determined these are evil. I would guess most of this is based in systems of fairness and harm-reduction. There's a psychologists, who I don't entirely agree with, who does place those two notions among "moral foundations."

Moral Foundations Theory Homepage
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-05-2011, 07:09 PM
 
Location: Blankity-blank!
11,449 posts, read 13,925,295 times
Reputation: 6876
What constitutes 'evil' is wholly subjective, subject to change without notice, and not applicable where prohibited by law. No money back either.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-06-2011, 12:23 AM
 
Location: Metromess
11,798 posts, read 21,366,178 times
Reputation: 5054
I don't often use such terms as 'evil' because of all the baggage that comes along with them. Visvaldis made a good point.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-06-2011, 12:35 AM
 
Location: around the way
656 posts, read 902,395 times
Reputation: 422
On my better days, I'd say evil is deliberately harming or restricting another, whether through malice or an attempt to put your needs ahead of theirs (the exception being action in defense of yourself or others). Anything else may be a result of misunderstanding, delusion, ignorance, or what have you, but it can't really be said to be evil.

On my worse days, I think that evil is a system where the top 2% of earners pay a lower tax rate than most of their employees and nobody really cares because they're too wrapped up in whatever Lady Gaga is wearing or the latest Kardashian nonsense. I end up quoting that song "We Kill Evil" by The Meat Purveyors:

You can't ignore the next door neighbor
He makes the bombs fly, he makes the planes drop
He directs the CIA
To murder, to torture

His evil is unforgivable
Our justice will be unmerciful
He won't escape the sentence we pass...

With love in our hearts (love in our hearts!)
And death on our minds (death on our minds!)
Now is the time to leave fear behind because
WE! KILL! EVIL! YEAH WE KILL EVIL!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2018, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top